What Does Clips Nation Think About Allen Iverson?
by Steve Perrin on Jul 15, 2009 11:39 PM PDT
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PrintYou may have already discerned that it's been a bit of a crazy day for me. I had breakfast with a friend in Las Vegas, then drove back to LA. I got reacquainted with my family, took care of some things that needed to be done, and now here I am finally at the computer - and it's almost midnight!
So I know that I owe you a recap of the second summer league game, and I have a few other posts in mind from my time in Las Vegas, learning the ropes as a cub reporter. But I simply can't face all of that right now.
Instead, I thought I'd get you citizens clicking away at a new poll. A couple weeks ago, I was brainstorming about Shawn Marion, and asked what everyone thought about the idea of possibly using a trade exception on him. The majority of you thought that it would be a good idea at a single year so that it wouldn't eat into future cap space, while 26% thought it would be a bad idea for any length contract, and only 15% would have been willing to offer more than a year.
Well now instead of a hypothetical Shawn Marion, we are faced with a semi-real Allen Iverson. And if the rumor mill has it's facts straight, he may be available for the type of contract that the majority of you were willing to offer Marion - one year, and even less money (the Mid Level Exception, call it $5.5M). And while you may think that the team needs a small forward more than another guard, Iverson clearly does fill a role as well. But there's no question that Iverson would have to come off the bench, which could be a nonstarter for all involved (get it, not starting is a nonstarter).
At any rate, let's take it to the ballot box. We only need two options on this one - Is he the Answer, or isn't he?
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Ok
Here’s another question. If not AI, who can we sign to back up Baron? Ramon Sessions name had been tossed around but he’s RFA.
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
If not AI, who can we sign to back up Baron? Ramon Sessions name had been tossed around but he’s RFA.
Sessions is a quality player that the Bucks are letting walk. I don’t see why we don’t him except for the fact that Davis is locked up for so long.
by FlyByKnight on Jul 16, 2009 12:16 AM PDT up reply actions
i honestly believe we have no shot at sessions.
i mean teams like miami , and portland who actaully really need starting PGs (steve blake and mario chalmers are no where near as good as sessions) and have their MLEs would be way ahead of us for him. I would assume once the lamar odom issue is finished one of those teams would get him.
even philadelphia, or NY i’d think are ahead of us.
Hmm...
Are the Bucks really letting him walk? So the Bucks are going with Ridnour and Jennings? I guess that makes sense. Will Sessions fetch the full MLE? More? He’s only played, what, two years?
Agreed
Sessions is not coming for MLE and would be matched even higher than that. What’s the downside from 19 wins? Yes, the count can get worse, but I don’t think the feeling can.
Even if BD & EJ play 35 mpg, there’s still 26 minutes available…you’d rather have Taylor or Fred Jones out there than AI? I’d think for a year, it would help Taylor’s development, too. Flexibility…what if Baron gets hurt? Now your 35 minutes goes to whom? Remaining 26 to ?
Additional flexibility…AI’s expiring contract becomes attractive mid-season. If BD plays like last year, maybe he’s the one who gets traded (for an expiring Bosh?). AI expires… 2010 Free agency (Wade?) Another draft pick…possibly Minnesota’s too.
Don’t see how one year can hurt that much. If Gordon & Griffin can be unduly influenced…it will happen whether AI is there or not. If it’s not working out, all the more reason NOT to pattern yourself after AI.
One final comment…MDsr seems to be okay as a practice coach…it’s game day that sucks…I’d rather do it AI’s way.
i'm on board
if he agrees to come off the bench its a great signing. If baron gets hurt we need a reliable player to step in and Mike Taylor and Mardy just arent good enough players in my mind to play big minutes on a good nba team. hopefully he has his head on straight and is willing to accept this role if not he may have to turn to europe.
Question: What is the opposite of Glue?
The Answer is an adhesive remover. The Answer is a cancer. Now that Z-Bo should be gone, why replace him with another bad character guy.
I wish there was an answer 'C'
I hate the idea of the signing… but I’m 99% sure it’s going to happen so I’m just trying to cope with reality.
Could AI be a great addition this year? Sure. Could AI single-handedly ruin the ‘09-’10 season (possibly ‘10-’11) for this franchise? Sure.
Oh me, oh my!!!! The Red Baron has come home!!
i’m going to go with option C. as well.
My option C goes something like… Sign AI, if we start off horribly, and are out of playoff contention somehow after 30 games, release or trade him since he’s an expiring deal , and win the john wall sweepstakes.
and win the john wall sweepstakes.
I’d like Ed Davis, as well. Even though Davis appears to be headed into the NBA as a PF, and we already have Blake Griffin. I just like his style. He’s so poised on the low block and was improving as the year went along last season. Word was had he come out this past draft, he’d have been a top five pick. That’s saying something. There are a handfull of players that the Clippers need to look at for next season. John Wall is at the head of the list, obviously. After him, it’s between Paul George, Al-Farouq Aminu, Devin Ebanks, and Greg Monroe. We need a SF. I love Al Thornton to death but the kid is dumb. I’m sorry. He just is. He has no basketball IQ whatsoever. To be honest, the entire 2010 Draft hinges on John Wall and Paul George. Those are the only two players, at a position of need, that makes sense for the Clippers.
I am also going with option c
I wish we could try at Sessions or someone else but I will be ok with Ai. I think one thing that may is that he will choose to come here. If he chooses to come here knowing he will be coming off the bench I don’t think he will get upset like he did with Detroit because he will be choosing to come here full well knowing what will happen.
In Gordon we trust
Count me in on option C!
Originally, I said HELL NO! However, considering that he is an expiring contract, we could possibly use him in a trade, or just drop him and get ready for the 2010 Free Agent Sweepstakes.
The risk is fairly low, considering that we can dump him at any time, if he becomes a problem.
'Cause how you play, is how you'll be remembered. PLAY LOUD!
by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Jul 16, 2009 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions
Sign him
Sure he’s a head case, Sure he doesn’t like to practice, but for 1 year I would even let him start, career-27.1 PPG,
Career-6.2 assist’s per game. If MDsr can keep everything together we at least get to the 2nd round, IMO
He's 33.
He’s not going to put up those stats again. Hell, EJ was putting up better stats than AI midway through his rookie season.
The problem isn’t not practicing, it’s clubbing until 4 in the morning the night before a game and having people like Carmelo who look up to him “try to keep up” (Carmelo’s words).
Best case scenario, he puts up 15 points and 4 assists a game off the bench, doesn’t cause any problems, the young guys don’t catch on to his horrible habits, he’s not the dominant locker room presence (highly unlikely), and the Clips win enough games to attract a nice free agent next year.
Worst case scenario…don’t even want to think about it.
That's a great summary for me
Sums it up and for me, the upside of the Best Case is far outweighed by the downside of the Worst Case (does that make sense?).
Desmond Mason is still out there as an UFA so go get him and some good D for the second string and lets not be like a kid with their pocket money burning a hole in their pocket – we don’t HAVE to spend the money.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
can we have a third category?
Take the $5 million slated for AI and use it to buy out MDSr.
Addition by subtraction.
by Jax on Jul 16, 2009 6:31 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
I hate the idea of AI coming, but
on the bright side, since there’s basically no way it could possibly work out with him (there are just way too many pitfalls)…after another 25-win season, it would seem MDsr would have to go, right?
Worth A Shot
Last year’s marketing slogan was “Play Loud!” Unfortunately nobody did. Iverson knows how to play loud. (What are they using this year – “Play Louder!”?).
Assuming he wants to be here and would get on board and stay on board with the program, he would allow the Clippers to shift some of the points they lost by trading Randolph to a position where they are thin, serve as an insurance policy in case Baron goes down again, and put butts in the seats (sorry guys, no more internet special lower level mid court seats for $10).
He’d be in LA, playing with friends (I hear Davis, Camby and Gordon are in favor of it). Like Manny when he first came, he’d have a year to behave himself and put up a season that might get him a bigger, longer contract next year.
He’d bring a little cache to a franchise that most people view as a joke, another crack in the stigma that might otherwise have a prime FA reject signing with the Clips in 2010 out of hand.
And his attitude is not all bad. The heart, tenacity and warrior mentality parts of it are something the Clippers have usually lacked. Going back to the Manny example, look at the confidence he helped infuse in the younger Dodger players. Having him on board might also keep Baron motivated to pick up his game.
If some how it all goes terribly wrong, as someone above noted, it’s a one year deal for MLE. You can always remove him from the equation. It’s highly unlikely we were going to the Finals anyway.
by Clipster Hipster on Jul 16, 2009 7:12 AM PDT reply actions
Good points
For whatever reason we seemed to have lacked metal toughness.
AI has been fearless his entire career. He would go at Shaq or whoever without hesitation.
He certainly has other issues however being a scrapper is not one of them.
AIs that dude
Just the fact that the other players want him goes a long way in my opinion. The biggest problem with chemistry last year for Detroit, was that the players never accepted the loss of Billups. That had nothing to do with AI. I can’t think of any shooting guard in the league besides Kobe that Detroit would have embraced after losing Billups. That said, this is a different situation and looks more like Denver when AI got there. Now people can re-write history if they like but Denver was a better team with AI than they were prior to him getting there. They just lacked depth in the front court and started Anthony Carter at the point guard position, relegating JR smith 15 minutes a game. In LA all the guards with AI are starting quality players and the front court is decent. As long as AI’s getting his 30 to 35 minutes a game he’s definitely going to be an improvement over last season with everybody injured and no one to step up. AIs that dude.
play it loud
I detest that slogan. i despise it. don’t ever bring that one back. shining Allen Iverson for a one year contract is an absolute must do. lets not even get into the abilities or liabilities he can bring on the court and in the locker. just looking at the contract: worse case, he does not fit what so ever, do you know what type of trading piece that is alone for a team trying to make more cap room next off season? imagine how valuable he is to a team like clevand, orlando, boston who could be looking for that edge off the bench to get them to the next level. if nothing, he is off our books next year. if its a disaster treat it how ny did marbury. but… i don’t think this will fail. the star player is vouching for him as well as the team’s patriart. that says a lot.
by Takebb909 on Jul 16, 2009 8:33 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
I am on the fence for both AI and Sessions
I haven’t seen Sessions to say he’s a solid player, he puts up decent number. Is that a product of being on a terrible team (Ty Nesby effect)?
That being said, he’s young and seems like a good kid (like Bobby Simmons). He could be a good signing or a terrible one that we have to live w/ for 5 years.
As for AI, I always liked AI but he’s about 3-4 years too late for the clippers. He would have worked for the past teams, but not this one. No matter how dysfunctional we can guess the locker room would be, he does provide some sense of security as a Backup Guard. Taylor is showing he still needs some time to work on his PG skills.
I don’t want the clips trolling for a guard midseason if one of the guards goes down w/ an injury and hear your starting PG is Dan Dickau.
Tough to decide. Let’s go get Pooh Jeter and Rod Benson. We’ll have a battle of the blogs in the locker room.
by Qlippers on Jul 16, 2009 9:19 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Huge plus 1 for recommending Pooh Jeter
Portland Pilots deserve respect.
by Michael White on Jul 16, 2009 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions
I wonder how many of us would want to resign Camby after this season...
I do. I’m a big Camby fan and would love to resign him, and more importantly, let Kaman go as soon as DJ is ready for regular minutes.
Having AI on board should definitely make things easier with Camby a year from now…
This Poll is Rigged!1111
Do people really want Iverson ?
Even if we get the best case scenario, whats the point ?
If AI comes to the Clippers and plays well, hes not going to be here the next year so we’re wasting minutes we could use on other guys just so we can get AI a bigger contract.
Is Iverson the difference between Lottery and Playoffs ? no.
AI has proven to be a ball stopper and the only way a team can succeed with AI is to surround him with role players who won’t want the ball or need the ball. This obviously is not happening as AI is on the other side of 30.
Do the positive outweigh the negatives ? no.
Negatives
-dribbles too much
-plays too much 1 on 1
-shoots too much
-probably won’t come off the bench
-complains when losing
-defensive liability
-“speaks his mind”
-probably will punch Dunleavy sooner or later
Positives
-can score
-gives us a 3 guard rotation
-mad rapping skills
-more ticket sales
-Hire Dunleavy
-hes an all star
And seriously 60% of you guys think AI would be good here ?
its should be a positive
hopefully the Clips can get a injury execption to hire another coach.
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.-1984 George Orwell.
AI needs to talk some sense into Kaman
AI has been injured like a bajillion times yet he’s still going strong.
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
the excitement factor probably plays a big role
in why so many people would want ai. i can certainly understand the excitement over possible money spending change.
but, i like to think more long term and i dont think ai is in that picture.
it is an exciting flirtation nonetheless.
Clippers Basketball.... It's Masochistic!
IT'S THE CLIPPERS
thats what we’ll continue to hear if we sign a.i. same dysfunctional franchise.
they trade away1 ball hog so they don’t impede the development 1 of our young studs,then sign another ball dominating player. to impede the development of our other young stud, as some of you have suggested by stating a.i. should start ahead of gordon.
gordon should start ahead of a.i. based on defense alone.
the only questions i need answered is how long before his ego demands more minutes or possibly starting? or how long before he get’s our gm/coach fired? more questions than answers for me.
the more things change the more they stay the same “it’s the clippers.”
good Thing
if iverson gets dun fired as coach, that would have to be one of the greatest moves dun has done, signing iverson.
by Takebb909 on Jul 16, 2009 12:46 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Iverson fans
stop voting. How many voters are actually CLIPPERS fans. C’mon, clearly this poll is dominated by Iverson fans who are just desperate to follow him to the next team he ruins because he’s got “street cred” and is “that dude.” Give me a break.
In fact, this poll reflects exactly my problem with getting Iverson. It’s completely not a basketball move and is only a move to gain more media attention (thus allowing them to ask for a richer radio deal), and sell more tickets and gear.
Pass.
I think
you hate AI almost as much as mwhite loves Zbo. Cheap shot, I know, sorry mwhite – but it was worth a (small) laugh
You see Jax
And I was standing by my pledge to let the Zbo stuff go. I liked him while he was here, and now he’s gone. Oh well, twas time for me to move on.
BTW, I agree with you on AI— but considering my fondness of scorers who have less than perfect pasts, I’m sure you’re not surprised.
by Michael White on Jul 16, 2009 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't hate Iverson
It’s not fair to say that I hate Iverson. I hate this move for the Clippers. It makes zero basketball sense whatsoever.
And everyone who supports the move acts like they didn’t watch basketball at all last season. It’s just bizarre to me that anyone who saw what he did in Detroit would want him on this fragile team.
I really don't think it's fair to blame one player
for the destruction of the whole Pistons organization. Dumars was desperate and AI was available. Detroit was going down anyways so why not free up some cap. They weren’t that bad. They still made the playoffs at 39-43.
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
To get swept by the Cavs
im sure you don’t want you’re fans seeing that.
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.-1984 George Orwell.
Whats so bad about that?
They had the best league record last year. You sound like their an 8th seeder
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
Whether you admit it or not...
AI can’t make the team any worse than it already is….yeah yeah we got blake, but the season hasn’t started yet, give him a chance like we’ve done for everyone on this team.. i bet you guys that are against it , you guys will be the first one to say i told you so, and then go buy an AI jersey, keep it real!! CLIPPERS FOR THE “W”!
by clippersnomatterwhat on Jul 16, 2009 3:33 PM PDT reply actions
Surprised by these results
I vote no. Let’s run with the youth movement + Baron, Camby and Kaman.
Another instance where Dunleavy the GM and Dunleavy the coach are at odds.
Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)
Bench Player? OK Then
If he can agree to come off the bench and play 25 minutes a game. I think he’s worth a 1 year deal. What are we going to do with the money anyways? We can’t sign any long term deals now since we need to have cap room for next year to get D-Wade.
Right?
I like it for 2 reasons:
1). It’s a significant roster change that removes this year’s team from the core personnel that was so dismal last year. I’m not worried about messing up chemistry when there is none to begin with. I don’t think that only other significant change, swapping out Griffin for Randolph, is enough to turn around a 19-63 team.
2). If it doesn’t work out, then we can rejoice that the year-after-next, we’ll be better because AI won’t be around. Being a Clipper fan is as much about looking forward to next year as it is trying to enjoy the current one. Adding AI for a single yeargives me reason to be hopeful for 2 whole years with one deal. Not bad!
It's funny how the same fans
who hate on AI are the same people embracing Baron Davis.
AI outplayed Boom last year. I know that he has character issues but so does Baron. At least AI would only be here for one year if he doesn’t produce well enough but we still have Boom for 4 more years. Clips are also paying Davis more than 2x the amount of what AI would get.
We would get a hall of fame veteran guard who can still start on most teams with an MLE salary.
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
If our young players has as good of a character as we think they do,
AI shouldn’t affect what kind of player they will become by staying for one year.
"This kid is the best new talent in the league right now, and I don't care who else you mention." -Suns Coach, Alvin Gentry, on Clippers rookie sensation, Eric Gordon.
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