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Mike Dunleavy's rigid approach meets up with Baron Davis' rogue style - Los Angeles Times

So, when Bill Plaschke writes a Clippers column two weeks into the season, is it a good thing or a bad thing? The inclusion of lines like "all that glitters is cold" would seem to indicate the latter, but that may just be my own preference for writing that doesn't suck.

Conflicts between Baron Davis and Mike Dunleavy Sr., between the improvisational point guard and the rigid coach, were much anticipated since Baron's signing was announced on July 1. Plaschke for the first time, puts some substance around the hypothesis.

There are several interesting quotes. MDsr spends some of his basketball capital by invoking Magic Johnson, whom he coached to the NBA Finals - a wise move considering Magic is one of Baron's heroes. "I talked to him a lot about Magic Johnson, and how he worked within a system to lift everyone up around him. I am convinced Baron is that same type of player."

Baron admits to some frustrations - frustrations that all of us in Clips Nation can share, as when he says: "It's like every time we come down the floor, everyone is trying to figure out the play, and by the time I get it called out and everyone knows it, there is eight seconds left on the shot clock. It takes away some of our instincts."

How many times have I written in this space about the Clippers making the first entry pass of their set with fewer than 10 seconds on the clock? It's been a big problem for the Clippers in the MDsr era.

Still, it's way too early to be overly concerned about this issue. The Clippers 1-6 start has little or nothing to do with a disconnect between the point guard and the coach and everything to do with an undermanned team playing poorly against superior opposition. If anything, I am encouraged by signs of progress in their relationship manifested in 103 points scored in the win against Dallas.

MDsr has said he'll run more this year - hopefully that's not just talk, because the personnel is well-suited to a faster pace. On the other hand, Baron has never played on a team with a low post presence, and he would indeed be wise to adjust his approach when the fast break is not available. So as Chris Kaman, the voice of reason in the column, points out, the answer is a compromise between the respective styles. I don't think this is news; nor does either party seem resistant to the idea, at least in theory.

After missing most of camp, only seven games into the season, in a new and different system, it's not surprising in the least that Baron would be part of some dysfunctional offensive possessions. Keep working on it, keep communicating, and it will improve on a daily basis.

As for the column, I'm thinking it's a good thing that Plashcke is aware of the Clippers this early in the season. Let's just hope Simers doesn't start writing about them.

Link 7 months ago Clipsnation_tiny Steve Perrin Comment 9 comments 0 recs |

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You were right ahead of me. Plaschke is nothing if not provacative. Yesterday it was Vecsey; today’s it’s Plaschke.

When I read the first few paragraphs I was outraged—he’s just rehashing this now?—but I calmed down when I saw that there was some meat on the bone, substance to the hypothesis as you say.

The problem I have is that he doesn’t integrate it into the last six weeks of the 08-09 season. The conflict is there, but there are very obvious reasons why it’s at a primitive stage. If we’re writing about this issue at ClipsNation, we would talk about the number of games BD missed in the preseason, the number of actual practices he has had and how many of those have been with the team at full strength—that is, with Camby and Kaman on the floor together—and the number of games out of those first seven that it has been true. Then add the teams that the Clippers have played.

But the other thing that you don’t hear about here is Dunleavy, who is always saying something on the sidelines, whether it’s about defense or calling plays or saying “dive!” to get guys to cut to the basket, constantly yelling “go!” in every game this season, and trying to get the Clips to run and get early offense. Didn’t mention that. Milph are doing a good job of picking it up and mentioning it, because they’re trying to defuse and smooth the waters of this potential conflict.

Add to that the idea that the primary way to run is off of rebounds (and defense), which gets us back to Kaman-Camby. Kaman-Camby is just getting started, and eventually they’re going to face teams that really don’t match up very well, and they’re going to establish some beefy rebounding margins. And that’s going to create opportunities to run and get early offense. And Dunleavy has no intention of putting the brakes on that.

It’s similar to Dunleavy’s comments on shooting the three. He was even a bit prickly, outraged that someone could even ask him whether he liked the 3 pt shot. He said something like “you’re asking me that? Really? I led the league in 3 pt. shooting. Of course I like the 3 pt shot. You just need to have guys who can make it. And now we have those guys.” End of discussion.

We all have our frustrations with Dunleavy. But when I read this article and look at his quotes, I like everything he’s saying, just the same way I liked every move he made over the tumultuous summer.

As far as BD fitting into Dunleavy’s offense goes, it’s just a matter of getting playing time and going through it. The half-court sets can run very smoothly and be very effective, but it takes time. The Clippers were very effective and played to their strengths in 05—06, especially in the playoffs. Their offense stalled a bit in the first half of 06-07 when it featured a player with poor offensive skills and the old PG was tweaked, but it got better in the 2nd half of the season, and the Clipper offense still didn’t have a diverse and highly skilled 3 pt attack. It’s going to get much better and run very smoothly soon enough, and the Clips are also going to run and hit 3s.

I would have rather seen Plaschke write about the way that the Clips just went through a sort of “preseason” against elite teams, how they got things started with a nice home win against direct competitor 2-5 Dallas, and how the next four games are crucial and could be definitive. But we can’t have everything.

by citizen zhiv on Nov 12, 2008 8:26 AM PST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Solid points

I agree that every MDsr quote in the column was well stated and justifiable. There were no red flags there – no “I’m the boss and he’ll do as I say” autocracy, and very little that even really hints at that. As I said, the Magic Johnson thing was pretty shrewd, though it would have more heft coming from Pat Riley or Magic himself.

Baron’s quotes were a little disappointing – he fed this potential controversy a little more than I would have preferred. They seemed to be in contrast to everything else he’s been saying. He was pretty effusive of his praise for MDsr’s play calling after the Dallas game. But if the worst thing that Baron says this season is “the playbook is pretty thick” then I’m cool with that.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Nov 12, 2008 9:36 AM PST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's not like

we didn’t call this early on. As Plaschke said, surely the Clippers knew what they were getting. Zhiv, I’m not sure that you can really compare this team to the 05-06 team, because that team’s strengths were based on half court sets, which fit into MDSr’s rigid play calling. To that end, the iso’s we’ve been watching have been painful. BD is who he is, and he needs to freelance to be successful and happy. Hopefully, MDSr will just let them play. Finally, BD’s going to be vocal as he’s the true leader of this team and will do what he can to get his way. MDSr’s failure to fight that natural urge of his to be defensive to me signals that BD will get his way.

This will be interesting. Hopefully they will figure out a way to win.

by Jax on Nov 12, 2008 9:59 AM PST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

From my perspective we're already run a lot more..

we just haven’t played good enough defense to do it more often. Every turnover we seem to immediatly push the ball upcourt, every rebound we’re pushing to Baron for a quick attack. The problem seems to be that if the inital push is rebuffed, we don’t have enough shot clock to run a full play and get either a really late set that is easily defended or a 1 on 3 play with a shot and no rebounding down low.
  
   We also don’t have the players that excel in that sort of offense (Warriors style), or have played it that much (Baron and Camby are the exceptions, and Thornton seems to be getting it now). With Kaman and Camby we can’t have a shot every 15 seconds and expect them to be involved in every possesion and play 35+ minutes a game. The best sign I’ve seen that other members of the team are onboard with running more is Kaman starting to beat the opposing center downcourt and cutting hard to the basket. This led to 2 or 3 easy basket opportunities down low last game, with a high chance to get a rebound if there’s a miss. Seeing Camby play I can already tell he wants to push the ball every time. Heck sometimes he brings it up himself and does entry passes to a posting player with mismatches on small gaurds.
  
     I really think its a feel thing with the team and arn’t too worried. My friend, who roots for the Cavs, noticed the other day that Kaman seems like the smartest guy on the floor for us (and noted that’s not a compliment). Kaman just seems to know the sets better, same with Paul Davis and Mobley. How many times have we seen Kaman telling people to rotate away from the ball handler for an isolation or pick and roll play. The two or three extra seconds it takes to setup these plays affect all aspects of our play right now; from preventing turn and shoot plays from our guards to getting post players immediately double teamed when they have to start a move with 4 seconds left in the shot clock. This is going to go away as soon as people become more familar in the sets.

 I’m pretty confident that we’re going to have a much more uptempo team than previous years. We just need to do it in a coordinated fashion so we’re not losing points when we switch to an uptempo offense; for example Mike Taylor has shown the tendency to go to the rim against 2-3 guys when he’s running the uptempo offense, once he figures out how to wait for some teamates he’ll have a much easier drive with the option of a kickout for 3.

by HeardYouLooking on Nov 12, 2008 11:23 AM PST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Kaman is actually pretty quick

The best way to use Kaman is to have him be a trailer and crash to the inside and have him get a pass or alley oop which will either result in a easy basket or foul. One good example of this was last game where Kaman out ran the opposing center and just kept going and BD threw an alley pass which became a dunk.

by bestclipfan on Nov 12, 2008 2:33 PM PST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Baron NEEDS structure

If you’ve followed Baron’s career like I have, then you know that while he might want complete freedom, it’s not in his best interest to give him that. As the article stated, Dunleavy believes that the system will take Baron to a new level…and I believe it too.

Everyone seems to forget that Baron didn’t start his career with Byron Scott. He started it with Paul Silas. Silas is an old school guy who has a system and runs a structured team. He’s certainly closer to Dunleavy that Don Nelson. He also kept Baron on the bench for a lot of his rookie season in favor of the veteran David Wesley. Can you imagine if that happened here? You guys would be going crazy with demands that Baron play more. Yet Baron thrived under Silas, including back-to-back triple doubles in the playoffs, the first player to do that since Magic Johnson.

After Silas left Charlotte, Baron’s career was shaky. He didn’t get along with Scott, and his first year in GSW was a mess. He was completely undisciplined and jacked up ill-advised shot after ill-advised shot. He just did whatever he wanted and the result was ugly.

Nellie changed things a bit in that he got Baron to reign in some more and become more of a leader. That’s why they had the success they had later on. But even that was tenuous as evidenced by the benching at the end of last season. Baron liked the style, and the team was suited for it, but it wasn’t going to get the most out of Baron.

I’m not saying Dunleavy is some coaching genius, but I do think that he has a plan to maximize Baron’s skills. Baron just has to understand that you can’t win in the playoffs with run and gun and freelancing. I think he does, and he’ll give Dun’s system a chance.

If the wins follow, all will be good. If they don’t, then it’ll fall apart. Just like Kaman said, it’ll either be great, or it’ll be a disaster.

by madglove on Nov 12, 2008 12:33 PM PST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good points

And I would also emphasize that the Clipper personnel, if they can stay healthy, should help Baron as well. Two guys who can rebound and defend will create more opportunities. As HeardYou (HYL) said, Camby is ready to head up the floor, and Kaman is fast enough to beat a whole lot of the big guys up and down, and he’s going to get even faster and in better shape.

Baron did it at GSW with Jason Richardson and athletic wing players. Soon enough he’s going to like throwing it into Kaman to get a quick assist, and he’ll also be creating ad hoc opportunities for him too, as we’re just starting to see.

It’s going to be great. Let’s see how it goes against a team that Kaman traditionally does very well against, while remembering that BD is going up against the guy that could have been the Clippers’ PG, Udrih.

by citizen zhiv on Nov 12, 2008 2:40 PM PST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

One point...

It’s important to note, from a realism standpoint, that we are thinking of the Clippers as a good rebounding team, and we expect them to be a good rebounding team, based mainly on Camby and Kaman… BUT… that has not manifested itself thus far. The Clippers have YET to outrebound an opponent. Fast breaks start with rebounds. If Kaman and Camby can dominate the defensive boards, it facilitates a much faster pace. But the Clippers are actually giving up a lot of second chance points instead.

Camby’s absence and limited minutes are partially to blame for overall poor numbers so far. But I would feel better if the Clippers had dominated the Rockets or the Mavs on the glass. They did not.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Nov 12, 2008 3:44 PM PST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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