Clippers 97 - Blazers 85 (Preseason) - An Auspicious Debut
by Steve Perrin on Oct 10, 2009 12:22 AM PDT
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PrintMy first game at Staples Center as cub reporter went well for the home team, if not for me. Friday is soccer practice night - so I left the house with three kids (two of mine and one friend), a cello (ClipperMax has his lesson before practice) and a dozen or so soccer balls - but no laptop. I left the second practice early to make the game, but didn't discover my mistake until I got to the Staples. Hopefully I'll get better at the logistics part. At any rate, I wish I could have been on the thread with everyone - looks like you had a good time. Thanks to Citizen bestclipfan for putting it up there.
If you were at Staples tonight, you know this already - the Clippers were fun to watch. A lot of fun. They're not going to shoot that well every game, and they were still sloppy - but they were fun.
Baron came out energized from the start, and it showed - particularly on the defensive end. I had him for five deflections by himself in the first quarter - and a few of those led to fast break points. Speaking of fast break points, the Clippers had 28 of those on the game - I haven't looked it up, but I'm pretty sure 28 would be in the top five for all of last season.
It wasn't just Baron playing defense either - the entire team looked very good defensively. I said already that they're not necessarily going to shoot that well every night, but defense doesn't go into a slump. If the team puts the effort in, they can defend. Now, Portland was far from sharp, and if this game had counted I highly doubt they would have gone to Greg Oden so many times (dear FSM his offensive game is terrible) - but even with all of those caveats, you had to be pleased with the defense.
Another characteristic that will hopefully differentiate this edition of the Clippers from those of the recent past was on full display tonight, and that's depth. Chris Kaman had a rocky start, with two fouls, a turnover and a terrible looking shot in the first 2:16. He had to sit down with those two fouls, and the first Clipper off the bench was... DeAndre Jordan. Now, when I talked about the quality at the end of the Clippers' bench this season, I had DJ in that 'last five' group. I didn't figure DJ for a primary rotation guy yet - not with Kaman and Camby and Griffin and Smith all needing minutes. But it's looking more and more like Jordan's going to have to get regular minutes as well. He replaced Kaman, blocked a couple of shots and scored 5 quick points (one bucket on an actual post move!). His energy was terrific, and more importantly he was under control. He's a completely different (read much, much better) player this season.
So including Jordan in the group that needs minutes, you now go 10 deep. All 10 played in the first half, and all of them looked good. Unfortunately, it's still a little thin on the wings, and a little heavy at the big spots, but it's nice to have too many quality players anywhere for once.
Blake Griffin entered his first pre-season game with 1:45 left in the first period. MDsr has been talking about the flexibility that he has with Griffin to play him at multiple positions, and it was immediately evident. He came into the game next to DJ, playing power forward. But 11 seconds later, Jordan picked up his third foul and was replaced by Craig Smith. No problem, Griffin slides over to the five with Smith at the four. A few minutes later, Kaman came off the bench to give Al Thornton his first break of the game - and Griffin moved from the five to the three. Now, Ime Udoka is not the toughest cover in the league, so it's not a huge deal. But the guy played three positions - in the first six minutes of his first game.
If you didn't see or possibly hear, I'm not sure I can do justice to what Blake Griffin brings to the court. Early in the second quarter he went diving over the scorer's table after a loose ball (in the process giving everyone in the Clippers' front office a heart attack), then hustled back onto the court into a passing lane for a steal. He doesn't have any speed other than full. He may have to tone it back some just to survive an 82 game season. He hit the deck pretty hard twice tonight - and this is pre-season.
On his first few possessions, Juwan Howard (who is 16 years older than Griffin) just played off of him, daring the rookie to shoot - which he did, and he missed. He should get used to that defense, because until he proves that he can make that 18 footer (which he will), that's how everyone is going to defend him. But even if he doesn't make his jumpers, the guy will fill lanes and dunk the ball. He had three of those, salvaging a .500 from the field game without making anything other than dunks. As a reporter in the press box, I'm supposed to be an impartial observer - but I slipped up and let out a whoop on his third jam, a soaring two hander that's sure to be on all the highlight reels.
Griffin's final line in the box score isn't awe inspiring - 8 points, 5 rebounds, 2 assists in 21 minutes, a nice game but nothing to write home to Oklahoma about - but his presence is worth so much more.
Overall, it's hard to find a Clipper that didn't play well. Eric Gordon was his efficient self, scoring 12 points on 8 shots. Moreover, he played commendable D on Brandon Roy, one of the superstar two guards who could end up giving him trouble this season. The point guards (Baron Davis and Sebastian Telfair) combined for 18 assists against only 3 turnovers, which is just outstanding. The team as a whole had 30 assists out of 41 made baskets, which is another amazingly good number. Kaman, after that shakey start, played well, with 6 for 8 shooting and 4 blocked shots. His face up jumper was really clicking, and in fact in the third quarter he really bailed the Clippers out by making several hoops when they had nothing going. Thornton was good, Butler was good, Camby was good, Smith was good. Let's face it - the team looked good.
Seeing this group assembled on the floor, it's obvious that they will be most effective when they run. Both Baron and Bassy are tremendous in the open court, and every one else is hyper-athletic for their positions. The Clippers last three draft picks (Thornton, Gordon and Griffin) were among the best athletes in their drafts, if not the best. And Chris Kaman is one of the most athletic centers in the league, even if he doesn't look like he is. And both Jordan and Griffin, if not the whole team, are busting their butts to get up the floor, because those guys love to dunk the ball. Jordan is looking for the lob on the break every trip (he didn't get one tonight, though Bassy did set him up for a great jam in the fourth quarter). And as we've said, Griffin only knows how to play one way. With 30 points in the first quarter, and 28 fast break points in the game, at least for this one game that doesn't count, these were the running Clippers.
It's important not to get too worked up over a pre-season game. The Blazers weren't great tonight. The game doesn't count in the standings. But there were many very encouraging signs during the game. Let's hope the team can do more of the same.
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I was there too
a the above is QFT.
The team looked very very good, I think the most encouraging thing was how well and deep our bench looks. A lot of the bench players would be starters on lottery teams (in fact most are, Smith, Telfair and Butler were all starters last year) and of course Blake (or Camby) would start for most teams as well. Added how well DJ played and that Ricky Davis, Steve Novak, Collins and B Skinz we have a deep bench that should be a strength.
FA in 2010.
Nice breakdown Steve!
I was at the game tonight too and I think you did a great job summing it up for all the readers who couldn’t be there. Did you notice all the fans chanting for Dunleavy to be fired? Looks like it could be a long season for MDsr if he doesnt get off to a fast start.
What do you think?
That chant came from Firedunleavy
He’s already starting with the chants.
"All the fans"
Seemed like four guys. Staples wasn’t very full, so it was easy for them to make an impression with the chant. If the team plays well, they’ll seem silly with that. If the team plays poorly, then a lot of people will join them. We’ll just have to wait and see.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions
On Clipperblog, our old friend FireDunleavy.com wrote that he was one of the four guys chanting (I was also there tonight and my recollection was the first chant started when the score was 2-0 and it only got more annoying from there.) But he also wrote that Clipper security came up to them after the game and warned them that the next time it happens, they will get thrown out after the first chant. I hope I’m there when it happens.
"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted" – Albert Einstein
by Another son of Mike Smith on Oct 10, 2009 12:48 AM PDT reply actions
I agree
They’re kind of like the fans from “Major League”, always complaining how the team suck and then cheering at the end of season.
Interesting...
I didn’t find them annoying at all. I really believe that the only thing holding our team back is a new HC. I’ve suffered through enough mismanagement over the last 6 years to see that MDsr is clearly a terrible coach.
It’s really too bad that they sent security over there to threaten to throw them out when we live in a supposedly free democracy. This happens in NYC and Philly all the time but I guess the East Coast is more aware of things like a “Bill of Rights” and “1st Amendment protest.”
Sort of
It’s a private event and therefore Staples Center management have the right to exercise their rules.
If people want to protest they can go outside the game to the streets to rile up the crowd or the practice facility.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 1:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Trying to stifle free speech seems to me to be part of the problem
The fans should have a greater say. MDSr would have been run out of town a long time ago – as coach – in Boston for example. Because it’s the Clippers, there’s been very little passion. Say what you want, but those guys are fans just like everyone else.
I think people should be able to say what they want and if others like Another Son or Clipper Chuck want to shun them they can do that too.
kinda difficult to shun some a-hole yelling "Fire Dunleavy" throughout the game, no?
Pretty sure the Staples staff are well within their rights to threaten removal considering that people payed to see a game and the experience is being cheapened by a few whiny “fans”(?). Your free speech isn’t stifled until the org takes your computer away for incessant whining on this fan site.
I do think that people have the right
to do chants, but really if you are going to do a Fire Dunleavy chant then at least wait until we are losing as apposed to when we are up 20 then it is just annoying and childish
In Gordon we trust
by bestclipfan on Oct 10, 2009 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Technically those types of conditions
are instituted for public safety reasons
Pretty irrelevant
and wouldnt bring up that as the “Fire Dunleavy” chant is completely the complete different “fire” in “FIRE IN A theater.”
I think the the fans should have a say in “Fire Dunleavy” as much as I hate to say it. Sure, its not a great approach to say it before a game starts and the Clipps are up 2-0, but I find it bs to bring out security…
Howzabout ...
…yelling ‘Movie’ in a firehouse?
All they are saying
Is give us some chants! (repeat, ad infinitum)
It’s a private event, if management feels fan behavior is boorish and diminishes the experience for other patron, they’re quite within their rights to demand it cease.
In fact, I prefer that, to my having to tell them to ‘shut the f—- up!’
While we’re at it, I also don’t like people who stand up in front of me too much, talk loudly on cell phones, or drink too much.
I vant to be alone!
+1000
Also let us not forget the second part of that clause,
as long as it does not infringe upon the freedom of others.
While this is not exactly the case, I believe many would say that the chant was super annoying and somewhat took away from our enjoyment. We too are paying patrons and fans.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Actually, the limitation
has to do with inciting violence. Free speech should generally be cherished. But you raise a good point about being paying patrons and fans. Typically people won’t chant unpopular things because they will be shunned.
That is annoying
And technically they don’t have a right to do it. This is not gov’t-owned property.
Hardly trying to stifle free speech
But there is a big difference between private and public gatherings. Businesses reserve the right to enforce their rules. I wanted MDSr out too, but hes not and the only way to make management (especially ours) is by hurting their bottom line. A few fans chanting fire dunleavy will not accomplish much especially when we are winning.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 12:56 PM PDT up reply actions
You must be from the east coast
Our team was leading the whole way and they want to heckle? I bet firedunleavey was happy as hell at the 06’ team when dunleavey was at the helm. Seriously, if it wasn’t for dunleavey the Clippers would not have the squad that we have now. Shut up Dow Jones and your homie firedunleavey.
I was there...
I spoke with the guy in the EJ jersey and it was more about them standing up and taunting than just spouting off. Of course they should get some props for suppoting the Ricky chants.
Really bummed I couldn't be there or watch the game on TV
Frustrating. Like Steve I have kids who had sporting events. The description of the play and the highlights on nba.com are encouraging. R. Davis might add more wing depth. The chanting will go away if they win.
Awesome Night
Griffin was a little rusty, but like you said he had a certan presence out there that was impressive. I like the idea of either Griffin or Gordon on the court at all times.
I missed pretty much all of the first quarter, so Kaman looked great…instant chemistry with Blake Griffin, wow. The second unit looked better than the starters from what I saw. Telfair is a significant upgrade at backup pg as expected, and BD looks like he’ll be a major upgrade over his 08’ self. Craig Smith, solid.
Enter Rasual. Another guy who can light it up from the perimeter and also play defense, like EJ, is a key addition.
DeAndre is a completely different player…switching out Mike Taylor for Blake Griffin as his BFF could really pay some huge dividends.
All of this is well and good, but the defense was the most impressive thing to me. The ball movement was also much better than average. Lotta dimes, gotta love it. Chemistry looks good on this team right now, they pass the eye ball test.
I wound up sitting accross the aisle from Kevin Pritchard. Make no mistake, him and his entourage were intense about the game. Yelling at refs, warning players when there was someone behind them. You could tell Portland was keyed up when they cut the lead to 4 and Aldridge was on fire. So I don’t believe this was anything like the Mirage of the Lakers Clippers preseason game last year…think what we saw tonight was a lot closer to reality. Running mixed with half court sets, emphasis on defense and plenty of talented players with a pretty well rounded roster that all seem to get along really well.
On a more positive note, the thing I liked about tonight’s game was that every time Portland closed the gap, the Clips found a way to respond. Sounds so simple, yet maintaining a lead in the second half was so difficult for this team last year.
"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted" – Albert Einstein
by Another son of Mike Smith on Oct 10, 2009 12:54 AM PDT reply actions
+1
'Cause how you play, is how you'll be remembered. PLAY LOUD!
by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Oct 10, 2009 5:19 AM PDT up reply actions
Totally agree
As an extension of your point, I was equally as impressed with the 30 point first quarter. Too many times last season the Clips would end the first quarter down by six to ten and never recover.
The defense was the most impressive part of the game tonight, but a close second would be the fluid nature of the offense. On less than half a dozen occasions did the Clips settle for a jumper after a particular play had broken down. I have to give a lot of credit to Al Thornton tonight, he played within the offense and only once did he resort to a couple pump fakes and an ill advised jumper.
With all that said, this is a very different looking team. I’m excited for this season.
One exception
The third quarter was a bit troublesome on offense I thought. I think there were five or six jumpers by Kaman and Camby, several deep in the shot clock after a poor offensive possessions. It’s great that we have some bigs who can make that shot, but during the third the offense looked a little stagnant to me.
But that’s one of the few quibbles I have with the game.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
I Agree
And it was a certain unit that was on the floor that you could tell might have some trouble. I can’t exactly remember who was out there, but it was really Kaman who made the clutch buckets at the right time.
Might be the one issue with this team. Lot of good players, but who’s the go to guy who can create his own shot?
BG,
Take it easy, I nearly had flashbacks of Livy.
Overall everyone played really well, Baron looks in great shape. Actually, I thought Baron was malnourished. The clippers were playing the passer on the pick n roll really tough, I guess this was highlighted by KA in clipperblog.
Biggest props goes to Telfair, he had the team humming when BD sat down. The team continued run when possible and made good passes.
Telfair was great
There is no way that he is 6 foot. He may not be a great shooter, but he can handle the rock.
If he could just become a decent shooter it would help him alot
Guys like Avery Johnson and Rafer Alston worked to become at least respectable outside shooters, it would really change the dynamic of his play if he became a halfway decent shooter.
Still, he’s better than the average backup PG so we should be happy to have him.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions
If he's racking up 6-10 assists that's ok by me
Means he’s at least creating for others and shows he can control the offense while Baron is on the bench.
by dulciusEXasperis on Oct 10, 2009 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions
He was there...
But Dunleavy iced him, Skinner and Roberson. Roberson I get, but Ricky D and Skinner should have gone in there at the end unless there is something I dont know (i.e. injury or activation status). Both were definately fully dressed.
Ricky
Last night at the game Andy Roeser came up to us and asked us what the Fire Dunleavy guys were chanting. At the time they were saying “We want Ricky”, so when we told him he told us Ricky wasn’t going to play tonight because he wanted to see some of the other guys get some PT.
Thanks for sharing
My assumption Ricky, Mardy and Skinner was that they just wanted to see other guys. Those guys all got decent minutes in the first pre-season game (partly because of injuries to Telfair, BG and Camby). It’s hard enough to manage a 9 man rotation, pretty impossible to do a 17 man. I assume they go into the game planning that some guys won’t play.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions
Dunleavy Protesters
They were shut up under orders from the Clippers not Staples Center. It’s not Ok. It’s not a private event, people pay for their tickets. Security are off duty and on duty cops. One police officer in plain clothes has been sitting at the end of or right behind Clipper bench for many years. He’s always cool but always on the scene with ticket holders booing the Clippers and specifically people booing and heckling Donald a/k/a “Owner Superior” Sterling.
you are right that it should not be illegal
but it is incredibly childish and annoying to everyone else trying to watch the game. I am all for getting rid of Dunleavy but don’t stoop to the antics of a 3 year old who isn’t getting his way.
In Gordon we trust
by bestclipfan on Oct 10, 2009 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions
It is a private event
and if you read the back of the ticket it has those rules where management reserves the right to remove fans.
I was at the Dodgers game a few years back when Bonds was about to break the home run record and a dozen fans in our section alone were getting thrown out for yelling at Bonds.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Thouhts
From listening on the radio—Milph in good form throughout.
Great first quarter. Steals, energy, fast breaks, BDavis very active. Not surprising, as the Clips wanted to come out strong in the debut on the home floor, and they knew they had to do better after undermanned squad lost to GSW. Made me think that BDavis did a similar thing last year, and then was hurt in the next game. Maybe it’s not that he was in such bad shape, but that he expected to get into shape in the preseason, and play his way into it, didn’t count on getting hurt. This time, apparently, he’s fit.
Kaman’s quick fouls messed a bit with the rotation. Was bringing in DJordan for him a surprise? Somehow I get a feeling that maybe Dunleavy likes bringing Griffin in off the bench just a little bit too much already. Maybe he just wants to get some of his money’s worth back from not getting to see a healthy Kaman and Camby together very much last year. But DJordan was a great move, and it shows that he’s too good to be ignored.
Reading around yesterday, Blazer fans are pretty geeked about Oden, and Ralph was pushing his new level of fitness and activity pretty hard. But Sac didn’t have a lot to put in his way, and Kaman-DJordan slowed him down quite a bit.
The fact that Kaman came back in the second half and had a strong 3rd period, made shots and plays and turned back a Blazers run, is also a nice bit of news. He won’t be up a Gred Oden every night either.
All of which is another way of saying that the Clips have a lot going on did a really nice job of establishing themselves on their home floor, against a contending, 50+ win team, before Blake Griffin even got up off the bench. He was part of a bench that kept all sorts of pressure on the Blazers and just always seemed to have more weapons.
The Clips didn’t get the three ball going, and the Blazers used it to stay in the game during the first three quarters.
It also seemed like the fast breaks—and there were a lot of them—came off of steals and blocks, not so much rebound and run. But it’s hard to tell.
Nice home debut.
Maybe Griffin's presence and the possibility of losing playing time will
light a fire under Kaman
It's not just Griffin--DJordan too
Listening to the game, the big thing was all of the talk about Oden, and there was a lot of it in Blazerland too after he plowed through Sactown in their first two games. And it seemed like same old same old Kaman, picking up two quick fouls and sitting down. For the Blazers, and even Ralph as a commentator, there was a question out there: has Oden turned into a monster, a Dwight Howard, is he, along with adding Andre Miller in the backcourt, going to make Portland a top flight team?
Dunleavy could have brought Griffin in right here, in the first couple of minutes. This would have gotten the crowd fired up. It would have put Camby on Oden and Griffin on Aldridge. Instead he went with DJordan. And this was pretty awesome. I think Oden got another dunk right away and a rebound, but DJordan stepped up nicely and made a bunch of plays, and the next thing you know the Clippers were rolling, led by their defense, steals by BDavis, getting deflections. Camby was keeping Aldridge quiet, Gordon was doing his best with Brandon Roy.
The fact is that DJordan is fairly comparable to Oden at this point. He might not have the same strength, but he has the same length and greater athleticism.
And then, just as you have surmised, Kaman had a big 3rd quarter.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions
Oden was great at cleaning up the Off glass or miscues on the PnR
but when it came down to one on one offense, I was less than impressed.
I have to give some love to Telfair, it is definitely day and night when he’s running the 2nd unit vs. Mardy. He was pushing the ball, moving it around and getting it to the right person.
Yeah
It’s important to remember that MCollins is a third string, stopgap measure. I’d much rather see him playing the wing as a defender, and playing ahead of Ricky Davis. But I suppose we should see first if Davis has any of his old mojo back.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 10, 2009 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions
Good point about DJordan
He seems ready to go now. He came in and outplayed Oden I guess.
great post
How about giving credit to mdsr for getting on the same page as his players and seeing the results with baron and co. playing their asses off in a meaningless game. Last year when I attended a few games, it was very demoralizing to hear the fans chant “fire Dunleavy”. It sends a bad signal to Blake and EJ, DJ to know the fans dislike their coach. If the season is a bust, then i can understand it. But its only preseason and the improvements are already apparent.
Hard sell here
The team pretty much quit on him last year and the majority of CN was outside Playa Vista with pitchforks and torches.
That said it is a new year and like it or not our aspirations for this team are tied to MDSr success and failure. We do know if the team bombs again he’ll finally be removed but if we do play pretty well then the next great discussion is whether they will extend his deal.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions
It’s all subjective and thus open to opinion, but I think you’re confusing “the majority of CN” with “the majority of those who post the most often or the speak the loudest on CN.” Many people who read this site choose not to post at all, or they post only sporadically. You can’t extrapolate from this sample set – a statistician would tell you that is a no-no if you want to reach an accurate conclusion.
Last night’s game was a case in point. How many people chose to participate in the FD chant? I think I heard four. And how many chose NOT to participate in the FD chant? Everyone else. Yet a disproportionate number of comments in this post reference the chants (mine included). Does that mean that a disproportionate number of fans would be lined up outside of Playa Vista? Or even want MDSr fired? The latter group is what politicians refer to as the “silent majority”. When the chanters stop chanting, you can listen very hard and hear them….
Relatedly, for those who think that a paying event is a public event, you might wish to bone up on your Constitutional Law class to understand the difference between the two. Any basketball game is a private event (paid tickets or not), and the rights to free speech afforded private events are much more limited than those for public events.
If the Clips choose not to kick those guys out, it’s because the team (or the NBA, more likely) has its own reasons. But it’s not because their rights to free speech are being infringed.
"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted" – Albert Einstein
by Another son of Mike Smith on Oct 10, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Wasn't there a poll?
Last year? Pretty sure the majority chose to oust him.
Obviously we as fans don’t delve as deeply into the financial reports as ownerships. They obviously saw that they already committed large sums of money to MDSr and would hate to have to pay him to sit at home in addition to adding another highly compensated executive to be the GM and head coach.
Anyways, we beat this poor horse to death months ago, MDSr’s seat is probably warm for the first time in awhile but he’ll get a good run before the team would take drastic action.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Um, you have it backwards
The vast majority on CN who post regularly are completely supportive of MDSr as coach. I really was the lone voice in the wilderness out there for many months giving what I believe to be sound critiques of MDSr’s coaching style. Aside from Firedunleavy’s nonsense.
So no, no one is drowning the MDSr lovers out.
There was a poll and there is clearly a clear silent majority who wanted to ax him. Or there was last year.
Obviously MDSr is going to get another chance now. We’ll see how it goes. Don’t confuse those who logically believe the guy is a bad coach (really, there’s no question he is a bad coach, but I digress) with people who choose to chant at a game.
You’re right about the fact that technically their free speech isn’t being infringed. There’s nothing wrong with fans expressing their fandom in ways that may be different than you. There’s no need for the condescension (“you might want to bone up on . . .”)
You seem a little bitter.
Jax, nobody is bitter.
And I don’t view my post as condescending but if you do, then so be it. We’re all entitled to differences of opinion but that wasn’t the point that was raised nor the one I was attempting to address. The only point that I was making was that people would be better served speaking from facts that are accurate. You rail on John R regularly about the facts that he uses (or doesn’t use) to support his position. I’m ok with that. Why are you railing on me for reminding people of that? You’re looking to stir up trouble where none exists.
"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted" – Albert Einstein
by Another son of Mike Smith on Oct 10, 2009 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Actually
Your post was factually incorrect regarding opinions on this site. I didn’t rail on you, I just pointed that out. Sort of ironic since you say in your post that you think people would be better served speaking from facts that are accurate. I agree with your point, but not your post.
So let’s be factually accurate here. The fact that four guys are acting stupidly at a game who happen not to like MDSr’s coaching doesn’t mean that most people love MDSr’s coaching. I could quote your statistician sentence back to you but I don’t think it’s necessary.
Oh, and I don’t rail on John R regularly. I think you have it backwards. If you look at the post history, he generally rails on me.
The fact that only
Thanks Jax...
I love a board like this…all I say is that those guys had a right (and a good point) and I get insulted like I just burned a cross…
I appreciate level-headed debate but the venom spewed in this forum is repulsive.
Not a problem
Your post above is correct. There are a few vociferous people on this site who thnk their opinions are the only valid ones. Ignore their nonsense. You were insulted because of their insecurities. For the most part, the site is great.
Observations
I saw the guy ASOMS was describing go up and talk to the fire Dunleavy guys in the first quarter. It didn’t seem to have much effect. I was at the Dodger game on Thursday and they kicked out 4 guys the row in front of me for what they said was foul language. I hadn’t heard them yell anything. Dodger security is a lot more heavy handed than Staples. Poor guys missed the great ending.
Some of my observations watching the game:
They were looking to run whenever they had the chance, even had Kaman and Camby leading the break a few of times which mostly led to turnovers. Sure is nice to get some easy baskets.
Team defense looked much better in general. Camby was particularly active showing on the picks up top. My only negative was Andre Miller getting to the basket too much, but that is his game. I would rather make him shoot his weak perimeter shot. DJ did have a great block on Miller.
Telfair looked very capable of running the point. Hopefully he will be able to knock down some shots.
DJ is going to break out this year. He actually did a great post move on Oden spinning to the middle from the right block to lay one in.
Baron looks in terrific shape, probably that P90X he was doing this summer.
I agree about Griffin, if he doesn’t tone it down a bit, he will get banged up over the course of an 82 game season. That being said he is great to have out there. He brings so much energy.
Craig Smith was very impressive. Great physical presence and can score. He made some tough shots.Does he have a nickname? I would suggest “the bull”.
As for the Blazers Aldridge was very impressive. Looks like an all star. Makes that turn around jumper look so easy.
Oden doesn’t impress me. No offensive game. I’d rather have DJ, much more upside.
Andre Miller does a good job getting to the basket, but I think Roy doesn’t play well off him at this point. Maybe just an off night for Roy.
All in all, I great preseason game for the Clips. Hope is alive and well.
another nickname of his is
Cookie Monster.
I prefer Rhino msyelf.
by Lawler 4ever on Oct 10, 2009 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Oden vs DJ
Much more upside? About the same age, Oden’s actually done more so far in their careers as well. Let’s not become like Faker fans and grossly overvalue our players. I love DJ’s potential but its at about the same level as Oden’s.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll take it...
“I love DJ’s potential but its at about the same level as Oden’s.”
I hope this is true…but maybe even this is still a bit bullish!
anything even remotely close would be great..lest we forget he was a second rounder and Oden was #1.
Yea
It could be more of a matter that DJ’s been healthy (knock on wood) and Oden had a serious injury that brought them closer. Both players are still pretty limited on offense but can be a force on D and the glass.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Keep in mind
and (this is opinionated) that coming into the league, Lebron kinda relied on potential whereas Melo relied more on skills. Blah blah blah, I’ll probably get flamed for what I just said, but comon, a highschool kid over a star at Syracuse?
Anyways, coming into the nba, DJ was a 5 or 6 star recruit. DJ has a ton of potential, now all he has to do is work hard to fulfill it.
DJ wasn't that highly regarded coming in
hence falling all the way to the 2nd round.
He was a 5 star recruit going into college but had a very poor freshmen year in where he didn’t even dominate on a mediocre college team. Oden in comparison helped take a freshmen heavy team (Daequan Cook and Mike Conley Jr.) all the way to the title game where they lost to defending champ Florida which had a lot of 1st round picks (Horford, Brewer, Noah not to mention Chris Richards, Taureen Green).
DJ was so bad in college people questioned his work ethic since its pretty obvious the physical tools were there. It looks like falling so far in the draft ultimately helped him as it let him know he’d have to put in the work to make it. One can only wonder if he got a fat 1st round contract if he would have progressed so much.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 11, 2009 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Same Class as Griffin
And Gordon and Derrick Rose, OJ Mayo, etc.
It’s a pretty amazing sequence. Oden is the year before. When he won the NCAA title he looked like he was at least 30 years old. It was a maturity thing in part, but he was so big and so dominant. He came out with Kevin Durant, of course, and Portland had a tough call.
DJ has a playful, gregarious personality, and he was so tall and fairly athletic that he probably thought the game would come easy to him. He didn’t get it, and needed to grow up. I think there were details about the snowball of going into the draft and expecting to be a high lottery pick, how the train had left the station and he thought that the college stop was relatively insignificant. It’s funny how it’s just the opposite of Blake Griffin, who felt that he had more work to do in order to flourish and succeed as a pro, and he stayed focused and worked hard and became an obvious number one pick. The Clips were very fortunate. Eric Gordon was probably a tad young and he had an injury in his year in college and he dropped out of the top three, and the Clips were lucky to get him. DJ’s drop was an amazing thing, in retrospect. And the really bizarre twist is that Griffin and DJ are now on the same team, and they appear to be extremely complementary to each other, in terms of termperment, which could be an exciting thing to watch develop on the court over time. As Griffin’s sidekick, DJ’s growth has started to race ahead, and Griffin has only been a Clipper for 3 months, and they just played their first NBA game, although they clearly had a great time and made huge strides in summer league. Griffin is going to get acclimated and establish himself, and DJ is going to get better and better. It seems like his growth is going to be sharply accelerated because of the arrival of Griffin. It’s a challenge to him, coming at just the right time, when he’s ready for it.
Jordan could have just as easily gone the way of some true Clipper classics, guys like Stanley Roberts or Benoit Benjamin, even Olowokandi. It’s a completely different era with Dunleavy, of course, but last year was so ugly, and Jordan’s first year contained some of the darkest days in Cliphistory, and that’s saying something. DJ was mostly a mess last year, promising at times, but generally clueless. Now he’s in a perfect spot, with Kaman and Camby carrying most of the load, Griffin just getting started, and he’s rising fast but at his own pace.
With Griffin’s help and the solid Clipper roster and the new, suddenly fertile chemistry, who knows, he may catch Oden.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 11, 2009 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Baron looked Ripped in the highlights i saw
i was kind of shocked, i mean i heard he was in shape but.. wow
Was he really on the P90X program? because that shit is intense!
Andre Miller
In my notes about the game, I wrote “effective and efficient” about Miller. He’s been such a solid pro his entire career – it just makes it all the more frustrating that he was so ineffective as a Clipper. Really strange.
But one thing I noted during the game – the Blazers played Jerryd Bayless at shooting guard when he was in. This was always with a second unit, and the Clippers had Butler at the two at the time. So as it happens, Butler and Telfair matched up a couple of times against either Bayless and Blake or Bayless and Miller (when Miller re-entered). If you check the play-by-play, most of Miller’s baskets came when Baron and EJ were out.
So, what’s the takeaway? We like to think that Butler is going to be a capable wing defender, but he can’t really guard point guards, which is what he was trying to do. Had it been a real game, I think MDsr would have brought either EJ or Baron back to matchup better, but as it was pre-season, he just went with it.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions
More on Miller
Not sure exactly why or what started it, but I headed over to BlazersEdge yesterday and hung out for awhile—Newtybar showed up there too. I guess I wanted to see what the reaction was to the game, how they were processing things.
I could do the long version—which would be a fanpost I suppose—, but to cut to the chase, after discussing Oden and DJordan and the Clipper bigs, and noting that they were less than overwhelmed, and even skeptical, about Blake Superiour, I started working the Andre Miller vein, which is a pretty rich topic up there.
It could go either way with Miller and the Blazers. As Clipper fans, we (or at least I) have a jaundiced view of Miller. It’s hard to say whether he’s going to be the right fit for them. And then there’s the Bayless element of the equation. It’s pretty complex, and I’m curious about what their attitude was towards Miller when he was signed—and he was the third or fourth free agent that they went after.
Milph had some interesting comments about him on the radio. One of them said, in retrospect, that the Clippers went from being the most social and socially cohesive team, with Darius Miles, that they could remember, to the least, and how Miller never talked to anybody the entire year. Mike Smith talked about having a conversation with him, and Ralph said that he must have talked to him more before that game than they ever had the entire time he was with the Clippers. Now, apparently, he’s talking a bit more and said to the media that he never would have come to Portland if he wasn’t automatically a starter, that he’s a top PG and has nothing to prove, etc. The question is how he fits with Brandon Roy and the other Blazers. Pretty interesting stuff.
by citizen zhiv on Oct 11, 2009 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Awesome stuff
Thanks for everyone who got to the see the action first hand posting their observations….
The point guards (Baron Davis and Sebastian Telfair) combined for 18 assists against only 3 turnovers, which is just outstanding.
A line like that really fires me up.
Also
Bassy on his own had a 10:1 A:T and a 3:1 S:T. Amazing numbers. All-Star Caliber numbers.
http://lucasnbablog.blogspot.com/
My observations
Keyword is DEPTH. This team is so deep it is incredible. At any position with the second unit, I don’t have any fears of either losing a lead or falling behind. Even moreso concerning, in my fantasy draft I can see myself picking up Clippers for half my roster (of course I wouldn’t do this as I am in a head to head…but I’m tempted).
Standouts -
DJ – I’ve been bullish on DJ since he was drafted and it is great to see him panning out. As much as CS said BG brings to the game, I think DJ does as well. There’s a certain amount of energy he brings when he steps on the court. He’s excited to be out there and if I can feel it in the stands, I’m sure his teammates can feel it as well. Blocks, altering shots, running up the floor for a dunk, man it’s just great to see.
Bassy – man, I think he’s my favorite player of the night. He looked composed and solid throughout. Very active and wow can I say beautiful passes?! Did anyone see that stutter step spin then dish to DJ?! I think this is a good team for him to run even in the second unit he can pass it to ALL FOUR OTHER POSITIONS (again deep) and expect them to finish it. He just needs to work on his shot. Call me crazy, but I think he was the best move we made all summer.
Griffin – He brought the energy. I also think he was great on defense and knew where to be at the right times. Very savvy and high intuition on D this early in his career is special. He sometimes tried to do too much (first game) and at other times scared the crap out of me. Leaping over the table and hitting the floor HARD (I think the entire stadium gasped) at another time. He’s full octane.
EJ – So efficient. No explanation needed.
Sual – Didn’t look good early on, but didn’t get down on himself and stayed active. He made some stuff happen later on and got the motor going. Good stuff for him.
AT – He’s still ball stopping. MOVE THE BALL AT.
General Observations:
+ Team played great defense
+ great amount of energy and very active
+ DEPTH – we can hang at every position
+ Griffin puts the pedal to the metal on every play, only 100% effort applies
- Griffin puts the pedal to the metal on every play, only 100% effort applies – please
don’t get injured.
- I don’t know if I saw a different BD then everyone else, but I wasn’t impressed. Yes
he was very active with a lot of deflections and looked in great shape…BUT and this
is a big but… I don’t see the BOOM DIZZLE anymore. I really think he has lost a step
and will no longer be the player we signed him to be. However, I hope he evolves
and becomes even better in that veteran Steve Nash kind of way.
- AT is still ballstopping. He made his shots, but the entire offense just stops when
the ball gets in his hands.
MEGA MINUS – Firedunleavy.com continues to haunt us long after he left this board. Idiotic and inappropriate. I get it, you want Dunleavy fired. That’s fine. But theres appropriate times to chant. Otherwise it is just annoying. I wouldn’t mind it if we were losing and bad subs were being made or bad play calls. To chant while we are winning? Idiotic. The entire game they were chanting and it was ruining my enjoyment of the game.
On that note I nominate the nick for BG - Blake "Super Unleaded" Griffin.
by Newton Pham on Oct 10, 2009 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions
You're crazy
For thinking Telfair is the best move of the summer. Drafting Griffin, trading ZBo and acquiring Butler for nothing were better moves. Arguably Craig “Rhino” Smith was the better piece of the trade as well.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 11, 2009 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes
I ran into him outside of the stadium. He said he was really excited about the upcoming season. Clipper Darryl also mentioned that his chants (and a voice close to his) appears in NBA 2K10, he was pretty bummed about it, thinking that it was blatantly modeled after him but never being consulted or compensated.
Please Don't Expose Your Lack of Knowledge
It didn’t take long for some idiot to cite the 1st Amendment. Don’t use it unless you’ve at least READ IT. If you had, you’d notice the first five words, “CONGRESS shall make no law…”
Last time I checked, the Clippers were not members of either house. Although Congress and the Clippers have made some questionable decisions over the years….
I'll get back to you on that
Clipper Darrell is two rows in front of me, so far its amusing but he does stand up a lot and block our view from time to time. Maybe I’ll find it less amusing in the future but right now he’s adding to the experience.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions
He only annoys me when he starts the wave
Better bone up on your dance moves b/c you’ll be on the jumbotron all year, clipperchuck
Ugh
You know, I have wanted to choke him and other days shake his hand. At least the dudes were funny last night, if the Clippers want to shut them up, start winning.
by sqrebck on Oct 10, 2009 5:30 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Thats the thing
it’s plain classless to chant demeaningly when THE CLIPPERS ARE UP BY 20
http://lucasnbablog.blogspot.com/
And they were funny...
I especially liked:
“600 Lossses!!”
“Korolev! Daaaaaaniel Ewwwwing!!!”
and
“Weeeee waaaaant Riiiiicky!!!”
Hmm what kind of moves though
Should probably start off with Yoga first so I don’t pull anything. Of course if I drink a dozen beers each game it won’t matter what I try to pull off.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 10, 2009 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions
did you have your cell?
could have tweeted or facebook’ed the game…
Roger Sterling: To my knees, Don. They're bringing to my knees!"
Not on MY cell phone
No full keyboard… I would have missed the whole game trying to tweet. My iPod touch was also in my computer bag, so I didn’t have that.
Just a rookie mistake and I apologize. It will be better next time.
FYI, Lisa Dillman (real_lisa) and Kevin (clipperblog) were both Tweeting, so you should be following them. As for me, if I have my laptop, I’ll be working the game thread, not the Twitter. Game thread is just easier to use, and has the conversation part built in.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions
You made no mention that you’d be “reporting” at the game (at least I didn’t see it). I was following KA’s live tweets and I’ll add Lisa to the list…will you be reporting most of the home games this season?
Roger Sterling: To my knees, Don. They're bringing to my knees!"
by Lawler's Law on Oct 11, 2009 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Don't know
If I am at the game, I will definitely live blog it. But with a wife and 2 kids, I’m not sure how many of the games I’ll go to. If I’m home, I’ll probably watch on the TiVo on delay. What I’ll try to do is tell you before games what my plan is. For instance, for Warriors tomorrow night, I will not be going (so far, the Clippers home schedule is completely synced up with my soccer practice schedule – Mondays and Fridays – in fact, the game after that has a 4:30 Saturday start versus Utah, and Zoe has a game at 3:15, so I’ll miss that one also – sheesh.)
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 6:00 PM PDT up reply actions
too bad this ain't a "real" paying gig for ya...
should make every citizen more appreciative of your time and effort you put into this site…
Roger Sterling: To my knees, Don. They're bringing to my knees!"
by Lawler's Law on Oct 11, 2009 6:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Can I have your press pass?
I’ll start campaigning for Blake Superior then. My voice can be bought.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 11, 2009 8:19 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm new here...
But I’m pretty sure they frown on sharing press passes.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Oct 11, 2009 9:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Haha
I was kidding, worth a shot ;)
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Oct 12, 2009 2:22 AM PDT up reply actions
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