The End Game
by Steve Perrin on Jul 7, 2008 10:16 AM PDT
in News
100 comments
The 4th of July weekend is over, and hopefully we can get back to business. Citizen Zhiv asked long about Saturday, "Is it that important to all of these guys to eat hot dogs and watch fireworks, when there are hundreds of millions of dollars at stake?" Apparently, the answer is yes. Actually, the simple fact is that with the league moratorium on signings lasting until July 9th (Wednesday), I think they knew their wasn't much left to discuss, and so why not eat hot dogs and watch fireworks?
Marc Stein has the full recap of the situation as he sees and hears it at ESPN.com today. The good news is that he, like ourselves, thinks all signs point to Elton Brand signing with the Clippers.
There are a few interesting inclusions in the piece.
The Clippers may or may not need to renounce a list of players beyond Maggette and Livingston to squeeze more money into their offer to Brand. Stein lists Fazekas, Marcus Williams, Ross, Dickau, Paul Davis, Smush, and even N'Dong and Singleton from past teams. I must say, this is not an area I understand entirely (few people do). It's related of course to the rule that allowed the Lakers to include Aaron McKie in the Gasol trade. N'Dong last played for the Clippers, he hasn't played for any other NBA team since, he still could have a cap hold on their books. Most of these are no-brainers if it helps secure Brand. Even a player like Fazekas, whom we'd like to have on the team next season, can be re-signed for the minimum after they renounce him.
Perhaps Citizen John R can chime in here about salary reserves for empty roster spots. At some point, if I understand correctly, you have to reserve the salary amount for the roster spot anyway. So if the player is tying up a minimal salary (as is the case for most of these guys), there's not much, if any, point, in renouncing once you're down to twelve names.
Josh Powell falls in a different category. He signed an unguaranteed three year deal. He would need to be waived to get that money back, but again, it's a minimum deal so if they can get down to twelve without touching Powell, there's little reason to waive him also, if I have that part right.
The other theory that Stein floats is the old "Throw them off the scent" theory. As we've suspected all along, one reason that Brand and Falk might take their time before signing with the Clippers is to calm the suspicions of a pre-arranged deal. In fact, that's been my assumption for the delay all along.
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I dont know
All those little contracts in the margins aren’t well documented, but can really add up so its hard to know what’s going on there. You are charged until you get 12 players, but if a player isn’t renounced, he is charged a little more than the minimum. He is counted as like what salary he could get.
Getting EB one more mil up front comes out to about 6 across the 5 years though. I know that much.
It does read like Stein just woke up to this whole thing though. Whoa, there is a story here beyond the usual macro look. Millions of dollars are at stake based on what Boniface N’dong is doing today. Seems like the worldwide leader should spend a minute laying it out instead of having Hollinger tell us “LOL ITS STILL THE CLIPPERS”.
by John R on Jul 7, 2008 10:53 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
roster thoughts
going back to your previous post, don’t you think a roster spot should be saved for a perimeter defender, ala qross? i think mobley would need a rest guarding the opponent’s best perimeter player, and he would have trouble matching up with the bigger 3’s in the league, such as melo and lebron. thornton has not proven to be a capable defender yet, and i think it’s too much to ask him to guard those guys in his 2nd year in the L. your thoughts?
by bonkrood on Jul 7, 2008 11:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Two guys
Livingston and Marcus Williams.
Obviously, neither is ideal, given that Livingston hasn’t played in 18 months, and Williams has played like 20 NBA minutes in his career. BUT, I think they like Williams (hence the qualifying offer) and think he can be the new QRoss. D-League people rave about his defense last season in Austin.
So if Livingston and Williams are both on the roster, I think you have to cross your fingers and hope that one of them can do it. (Do you remember Liv’s defense on Kobe two seasons ago? He was a great defender when he was healthy.) If one or both is not on the roster, then absolutely you need to add someone.
The Clippers! The (second) Best NBA Team in LA!
by Steve Perrin on Jul 7, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i remember...
by cantthinkofagoodname on Jul 7, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was at that game
I jumped up when Shaun swatted the first one. Laker fans everywhere were silent.
It was beautiful. (Clippers lost the game.)
by mikey p on Jul 7, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL...
2 seasons later and KB still giving the same look of disbelief to the refs when nothing is called and not getting back on D…
by Lawler's Law on Jul 7, 2008 12:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Some things for public consumption
P.S. - We are obliged here to remind you that Devean George was taking advantage of a little-known league rule that prevents certain players with one-year contracts from being dealt without their permission - as opposed to a no-trade clause in his contract - to pull himself out of the Dallas Mavericks’ trade with New Jersey in February for Jason Kidd. Bryant remains the only player in the league at present that is known to possess a no-trade clause.This past weekend CS chided Hollinger for poor wording. So I will do the same with Stein. The reality of what happened with Devean George is what happened with any player who has Bird Rights at stake: He has the right to keep them, and that’s what George did. (What George also did was kill his market value in a market ripe for role players who could be valuable at a lesser price. But that’s not the issue.) That’s also true of any player who signs a tender offer (let’s say Shaun Livingston had done so-he would have had the same option). Mickeal Pietrus had this rights which I’m sure killed any potential trades with him. Now that Pietrus is an un-restricted FA this makes it easier on the Warriors to get anything they want for him. It also allows Pietrus to negotiate maximum dollars which he did not have before. (He won’t get max dollars I’m just laying out the scenario.)
Do I think Elton Brand will get a no trade clause? Absolutely, and for this reason. It comes with a hefty trade kicker that will help make up for the lesser dollars that the Clippers signed him for. In the end stars do get paid one way or another, and it’s not always in the ways fans think of.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 7, 2008 1:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Elton house on sale
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Elton-Brand-places-his-LA-house-back-on-the-mark;_ylt=AjbY0w6mNf8×0P9BEok8KGm8vLYF?urn=nba,92388
Should I be scared of Brand’s house on sale?
by Qlippers on Jul 7, 2008 3:55 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
More rumors
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3477358
Philly in the mix
by Qlippers on Jul 7, 2008 9:32 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
No 6 year deal or no trade clause for brand
by Qlippers on Jul 8, 2008 1:01 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Why the hell not?
This is getting bizarre.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I understand...
the 5 year v. 6 year deal…but no No Trade Clause?...that part I dont understand. And who is telling the LATimes this stuff?...EB and his agent are NOT talking to anyone, nor have they for the past week. Is this all from the Clippers?
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Incorrect
They are talking to Philly. They actually went to Philly late last week, according to one article, to entice Philly to get into the bidding.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who is talking to Philly?
EB and Falk?...is this confirmed? and from who? I am just curious….everything I have read so far is that EB and Falk are talking to no one at this time…maybe I am wrong.
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I saw an article last week
ESPN, I think, that indicated that Falk and EB flew to Philly to entice them to enter the bidding. I suspect that there’s much to this entire saga that we don’t know and thus that it’s a waste of time for us to speculate about it.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gotcha...
I am done speculating…it’s making my head spin…
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
For example
Many on this board seem to think that EB somehow promised the Clips something. How do we know he really did that? Would we really blame him if he wanted to play for a better-run, young, Philly team closer to his home for $20 M more than the Clippers offer? Not saying that this is going to happen, but it makes sense that he might be considering such a move.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldnt say promise
But there are clear messages making someone a liar. No wiggle room there. He isn’t Boozering the Clips. He had an opt out fair and square. But there was consensus that certain things were said.
That said, I disagree with your premise that Philly is better run. If by “better run” you mean happens to be in the East, I would agree. As, again, even last season’s Clippers would have been in the playoff hunt in the East.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are those "clear messages" John R
Again, please articulate what those are before you begin to cast aspersions on a player who gave his all to this team for 7 years.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I haven't cast aspersions
There is nothing to cast aspersions about yet.
But it wasn’t long ago that around the league it was assumed that the Clippers and EB had colluded to get BD. And that wasn’t just on this board. That was well respected news sources.
So, its a long way from that to assume noone said anything to anyone ever. It just doesn’t fit the facts.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course you are
According to you, if he doesn’t come back to the Clips, he’s a liar. With all due respect you have no idea what the facts are.
Stop believing what you read in the newspapers.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right
Start believing you. Classic
So except for your word versus everyone elses…all signs did point to certain promises and expectations.
I stand by my statements.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
John R - read my posts
I didn’t say anything for you to believe or not to believe. Of course, you think that David Stern is leading a conspiracy against us fans. LOL.
What promises, John R. Still waiting. Not surprising that you don’t want to go on record because you realize that you’ll be made to look foolish. Again.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The record is out for all to read
Everyone knows what I’m talking about. Except you.
Because your worldview is shaped by something other than facts.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What record, John R
Once again, list what you believe are the false promises EB made (assuming he bolts).
Apparently, you can’t.
Tick, tick, tick
Try not to let your emotions get the best of you.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And you have no counter facts
The burden of proof isn’t on me…
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
counter facts to what?
Your “EB lied” nonsense?
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alright you too
I think Stein sums it up nicely what was said before…enjoy..
Stein
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"around the league"
Who – Hoopsworld unnamed sources?
LOL
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Couldn't blame him for wanting to bolt
but I would hardly call Philly a more talented team. Lots of unproven players. But they have a great coach who players love playing for.
But their management is questionable.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL Philly wins
Philly wins in the LEast conference:
33
43
38
35
40
No first round wins. But no major injuries.
The notion that Philly is better run only fits if you begin from Jax’s position that he hates the Clippers.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe that an Eastern conference team won it all this past year
And several other east teams are pretty good and improving. In the west, the Suns, Mavs and Spurs are declining.
John R thinks I hate the Clippers because I have very little respect for their management. Too bad John R has to make up false arguments.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What does the future have to do with past results?
The evidence we have is that Philly continues to put out weak teams and couldn’t get out of the first round in the very weak east.
I only have evidence.
If you don’t like Clipper management, AND EB leaves, can we count on these being your last days round these parts?
Something good could come out of this after all.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Philly is a young team with some promising players
Go ahead – check them out.
John R – I will be here long after you abandon this site (for the second time). While you remain, I will always call you out when you go to far in your nonsensical rants about the character of the players on the team.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
Please, link all the rants about the character of the players on the team.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
For starters, look at your posts above about EB
(if he goes elsewhere)
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And
Brand definitely wants to play with Andre Miller again, because they had such a good experience last time.
Baron Davis opted out so that he could play with Chris Kaman, right?
C’mon people! This is Elton Brand we’re talking about. I know it’s taking a long time and we’re all going a little bit nuts. There may be something complicated going on, or they may just be waiting until they get official word on the salary cap.
I just find it hard to believe that Brand would give up the chance to stay in LA and play with a fun, skilled, spectacular, x-factor player like Baron Davis in order to go to Philly and hang out with no-personality Andre Miller. Any self-respecting (still, after all this time) Clipper fan should have serious reservations about Miller. We’ll leave it at that. Brand-Kaman-Davis can have a conversation with Garnett-Pierce-Allen and Gasol-Odom-Kobe. Brand-Igoudala-Miller says hello and goodbye.
I’m sure there’s more to the Sixers, but I must say that I’m really not a fan of Andre Miller.
And I’m obviously a big fan of Elton Brand. Keeping the faith.
by citizen zhiv on Jul 8, 2008 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are $20 M reasons
I think EB is coming back. I just think that we need to base our arguments about “lying” on facts, not on what we read in the newspaper. It’s not fair to anyone involved.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I once sat on a jury with a person like you
She couldn’t be convinced this guy shot this guy.
He had bullets matching the ones in the guy in his trunk.
He led the police on a chase through downtown LA that ended in a horrific crash.
The guy while bleeding to death identified the shooter saying, “That’s him, that’s the guy that shot me”.
She wanted a gun with fingerprints on it. It was never found.
The point is, sometimes mountains of circumstantial evidence is enough. That we have.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
There's one big difference, John R
That seems to have escaped you. Listen carefully. In the case in which you were involved, evidence, actual evidence, was introduced. And that evidence was what you were permitted to deliberate on. No speculation. No unnamed sources, nothing else.
Speculation and unnamed source statements ain’t evidence, John R.
Next.
If anyone got snowed here (if your facts are correct, and if EB leaves), it’s your beloved MDSr.
That’s why you’re so mad. I get it now.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who is mad?
There are mountains of evidence.
BD seemed to believe EB would be here. He said so.
Do you believe these two don’t talk? Where would he get that impression?
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Mountains of evidence"
Why not identify some of it
So what you have is as follows:
BD seemed to believe EB would be here.
Ooh. That makes EB a liar. Hopefully you won’t be sitting on amy more juries soon.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why?
As I said, even once I made a post, you still wouldn’t believe it, as you never do when someothing doesn’t fit your worldview.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hat tip to Clip Show
“Brand told ESPN.com on June 30 that his “intention is to stay” with the Clippers, while Falk spoke optimistically of Brand signing a deal to “finish his career with the Clippers” if the team could make another significant personnel acquisition or two.”
BD would seem to qualify.
And…good night.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see
Here’s your evidence:
1. BD says he wants to play with EB
2. Brand told ESPN he wanted to stay.
Well, I guess EB would not be up to John R’s pristine ethical standards if he left.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
Exactly what I said would happen. Let me sum up the always important Jax dicussion here.
EB says I will stay IF X.
IF X happens.
I say EB may be a liar if he leaves because he said what I said he said.
NO WAI YOU CAN’T SAY THAT ABOUT EB.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
BD also said
he wants to stay in the bay!
But that is OK since he is coming to you?
Hypocracy maybe?
by buky on Jul 8, 2008 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great point buky
Actually, you’re far above John R on this.
BD is also a liar in his (interesting) mind.
LOL
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I recall
not too long ago John R bolted this blog because – gasp – the clips had the audacity to pick up Ruben Patterson. Below John R’s standards, he said.
Of course, that lasted about a week.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Awww
Now its about me personally.
I’m honored.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not you -- just your hypocrisy
But you keep trying to cast those aspersions.
You’re pretty good at it.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Baron Davis was lowballed by GS management.
As soon as he opted out, they threw crazy money offers at Gilbert Arenas and Elton Brand, never once returning to negotiations with Davis. He was offered a long term deal by the Clippers and he verbally agreed. GSW fans can cry all they want about him being a liar and a traitor, but the organization failed to retain him, simple as that.
If Elton Brand leaves (especially if it’s because of not getting a no-trade clause) then no one call Brand a liar or a traitor because his departure would be the result of the organization’s actions. There is no hypocrisy here, only a jilted Baron-stan making a flawed point
by OhMeOhMy on Jul 8, 2008 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
EVIDENCE
please not rumors!
Are you the best friend(wife,mistress,...) of Mullin?
by buky on Jul 8, 2008 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I read the same articles as you do.
And you take them at their word the same as I do (or have you put away your Baron Davis voodoo doll?)
by OhMeOhMy on Jul 8, 2008 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don't know me
so please don’t judge me by your standards
by buky on Jul 8, 2008 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to clarify:
“BD also said he want to stay.
he wants to stay in the bay!
But that is OK since he is coming to you?
Hypocracy maybe?”
That sounds like a value judgment to me, stanger.
by OhMeOhMy on Jul 8, 2008 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was until GSW gave him the bird
(and I don’t mean bird rights)
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you
But the facts are starting to disagree with us. Why does EB go all the way to Philly to get them involved? Why does EB sell his house? Why does Philly then trade away some of their pieces?
I think Mo Cheeks may have put the hard sale on EB and Falk. This is looking fishy.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Breaking it down
1. EB goes to Philly to make things kosher, and to make things look kosher.
2. EB puts his house on the market because he has another house that is not his bachelor pad, but is better suited to family life and closer to the new practice facility.
3. Philly trades away pieces for the same reason the Clippers traded away pieces when they were trying to get Kobe. Getting rid of unnecessary parts that can enhance your ability to attract a bigger talent is a good idea, and sometimes you’re just looking for an excuse to do it. If it’s not going to be Brand, it could be somebody else or a couple of guys.
by citizen zhiv on Jul 8, 2008 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well
EB used to live in MB, close to the Clipper practice facility. The house he’s selling is worth $4 M. The other house is $1.5 M. Seroiusly doubt he’s moving there.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good Point
I was afraid of that. A little more information on Brand’s real estate situation would be helpful.
by citizen zhiv on Jul 8, 2008 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The house he is selling
Is right off Mulholland. Not exactly family friendly.
by Jax on Jul 8, 2008 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Off the strip
Great spot. I would give him $3.5M for it right now.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
One thing to note is that
Adrian Wojnarowski did say something on the “Ball don’t Lie” blog.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 8, 2008 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nevermind already linked
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 8, 2008 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Brand leaning towards Philly?
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AnEOgBFCsBhZBsSjpI8lP9m8vLYF?slug=aw-brandsixers070708&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
New update on Yahoo!.
This could easily become one of the worse days in Clips history….after of course the devastating knee injury to Livingston.
I love LAC.
by oasisman on Jul 8, 2008 3:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What does
“leaning” actually mean anyway? It also mentions a smokescreen by Falk…too much ambiguity for me.
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't believe it until it happens
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 8, 2008 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The East Coast thing
maybe EB wants to raise his family there. Not sure.
I’m not sure whether EB’s departure will be a Clipper fumble or a Brand backstab.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wojna article
Seems to go in and out… just about convincing at some points, then hits a snag or seems to become more speculative than informational.
There are two huge issues. Main one is the “take it or leave it” attitude that purportedly upset Brand. Maybe Jax believes the Clips are capable of saying 1) we’ll do anything to keep you, and make you a franchise deal; then 2) Brand wants an elite player and they make an agreement and get the player; then 3) they say “take it or leave it.” If you’re Jax and you want to believe the absolute worst about the Clipper management (and yes, you have a fair amount of reason to), you believe that this is possible. If you’re somewhat less cynical, you realize that there’s a pretty big gap between “we’ll do anything” to “take it or leave it.”
But the tell in this argument is that he cites the fact that the Clips aren’t willing to renounce Corey Maggette. Huh? Is that a mistake? Are the Clippers actually not renouncing Maggette? I don’t get it. And until I get it, I definitely don’t believe it. Go ahead, “lean” away, and we’ll see what happens.
by citizen zhiv on Jul 8, 2008 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dont think he meant
that they won’t renounce Maggette…I think he just states that the Clippers won’t up their bid for EB…regardless of the renouncing part…he is very vague…
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 4:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's grasping at straws
I really believe that. He mentioned that Philly did a trade on Monday, but you can’t complete a trade until Wednesday. (The TJ Ford for Jermaine O’Neal deal can’t be complete until Wednesday at the earliest for instance.)
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 8, 2008 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Worse than vague
“The Clippers could renounce free agents such as Shaun Livingston and Corey Maggette to sweeten what’s believed to be a five-year, $70 million offer, but have resisted upping their bid.”
Didn’t the Clips definitely renounce Livingston? Isn’t he out there on the open market? And the Maggette statement just doesn’t make sense at all. They had to renounce Maggette (in principle, if not officially) in order to make the deal with Baron and the offer to Brand. They’re not “saving” any of Maggette’s money that they’re not offering to Brand. They can’t sign Brand and then take the 50 cents left over and sign Maggette. It just doesn’t make sense.
The only way it makes sense is if you’re talking to your own “usual suspects” sources, and everywhere you go it starts with an “it’s the Clippers,” they’re going to mess it up and they’re not going to succeed, bias. But that doesn’t explain the initial Baron Davis move, and as I say above, the “take it or leave it” comes out of nowhere.
by citizen zhiv on Jul 8, 2008 5:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Take it or leave it
If anyone could bungle this deal, it would be the Clippers. Why on earth would the try to get cheap with Brand, if in fact that is what is happening here?
Reports indicate he is leaning to Philly. Perhaps he was offended.
by mikey p on Jul 8, 2008 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If they refused to give him a no trade clause thus causing him to leave,
then it’s a Clipper fumble. Otherwise, probably a Brand backstab.
by OhMeOhMy on Jul 8, 2008 3:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ric Bucher on ESPN
Ric Bucher was on ESPN, he stated the only way the clips lose on Brand is that they don’t want to pony up the money. BUT he says the clippers are the front runner and Brand would not have had a handshake deal w/ Baron prior to free agency. If he leaves, this would take a huge hit on his reputation.
And this is not Brand, but Falk’s deal. He hasn’t had a big client since MJ and this is his payday.
So Who do you trust from all the Chatter? Stein? Bucher? Hollinger? Abbott?
by Qlippers on Jul 8, 2008 3:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What is your question?
Are you asking if I’m Ric Bucher? No, I’m not.
If are you asking for comment…
Bucher says his reputation would take a hit. This would be because he told a lie. I said, if he does X, it means he told a lie and, as such, is a liar. We are saying the same thing.
No, I do not know Bucher’s position on MDSr.
So you should immediately email the world wide leader and tell them off like you have tried to to do me.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 4:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I couldn't be more
I’ll take that as your concession.
Or did you email ESPN to complain to them?
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're silly
And you constantly misinterpret my posts. This one was a joke.
Once again, relax.
by Jax on Jul 9, 2008 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ric bucher just came on 710 and says it sounds like EB to philly and could be done by midnight
by cliprboy on Jul 8, 2008 4:50 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
"Sounds like"?
Thats pretty definitive…..thanks for the “rumor” Ric….
by Clip Show on Jul 8, 2008 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So...
So, if we lose EB to the 6er’s, does BD back out of the verbal?
by daclipjoint on Jul 8, 2008 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I got a better question
Where does he go if it’s not to the Clippers?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. It's simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get tangled, you tango on
by pookeyguru on Jul 8, 2008 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tangental, but
Is it still in the Clippers interest to sign him if EB isn’t in LA?
This is not obvious.
by John R on Jul 8, 2008 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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