A chip in the big game
by citizen bob on Feb 1, 2009 1:19 PM PST
18 comments
I know Dunleavy is stating that no further trades will take place this year, and I understand his very logical reasoning. We cannot, however, allow a potential difference maker to get traded and not even make an attempt to bring him over here. The difference maker I am referring to is Amare Stoudemire. We have all seen this guy dominate the Clippers – kind of like the way Chris Webber dominated the Clippers. Phoenix is tanking badly and looking to jettison players (including Stoudemire) for a combination of young studs, high draft picks and a replacement starter big man. We all know they are going to get lowballed from every team in the NBA. Let’s hope the Clippers offer fair value and win the race. The trade would probably be:
Chris Kaman + Al Thornton + the worse of our two 2011 first rounders to Phoenix in exchange for Amare Stoudemire and Alando Tucker.
Phoenix gets a starting center to replace Stoudemire and hold them over until Lopez matures and Shaq retires. They also get a young stud in Al Thornton who can become a go to scorer similar to Grant Hill in his prime (but not as good). The draft picks are negotiable but in order to get Amare I personally would be very flexible (including this year’s high draft pick).
I am not saying we should act foolishly and/or hastily, I am just saying that a front line of Amare and Randolph, backed up by Camby and Skinner seems very imposing to me. Once Thornton is gone, Novak can become the starter and be backed up by Ricky Davis. When Novak is on the floor he gets lots of attention and still seems to find a way of getting his shots. With a starting lineup featuring Amare, Zach, Eric and Baron – Novak will instantly become the most ignored guy in all of basketball. He is going to rain down the three balls. Our bench is weaker offensively than most (not including the rookie we get this year) but defensively we will be great – spearheaded by Camby, Taylor, Collins, Davis and Skinner. Our team will be complete and we will finally have a chance of winning a Championship. We need to be in it to win it and I think our bid is stronger than any others in the Amare Sweepstakes. Please Mike bring in Amare.
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i honestly am not sure i like this trade...
first as much as i like amare, he plays very little defense. besides he hates playing center, and zach isn’t really a center.
so are we playing zach off the bench with camby and amare starting (and thus having no one with a post up game playing?). amare would probably pout adn turn into a cancer off the bench, and if you trade al thornton, i really dont think its that wise to start novak, unless you have a post player who can kick it out to him (i..e kaman or zach).
i mean amare seems to be a headcase. i would rather make a smaller trade, ike say kaman and both our 2011 picks for gerald wallace, and just play Al thornton off the bench the way we used to play maggs off the bench.
Good trade
I would love to do this trade, Al has really been getting on my nerves lately espaecially yesterday.
With that line up we will be an elite team in the west, and i like the idea of novak starting he will really spread the floor. And when they double zbo of amare he will make them pay with a three ball.
But i highly doubt this trade will happen.
Leave the front court alone.
We’ve got 3 top bigs who haven’t played a full match together so lets see what they can give us first. Amare is a physical specimen but I don’t like how he’s developing with Shaq there. Thornton has been doing my head in also. He has played crap recently but he’s got the pressure of being the second option on offense. When we have our team back, he’ll be 3rd or 4th option so will have less pressure and can become more of a role player in the starting 5. We need to see how this team does before thinking about changing it.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
why not
just sign amare stoudamire in 2010, when Camby leaves?
Cmon Amare is an ALL STAR!!!!
Thornton always shoots and hardly drives and am tire of seeing the ball in his hands, he needs to start getting beasty like amre does.
i rather have novak shooting than al
If we get the option we must take it
No matter how good Kaman ends up being, he will never be Amare Stoudemire or anything like him. Both Zach and Amare can rebound and defend in a mobile fast moving defense. They would be the best front court in the league – no exceptions. When surrounded by top level three point shooters, they will dominate the paint. Kaman is not reliable or heathly and Thornton is a bench player forced to play starting minutes. If we get the option to acquire Amare and we don’t we will end up destined for failure. If we do get him, we are destined for greatness.
Kaman /= Stoudemire
Like comparing Tim Duncan to Karl Malone… They have completely different skill sets. But regardless, remember a guy named Shawn Marion that played with Steve Nash? How good is he now without Steve Nash? I don’t want to know what happens with Amare if he doesn’t have a Steve Nash feeding him, especially on a Dunleavy system.
Thornton’s hitting a little sophomore slump, it’s frustrating but it happens (Think Josh Howard). He still has a good future on this team. Lay off the guy. The front office doesn’t need to touch the team, it’s the players that need to get healthy and play.
Also, “Our team will be complete and we will finally have a chance of winning a Championship.” Like how our team would be complete when we got Baron Davis?… Then what happened? FElton leaves and we don’t get Z-Bo ‘til a month in… and he gets injured leaving us as bottom feeders for the rest of the season. Our assets don’t look good now because they’re injured or playing too many minutes. Give it some time and we’ll see just what a Clipper team at 100% can do.
we have 2 2011 1st rounders???
or you mean minnesota’s pick, because we could get that one this year or 2010 or 2012.
I thought it was protected through 2010
But I see CS has indicated it is 2011. Still right now that pick looks to be very high even then as the TWolves are nowhere near being an elite team. I say we trade it for max value now and hedge our bet.
something i wouldn't like about this trade
is that if i am correct amare contract is till 2010 so we will be trading kaman,al and the first rounder for a season of amare.
Amare Will Play for the Suns Next Year
1) There is no race to trade for him.
2) Picking Amare as an AS was a huge snub to Al Jefferson among others.
3) The Clippers don’t need any more injury prone players with questionable attitudes.
XXDC2XX
You’re completey right. Amare only has one year remaining which means that trading for him now would mean we’re banking on becoming so successfull that he couldn’t leave even if he wanted to.
More probable is the likelihood that we’ll still suck by having less depth, an equally crowded front court and after one year be even worse off than if we stick with what we’ve currently got.
It is a risk we need to take if we get the opportunity
Keep in mind, Thornton will want an extension after next year that is likely to cost us $10M per year (similar to Maggette). Kaman plays only 50% of each season and is far more unreliable than Amare. Also, if the Clippers sign Amare we will have the most chance of re-signing him to an extension. We will have the benefit of a sixth year to offer and be able to ignore cap rules (he wont be cheap – superstars never are). These make a huge difference in the highest bidder takes all that is now the mantra of the NBA. If Amare stinks up the joint next year, we can let him walk and have $16M in cap space to spend. I agree that there is a risk of losing players and picks for nothing, but without this sacrifice we will be unlikely to acquire any real talent on the free market. Any chance of getting a top 5 player to the Clippers is worth the risk. Also, Kaman and Thornton are likely to be bench players next year – very expensive bench players but bench players nevertheless. Put it this way, the benefits greatly outweighs the potential costs and in the NBA it can be very difficult to get your hands on a legitimate superstar. At least he is unlikely to become a Baron Davis – sign a huge extension and then stink up the joint. We get to evaluate him next year, he gets to evaluate us and if we play well, everybody wins.
He Doesn't Fit....
Unfortunately on this team he doesn’t fit. He’s a power forward…NOT a center. Can you make a legitimate lineup with him as a PF with the Clips current roster? If so, which 20-10 guy is coming off the bench, ZBo or Amare? It’s cannibalism.
Camby + Zbo, Camby + Amare
ZBo + Amare =? No no
On Second Thought...
C=Amare
PF=ZBo
SF=Novak
SG=EJ
PG=BD
Doesn’t sound like a contender…but it sounds fun (unless Dunleavy gets in the way)… let’s do it.
Not a contender?
Sounds like a contender to me. Amare and Zach are both strong defenders and rebounders. The forward breakdown would be as follows…
Camby = 30 mins at C
Randolph = 30 mins at PF
Stoudemire = 18 mins at C & 18 mins at PF
This frontline would be almost unstoppable especially if you surround them with long-range sharpshooters. I cannot think of a better lineup pound-for-pound in basketball today.
A word on injuries, less time on court means less injuries. Less time bullying your way to the bucket means less injuries. More three pointers means less injuries. Smarter ball movement means less injuries. Kaman and Thornton are clumsy and endanger the entire team (think Kaman causing EB to miss the entire season). Dunleavy loves iso offense and Amare is one of the very best in the business.
Substitute Camby in for Kaman
The Suns would have the oldest starting lineup since the legendary Bulls.
SF – Hill
PF – Camby
C – Shaq
PG – Nash
SG – J Rich (who is in prime, he’ll feel like a baby with these geezers around)
Unless we can get him cheaply (Camby and a 1st rounder would be cheap) there’s no reason to rush, we need a training camp to get all the new pieces acclimated anyways.
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities. -Christian Nestell Bovee
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