Question of Priority: Who's The Man?

by SilverClip on Oct 30, 2009 2:25 PM PDT Comment 19 comments

SUBTITLE: Is winning NOW what's most important?

I'm sure I've never been so upset over an early season loss as last Wednesday's Phoenix game. It gave me vivid flashbacks of last year's team, as well as a few personal high school upsets that I'd rather forget. I walked around the city for over an hour afterwards, just trying to cool off.

I've read most of the comments in SP's follow-up posts, and I agree with most of what's being said. The refs missed a few calls, we missed a lot of free throws, we had trouble executing at the end, there was one glaring defensive breakdown, and most of all Steve Nash killed us with precision shooting. I should say, I don't place much blame on coach Dun. True, some of the sets could look sharper, but the more basic problem is that many teams (like the Suns) have a great go-to guy, and we don't. I spent most of my post-game walk thinking about it.

It looks like EJ is being groomed for the roll, but we should agree that it's going to take him some time. Griffin will also eventually take charge at crunch time, but not in the near future. In the interim, then, my question becomes, "Should we keep calling the youngsters' numbers at game's end, win or lose?" In other words, when push comes to shove, should our priority be TO WIN RIGHT NOW OR TO WORK TOWARDS THE FUTURE?

These don't have to be mutually exclusive (EJ is going to make some clutch shots, for instance), but there will be times when it means a real difference to our lineups and play calling. At the end of the game, for instance, perhaps AT should be in there rather than Butler. During the 4th quarter, maybe EJ should get more shots. When Griffin comes back, should he or one of the vets be sitting at crunch time? Should Novak get more or less playing time? Should Baron's role be constrained (or the Baron-Kaman tandem, for instance) for the sake of giving our young guys more crunch time responsibility?

Some of this may be beside the point, because really, if EJ doesn't take the big shot, then who does? BD? Butler? Kaman? Gordon may simply be our best option. But over the last 24 hours, I've been thinking that Gordon is out best option this year EVEN IF WE LOSE MORE OFTEN THAT WAY. In the future, to be a real contender, we'll certainly need him to grow into a much better option. I won't mind his near-misses this year- I'd even encourage them- as long as they're part of a bigger game plan.

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For that game

the only other option that would have made sense is Kaman. He was on fire in the 4th. Otherwise, i have no problem with drawing up a play for Gordon to end the game. Gordon will figure it out, they got the switch was and Gordon could have and should have driven to the rim.

I don’t think anyone else is better at this point. Gordon is the Clippers best scorer.

by Michael White on Oct 30, 2009 3:15 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The point is larger than just EJ

He’s our best shooter, for instance, but he wasn’t the main one shooting in the 4th. And rightly so, as BD to Kaman was our best chance of winning.

But I’m thinking, there will probably be times this year when winning should not be our top priority. That is, let the youngsters take a more leading role, even if it hurts are chances in some games. I’ve been so keyed on making the playoffs, but as we really don’t have a developed go-to guy, and as Blake’s out, I’m more with SP now, that we may be in for something not-so-grand this year. In that case, perhaps we should prioritize the future.

Again, this is about more than just who takes the last shot.

by SilverClip on Oct 30, 2009 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

there will probably be times this year when winning should not be our top priority

For me, that moment doesn’t come until we are sure we’re not going to the playoffs. Until that point, you play to win the games.

by Michael White on Oct 30, 2009 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gordon

Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)

by mikey p on Oct 30, 2009 3:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I second that

"I always believe there's a reason why you go through everything." -John Elway

by LACK on Oct 30, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Baron

I’m sorry but the ball should be in Baron’s hands if you care about trying to win this year. Why? Because he can score AND create. mwhite mentioned above that EJ is our best scorer. That may be true, but he’s clearly not much of a distributor. And unless you’re an unstoppable scorer like Jordan or Kobe (which EJ is clearly not), you have to be able to do both at the end of games.

Beyond that, I think we all know that this team THIS YEAR will go as far as Baron goes. What concerns me is that because Dunleavy obviously doesn’t know how to maximize Baron’s abilities, he’s instead going away from Baron and sticking him in the corner at the end of games (that’s what it seemed like at least based on 1 game…which could be an anomaly).

Baron is the best all-around player on this team. No he hasn’t shown it in a Clippers uniform, and if you want to argue that he’s lost it, I can understand that. But in terms of all-around skill and ability, Baron is ahead of everyone else on this team. No other Clipper can handle the ball like him, create for others, break his man down, and score in a variety of ways. He also has big game experience. Now again, he’s shown NONE of that as a Clipper. But we all know the player he was before he got here. I maintain that Dunleavy’s system has stripped him of his confidence and effectiveness.

If we’re talking about the future, then yea, I understand grooming EJ to take on that role. And maybe that’s what’s really important, seeing what kind of future we have with EJ and BG and what we really have in EJ.

But for the short term, I think this team will struggle to win close games if Dun refuses to adjust and find a way to maximize Baron’s talents.

by madglove on Oct 30, 2009 4:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't mean to turn this into

a Dunleavy discussion, but the system the Clips are running doesn’t seem to have limited Sebastian Telfair’s ability to push the tempo and create for others.

Baron is distributing the ball fairly well, and he is showing effort on the defensive end (10assists, 3.5 steals, 1.5 blocks looks great in the stat sheet) but he is really struggling to get to the rim and his jumper just isnt working.

I agree with you on two points, the Clippers need Baron to be the man (I think he needs to be scoring at least 18ppg for us to win consistently) and so far he hasn’t shown the ability to do so. But I see zero correlation between his game and the system he is playing in. Baron Davis needs to be able to take Steve Nash off the dribble, and through 2 games he hasnt shown the ability to do that. For that very reason I think EJ was definitely the best option at the end of the game. Clips got the switch, Ej needs to put the ball on the floor. Live and learn.

And boy do I miss Sammy too. Sam I Am and Kaman would destroy teams with the pick and pop the way Chris is shooting the ball this year.

by johnnyoc21 on Oct 30, 2009 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Btw good post

It’s something I’ve been thinking about as well and has been brought up recently by others.

I definitely miss Sammy. It was nice having that kind of closer on the team for once.

by madglove on Oct 30, 2009 4:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Sam really made the difference

I’d love to see Baron take the reigns and become a closer of similar caliber. And I think you’re right, that we’ll go as far Baron takes us. He’s our best all around player. But can he close? Show us the money, Baron! Energy and athleticism will keep you in a game, but at the end it takes something more. Nash really had it last game.

Count me among the skeptical. I hope you’re right that it’s mostly a matter of coach and player getting on the same, best page together. That’s something that could be worked out.

by SilverClip on Oct 30, 2009 4:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

3 years ago

who would have thought that Sammy would contribute more on our team than Baron? True, its different systems, but really now???

by JackduhSun on Oct 30, 2009 10:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like

AL in some of the clutch spots. I have seen him make clutch shots for the last two years, because he was the only one ofn the team playing well enough to make em. I just trust him to make his own shot, and thats what you need.

by ClipperMyth on Oct 30, 2009 4:37 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Not Al

these past 3 games, he’s been horrible. I’m starting ro regret buying that Al Thornton jersey…

by JackduhSun on Oct 30, 2009 10:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

EJ needs more shots in the 4th!

In the game at Utah, I want to say that they ran maybe 3 plays for EJ. He has a great third quarter, but they decided to go through Kaman in the 4th. It doesnt make any sense unless Kaman is going to pass out of double teams. If he learns to pass the ball then we can go through Kaman. I would really just like to see EJ have the plays called for him, but I doubt we see that just yet.

by NBAFAN8 on Oct 30, 2009 10:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Agree

"Excellence...is not an act, but a habit" Aristotle

by Cliptomaniac on Oct 30, 2009 11:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with ClipperMyth, I have confidence in AL

Al has not been getting the ball to create his own shots in any of the last 3 games. Kaman has had far more ISO plays than AL has had. Al is a player who needs a few shots to get in rhythm, once he has that he is a force. The wings in general are not getting the ball enough (Gordon, Thorton, Butler) and I think this is the reason why we are losing games, not enough ball movement on the perimeter to create open jumpshots.
Al has been forgotten as an offensive threat and yes he is a blackhole at times but he knows how to finish, which is severely lacking on this team. In this last quarter against Utah Al was the only agressive player on the floor and although he couldn’t make a shot to save his life he still had 8 points from free throws, not to mention the only player who looked like he still wanted a win.
Baron Davis is the worst player to have the ball on the last possession on this team. In the third quarter he took 3 possessions by himself to throw up hideous shots at the end of the quarter that were no where close to going in, 35% is not clutch…period.
Gordon NEEDS to be the the go to player in the clutch!

by ChrisPaulFTW on Oct 31, 2009 2:06 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Wouldn't agree Baron is worse player at all

Depending on what we are up against on the floor, Baron needs to read that and decide whether we go into CK or out to EJ or whether to drive and try and get the bucket and the foul or the kick out.

We pay him to lead this team and as long as he doesn’t chuck up the Davis brick with 18 secs on the shot clock, we have to trust him to do this. Yep, Eric is the number one option but we should have the best shooters/finishers on the floor at this point and that isn’t Al Thornton in my opinion. He’s too erratic. I worry when he gets the ball in the 2nd let alone the 4th as I know his shot selection can be as poor as Barons

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Oct 31, 2009 2:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

alright

This is the Baron Davis paradox. He is definitely the best play maker on the floor. He is also the worst shooter. How do we trust Baron not to huck up a hideous fade away 20 foot jumper anytime the clock is at 30 seconds or less. I can’t even count how many air balls i’ve seen come out of his hand when the quarter is coming to a close. HE NEEDS TO STOP SHOOTING…and start making plays :) I don’t care how much we are paying him because he’s not doing his job.

by ChrisPaulFTW on Oct 31, 2009 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs