Draft Day Open Thread
Draft day is already heating up, and it's still over three hours until Chicago is on the clock. We've already had two first round picks traded, and rumors (most involving the Clippers) are swirling around picks 2 through 5, which is astounding if you think about it.
Here's what Chad Ford said about the Clippers about an hour ago:
The Clippers have been trying to move up in the draft to get Mayo or Gordon. There's a chance they can pull it off if the Wolves or Sonics are willing to bet that the guy they are targeting will be available at No. 7.
If those teams are open to a deal, the Clippers are willing to trade a future first-round pick to move up.
Seems reasonable. I'm encouraged that team leadership appears to see the draft the same way I have all along - Mayo and Gordon are the class of the guards, with a break to the next group of Bayless and Westbrook. It's worth noting that ESPN's draft page includes photos of four players: Rose, Beasley, Mayo and Gordon. Unfortunately for the Clippers, the idea of Gordon falling all the way to seven, something that looked entirely possible a week ago, looks unlikely now.
If they're going to send a future-first rounder out the door, let's hope it's one of ours (lottery protected) and not the Wolves pick. We've waited three years for that Wolves pick, and there's certainly a good chance that Minny will still be bad when the protection drops off in 2011. We're halfway there - let's hang onto that one.
Charlotte picked up Denver's pick at 20 for a future first rounder. This would seem to be the Nuggets and owner Stan Kroenke worrying about the luxury tax. Denver pretty desperately needs an infusion of young talent and giving up your first rounder in a deep draft would not seem to be the way to do it. Marcus Camby is 34 years old, and guys like DeAndre Jordan, Javale McGee and Robin Lopez, flawed as they are, all are possibilities at 20. Bad move by the Nuggets.
Portland and Paul Allen are up to their old tricks, buying draft picks outright. The Blazers paid the maximum $3M for the Hornets' first rounder, number 27 in the draft. This one is a head-scratcher. Not that Paul Allen is willing to throw is Micro-bucks around - we knew that. But Portland has a MASSIVE roster crunch looming next season. They have Rudy Fernandez coming over from Spain, they have Kopenen stashed in Finland, they have Freeland stashed in England, they have extra picks already, and now they just bought another one. If they keep all these picks, all they can do is leave more guys in Europe (something that is becoming increasingly difficult as the dollar continues to fall against the Euro, forcing the good players to take a pay cut to sign a rookie-scale NBA contract) or cut guys in training camp. Which tells you that Blazers GM Kevin Pritchard has a deal in the works. He's planning to send a LOT of bodies out the door for one big asset.
Deals like the two above all was make me wonder why the Clippers don't get more active. The 'buying picks' thing is particularly interesting, and the Blazers seem to be the only team in the league willing to do it. I mean, $3M is the max, and the Hornets don't really care a lot WHO gets their pick. They'd prefer to send it to a non-threatening, non-rival, but other than that, it's just a monetary transaction. So why don't other teams do this? I could see it as a cost-saving mechanism in the long run. If you take a late first rounder at the rookie scale and give him minutes, as opposed to signing a vet, who may or may not be any help, for $2.5M per, you'll save that $3M in no time, and you may get a real gem.
Then there was yesterday's TJ Ford for Jermaine O'Neal trade. Of course that has an impact on the Clippers, as it takes Ford off the table in the discussion of potential point guard trades - and I suppose it puts Jamaal Tinsley on the table.
And now Marc Stein is reporting that the Nets and the Bucks have agreed to a trade of Yi Jianlin and Bobby Simmons for Richard Jefferson. Wow. I haven't had much time to think about that one, but off the top of my head it seems like that could be one of those trades that works for both teams. The Bucks desperately needed a small forward and get one in RJ. The Nets needed to do SOMETHING. The Nets big three of Carter, Kidd and RJ is now Vinsanity, Devin Harris and Yi. Can we assume Vince won't be there much longer? Also, does this make it more likely that the Bucks will try to trade Michael Redd? Jefferson can pick up a lot of the scoring load. Interesting.
It should be an interesting day.
We can use this thread to discuss all the happenings. I'll be online from the start of the draft at 4 PM until about 7:45.
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Done deal
Clips and Sonics trade picks…as long as Minny takes Mayo. If not, no deal, as the Sonics would then grab him.
Looks like the Clips are sold on Eric Gordon. He will likely be the next L.A. Clipper.
by mikey p on Jun 26, 2008 12:43 PM PDT 0 recs
Unless the idea is for the Clips to get Love and trade him for Mayo
Lots of possibilities
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 12:49 PM PDT
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But if the Wolves really wanted Love that badly
why wouldn’t they just pick him, or deal with the Sonics?
Probably because they can get their future lottery pick back from LAC. That would mean that the Clippers are trading TWO future first rounders for Mayo. Not good.
I’m talking to myself.
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 12:53 PM PDT
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There goes the Maggette to Miluakee for Redd idea
He and Jefferson won’t work together.
This is a total LeBron James play for the Nets. Simmons gives the HUGE cap relief in two years to make a run at the King.
Nice job, Jay-Z.
by mikey p on Jun 26, 2008 12:46 PM PDT 0 recs
Good points
Maggette was a great potential acquisition for the Bucks since they needed that scoring small forward. Now – not so much.
LBJ will be playing for his buddy Jay-Z in Brooklyn in 2010.
The Clippers! The (second) Best NBA Team in LA!
by ClipperSteve on
Jun 26, 2008 1:03 PM PDT
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2010?
Speaking of 2010, if the clippers want to start over and make a plan for that, this summer is the time to make that happen. We all know that Miami really wants EB, so we send him off for Marion and the #2 (we don’t have to keep Marion). Then we have either mayo or Beasley and our pick at 4 (Gordon). Pair that with Kaman 2.0 and Al Thornton and say hello King James! We would be in a much better position and have a more competitive team than New York or anyone else for that matter.
I don’t want that to happen. I’d rather see our current team with our new pick next year. However, this summer is the best time to make the gamble for 2010 possible.
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 1:12 PM PDT
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GOOD ONE - I'm in
Clippers would really be in the drivers seat then
LeBron
Thornton
Kaman
Beasley
Gordon
Whoa!
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
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Nothing about the run up makes me feel good
I turned sour when the Miller deal didn’t happen and I haven’t seen anything yet that makes me feel better.
Except the fact that I, for one, opted out of my contract this year.
Eric Gordon is going to save the franchise? Ugh.
by John R on Jun 26, 2008 1:03 PM PDT 0 recs
You might be right
But MAY isn’t the kind of insurance I would like if you are giving up 2 first rounders to get a guy.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 1:09 PM PDT
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Right - but we don't know what's being discussed behind closed doors
And if EB stays, chances are they make the playoffs
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 1:15 PM PDT
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Has anyone heard
anything about Arenas?...I mean, the clips draft Gordon, then sign Arenas (a lot of $$ I know), then EB sees the team is serious and signs an extension…and we let Maggette walk….maybe do a S&T for some future draft picks and a back up center…..all of our problems are solved…:D
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 1:22 PM PDT
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Heard off the record that he's signing with the Lakers
Not sure how much stock to put in that rumor
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 1:51 PM PDT
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LOL - heard that from a Laker fan, right? Or Vic the Brick?
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 1:53 PM PDT
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Do they even have any $$$
to sign him?...I assume the Wiz would want to do a sign and trade as a minumum…
plus, Kobe and Arenas could NEVER play on the same court on the same team…there aren’t enough balls on the court for them both to me happy…
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:00 PM PDT
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What I was told (again, I don't have any reason to believe it other than the fact that the source knows his agent)
Is that he’d sign for the midlevel and go from there.
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 2:02 PM PDT
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WOW....
that is a pretty major paycut…..are you sure this isn’t just some Lakers fan’s fantasy….:)
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:04 PM PDT
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As I said - unreliable - jpst passing along unsubstantiated rumor
:-)
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 2:08 PM PDT
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Rumors are awesome...
this draft would be boring without them….
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:10 PM PDT
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Hmmm
He’d have to play for the Lakers for 2 years before he would even be eligible for the Early Bird exemption. So he’s leaving probably 15M on the table in the first 2 years combined and then at least 3-5M per year for the rest of his careeer. If he waits the additional year before signing as a full Bird, its like 23M, then 3-5M per.
If that happened, there should be an investigation into extra-CBA compensation. Its already suspicious with the Fisher thing.
Though its the Lakers so the league would probably let them do whatever they want anyway.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 2:12 PM PDT
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Everything the Lakers do is Fishy (pun)
Gasol trade for Kwame Brown and a retired dude, Fisher signing…this would be right in line.
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 2:16 PM PDT
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Agree...
Stern will have his handprints all over this thing if it materializes
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:19 PM PDT
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the way the nba works
I wouldn’t be surprised if the White Kwame (Chris Mihm) and a Ruby’s gift certificate is traded for Lebron.
by BtheKUTA on
Jun 26, 2008 2:23 PM PDT
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$25.
But it’s “lottery protected”
Seriously, couldn’t you just see an Odom for Miller+gay trade happening? On one end it kills me to watch the Lakers get better. On the other, it’s refreshing to see that there are still a few teams more inept than our own.
by BtheKUTA on
Jun 26, 2008 2:26 PM PDT
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I thought the clippers were trading the 7th pick for the 4th and a future lottery protected 1st round pick? So they’re really only losing one pick right? What am I missing? Now you got me interested to know how many of the clippers first round picks chosen outside the lottery (I know there aren’t too historical references for the clippers) evolve into rotation players. 10% success maybe?
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 1:21 PM PDT
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Is that the plan?
It doesn’t make much sense like that. Why would the Wolves give up another pick so the Clippers could move up?
I understood it was that the Wolves thought they could get their guy later, so the Clippers would compensate the Wolves with another year’s pick, thus buying insurance that Gordon is available.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
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oh im sorry...
i thought we had the 4th pick that belonged to seattle… not the wolves. my bad man.
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 1:28 PM PDT
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Ok - my bad
So ESPN is reporting its a done deal to swap picks with the Sonics pending Mayo being off the board already. Clippers would use the 4th on Gordon. No indication of compensation from the Clippers.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 1:29 PM PDT
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no worries...
it looks like a smart move if the Clips really do want eric gordon because you never know what team is going to make a trade ahead of you to snatch the player you want. I think we all know that the 1st 3 selections are rose, beasley and mayo… after that, who knows.
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 1:38 PM PDT
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This is off the top fo my head
But the clips aren’t too bad when it comes to drafting semi-late. Thornton last year, Q a couple years back i think in the early 20s (and in a TERRIBLE draft), Maurice Taylor in the mid teens, etc . It’s their top pics that generally suck. Unfortunately, that’s 80-90% of the time.
by BtheKUTA on
Jun 26, 2008 2:38 PM PDT
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In fact
Call MEM back up right now and offer Maggette and the 7th for Miller.
Memphis can let Maggette opt out (inevitable) or they can worry about the S&T. Get on the phone with Phoenix and revive that Barbosa deal.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 1:06 PM PDT
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i say the clips make the deal and then send the pick to the wolves with their pick back for mayo…may is a star and a lockdown defender, pair that with the team we have and its pretty exciting..then we can turnaround and trade corey for hinrich
by cliprboy on Jun 26, 2008 1:15 PM PDT 0 recs
i hear from a source minny takes love and we draft oj!!! pray
by cliprboy on Jun 26, 2008 1:28 PM PDT 0 recs
Nope
trade with Sonics is only if Minny takes Mayo. Otherwise it is void and Clips keep #7.
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 1:29 PM PDT
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If Mayo is still on the board...
who falls to the Clips?...Bayless?...Dani?
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 1:37 PM PDT
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maggette
The clips need to ship maggette NOW. We already lost chances to send him to the raptors for Ford or the bucks. Just offer him straight up for Hinrich now.
I would also trade brand (even for 70 cents on teh dollar) before we lose him after next year. Just offer him straight up for the #2 pick (and K to make $ work, isn’t Jason williams in his last year making a ton? take him and a package of their other scrubs). Beasley is far and away the best player in this draft and will be awesome.
Then draft Gordon. I still HATE the trade. We have no chance to get mayo and although I like eric gordon, just take a gamble and see who falls and take the best of mayo/gordon/bayless/westbrook/augustin in that order. Giving up a future 1st rounder (even protected) is too much.
by BtheKUTA on Jun 26, 2008 1:45 PM PDT 0 recs
how have the clippers done in the past...
drafting in the 1st round outside the lottery? If the pick really is lottery protected for more than one year…
Hopefully it is lottery protected for a number of years like the wolves did to the clips.
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 1:51 PM PDT
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My understanding
on lottery, or top10 protected picks, or any protected picks for that matter is that the condition expires after a certain amount of time. for example, i think we’re getting minnesota’s pick next year regardless of where they finish. So, if the clips don’t improve in the next few years, even if we can fend off oklahoma city for a short amount of time, they’ll end up getting a very high pick from us. Maybe i’m being too pessimistic, but the west is so good right now, it’s hard not to be.
Someone tell me if i’m wrong. Otherwise, just sign mark madsen and have him hoist 10 3s in the last game.
by BtheKUTA on
Jun 26, 2008 1:55 PM PDT
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No rules that I know of...
The usual deal would have the protection decreasing each year… top 20 in 2009, to 15 in 2010, top 10, etc. But the Minny pick was top 10 protected for like 6 years. We actually don’t get that pick until 2011, unless Minnesota gets a little better. So as far as I know there are no rules… the protection you put on a draft pick can be anything you and the other team agree to.
The Clippers! The (second) Best NBA Team in LA!
by ClipperSteve on
Jun 26, 2008 1:58 PM PDT
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thanks
Thanks for clarifying. Basically agree with whatever you want. I don’t know, even in the best of these protected situations, i don’t see how it’s worth it just to move up a little bit.
by BtheKUTA on
Jun 26, 2008 2:01 PM PDT
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thanks CS!
I cant wait to see what the deal actually is… and if there even is a deal. Anything could happen in the next few hours.
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 2:02 PM PDT
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The deal as I understand it...
The Clippers and Sonics have agreed to swap picks – contingent on Mayo being off the board before the 4th pick. The Clippers will send a lottery protected future pick to Seattle to get it done, but I have not seen any details on that.
They really like Gordon apparently. Would have been nice to get him without giving up a future first rounder, but you can’t always get what you want.
The Clippers! The (second) Best NBA Team in LA!
by ClipperSteve on Jun 26, 2008 1:46 PM PDT 0 recs
If you really like a player, go get him
Even if it is a pick too high
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 1:51 PM PDT
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FYI
There’s a live blog over on Ridiculous Upside that I’ll be participating in also.
The Clippers! The (second) Best NBA Team in LA!
by ClipperSteve on Jun 26, 2008 1:59 PM PDT 0 recs
Their mock draft
has Gordon going #10!!!! and the Clips picking Westbrook….who comes up with this stuff?
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:03 PM PDT
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Clips Sonics trade not a done deal
see my new fan post
by mikey p on Jun 26, 2008 2:03 PM PDT 0 recs
I swear
If the Clips moved up just to pick Westbrook or Love or Lopez or something I’m giving up on the team. I’ve been a diehard for 15 years now, but the clips are so inept it’s getting hard to take.
by BtheKUTA on Jun 26, 2008 2:17 PM PDT 0 recs
I think it is Gordon
which I would be ok with. But if it is Westbrook, that would be stupid.
I’m trying to follow this Miami thing. I just don’t buy it.
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 2:20 PM PDT
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it would have to be gordon right?
why else would the clippers give up a future 1st round pick if they weren’t sure the guy they really wanted would be gone? You guys are right, if it’s anyone else, it would be dumb.
BTW is anyone else a little worried about gordon? I didn’t follow his college team but if I understand correctly, he hit the rookie wall in college…
by cantthinkofagoodname on
Jun 26, 2008 2:27 PM PDT
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Coaching change
in the middle of the year…and he got hurt…nothing to worry about…he is just a kid…
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:28 PM PDT
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i like Gordon
I love gordon, I just don’t think it was worth it, cause I think Bayless will be very good also. But trading up to get Gordon does not make me want to jump off a cliff like if they chose love or gallinari or something.
by BtheKUTA on Jun 26, 2008 2:24 PM PDT 0 recs
Uggggh
I hate moving up to get Gordon; Dunleavy falls in love with players. Just take whoever’s left of Gordon, Westbrook, or Bayless… perosnally, I like Gordon the least. Plus he does nothing to solve our PG problem, uggh
by blowbyability on Jun 26, 2008 2:37 PM PDT 0 recs
maybe
another deal is in the works for a PG…a trade involving MAggette…
nah…that would be too logical…
by Clip Show on Jun 26, 2008 2:39 PM PDT 0 recs
Acceptable
Brand/7th for (S&T)Marion/Beasley <-Contigent on the second trade I would consider including the Minny pick as long as the 7th pick gets it done. None of this trade up for Mayo then trade stuff.
Maggette/09 First/09 Second for Mike Miller <-This deal is based on a nuance that I’m not clear on, seemingly depending on if this is an opt out or an opt in and how that plays in the CBA. If it is an opt out then he is technically under contract and can be traded (I’m assuming), and then opt out tomorrow, making the trade a big expiring contract and picks for Miller.
You go to war with:
Livvy/Knight
Miller/Mobley/Ross
Marion/Thornton
Beasley/Thomas
Kaman/Davis/Fazekas
And you still have the mid-level to spend. Could you lure Udrih with this squad?
As much as it would hurt to see the 05/06 Clippers basically destroyed, that team would compete right away and for years. Then next year you have the expiring Mobley/Thomas contracts to trade.
by John R on Jun 26, 2008 2:40 PM PDT 0 recs
Problem - can't count on Livy at PG
And Miller and Marion are getting too old. I’d rather get younger. Perhaps sign a good pg when Marion leaves next year and start Thornton
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 2:43 PM PDT
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Age
Its a wash.
Marion is one year older than EB/Maggette and Miller is one year younger.
Im not against getting younger, of course, but find the talent for the price.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 2:48 PM PDT
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Can't we trade Corey for a young up and coming pg (or a package including that)?
Lou Williams of Philly for example?
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 2:49 PM PDT
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Almost impossible
The salaries can’t work. Williams makes like no money.
Now, you could try to sign him outright. WAY over pay him using your mid-level to try to make sure you get him.
Then still do the Miller deal with Maggette.
If you feel good about that guy its not an awful plan. You can have him AND do both trades. Potentially. But you can’ trade maggette for him.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 2:54 PM PDT
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PG
The plan doesn’t count on him.
Knight has enough people to dish to that he’ll never need to take that jumper again. That team should just need someone who can get it up court in 8 seconds.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 2:49 PM PDT
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A good NBA team cannot count on oft-injured Brevin Knight as its PG
by Jax on
Jun 26, 2008 2:50 PM PDT
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Not
going to get it done in the point guard-heavy west either…
need an upgrade now
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:52 PM PDT
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Rondo
Never forget Wages of Wins had him for ROY.
And WoW was one of the few who picked the Celtics to win this year…
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 3:05 PM PDT
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word is that...
Udrih is NOT resigning with the Kings…so that would work too..
by Clip Show on
Jun 26, 2008 2:43 PM PDT
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Udrih
At this point I’m desperate enough to overpay Udrih by a bit. He’s “Dunleavy’s guy”. No excuses.
by supac on
Jun 26, 2008 3:36 PM PDT
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Good, but I think we could do this and keep EB
Draft the guard we are after and then:
Livvy/Knight
Mayo (Gordon) /Mobley/Ross
Miller/Thornton
Brand/Thomas
Kaman/Davis/Fazekas
Still light on PG’s, though
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 2:46 PM PDT
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Take the one of the PG's then
Play Miller at the 2 and start Thornton.
by John R on
Jun 26, 2008 2:50 PM PDT
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Or just let Mayo/Gordon run the point. I'm sure he can bring it up.
Screw it. Put five scorers out there.
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 2:54 PM PDT
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I read that, but didn't see it on film
Let’s get Sam back on a one-year deal
by mikey p on
Jun 26, 2008 3:01 PM PDT
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