Eric Gordon - No Team USA This Year
by Steve Perrin on Jul 26, 2009 9:34 AM PDT
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PrintAfter receiving a last minute invitation to the USA Basketball Mini Camp, and then doing enough to get the attention of the coaching staff after the first couple days, Eric Gordon has struggled since the Camp turned from drills to five-on-five play.
During scrimmages on Friday, the informal box score had him at 1 for 5 from the field and 1 for 2 from the line for a total of 3 points. Then, last night in the showcase event, the Blue versus White game, EJ went 0 for 4 from the field and managed only 2 free throws in a game low 15 minutes - he was the only player out of 20 not to make a field goal. He would have gotten his chance to shine if he'd been on, as White's starting shooting guard, O.J. Mayo, was only 5 for 16 from the field for the game. But missing 4 shots and turning the ball over 3 times is not the way to stay on the floor. Gordon did have a couple rebounds, a couple of assists and a block.
It may be that Gordon just isn't brash enough for this type of event. In the equivalent of an under 25 All Star game, many of the other players are going to get their shots before he does. In the Rookie Challenge game at All Star weekend, EJ started the game hitting everything, making his first 6 shots. But he only ended up with 8 FG attempts, fifth most on the team. Mayo went 5 for 12 while Michael Beasley managed to hoist 22 (!) shots by simply shooting every time he touched the ball. That's not in EJ's nature. So likewise in Vegas, he was a little deferential, taking only 4 shots in 15 minutes. Unfortunately, none of those went in, and he's not really the type to shoot his way out of it.
It's a characteristic that is at once admirable and problematic. He doesn't force things on the basketball court - but there were many times during the season last year, particularly during the stretches when so many other players were hurt, that he NEEDED to take over. In the most brightest vision of a bright Clipper's future, as good as Blake Griffin is going to be, it's nonetheless Gordon who will lead the team in scoring and will be asked to come up with the big plays in close games. He's still only 20, and I think he thinks of himself that way.
Rudy Gay led all scorers in the Blue vs. White game with 27 points. Kevin Durant is the most likely player from this group to join the Senior National Team in their next competition, next summer at the World Championships in Turkey.
Gordon will have another chance at Team USA. The irony is that his willingness to be a team player would be very valuable on such a team - but you can't defer if you want to get noticed in the tryouts.
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I spoke too soon.
Thanks for the write up, Steve. I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of Gordon being too deferential at times. I just wish he’d the demand the ball more often sometimes… :/
Stuck in limbo.
He'll get there
I think. he’ll get there. But you take the good with the bad, right? I mean, part of the reason he’s such an efficient scorer is because he doesn’t force. So we praise him for his much better than average efficiency – which would no doubt diminish if he ‘demanded the ball’ more than he does. It’s hard to maintain a TSP close to 60 while taking 25 shots a game.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Jul 26, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions
I am very interested to see Eric Gordon next year.
He was impressive last year and I feel he is going to be an all-star level player (maybe not perennial all-star but a guy in the running every year at least) but – then again – I’ve been burned by young Clippers before.
I’m glad he doesn’t force shots though. His maturity and bball IQ are his greatest strengths as a player IMO.
Even if he doesn’t become an all-star he is going to be a valuable player because he doesn’t need the ball in his hands to be effective.
I think Team USA coaches are smart enough
to understand the little things guys bring to the table. Sure, not playing well probably hurt EJ, but maybe NOT shooting his way out of it impressed the coaches?
Put another way, I’m pretty sure gold medal winner Tayshaun Prince didn’t go out of his way to “get noticed” in tryouts.
I think that's a fair point
If EJ can, in future opportunities with the team, prove that he can do the little things AND hit open shots, it’s the type of player they need. His size definitely hurts him though. They like those 6’6" to 6’8" guys who can play either wing position.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Jul 26, 2009 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Doesnt this highlight a major Clipper deficiency?
The Clippers seem to have one major deficiency in every losing season – the lack of a true go-to guy. The only winning season in recent memory had Sam Cassell putting the team on his shoulders and carrying them to within a game of the conference finals. The Clips have had good team players like Brand, Gordon and now Griffin, but all of these players are more than willing to share the ball.
The reason that some players are team players and others are not is just a mindset. Either you believe that you have the best chance to create points on your team or you don’t. Sam believed – Eric does not (and never will in my opinion). That’s not to say that he is incapable of being an elite player – just that he will never lead any team to a championship. He is a role player on a championship caliber squad, just as Griffin is.
This poor showing highlights the Clippers desperate need for a shoot first unstoppable force at the guard position. Players like EG and BG will be better suited as the Pippen to a Michael Jordan. I think it is time to seriously consider Iverson or McGrady as possible options to alleviate this problem – at least short term. They would not need to play major minutes, just those that require a true scorers mindset. Plus they could possibly show young EG what it takes to be elite. Before I get flamed on this comment – if EG could have half the career Iverson or McGrady had we are in for a fun time.
If the Clipper fans truly wish 2009 to be the greatest year in recent history then they desperately need a true go-to guy. Baron fits the mold, but he seems to have lost a step and is incapable of generating the athleticism to be elite. We need a backup go-to guy as insurance.
Iverson wants to be a Clipper (for ridiculously low salary) and McGrady could be ours for Baron and Camby. Remember all the times you have yelled at the TV screen for somebody to step up and shoot the ball? This will happen again all too frequently until we address this major deficiency in our roster.
Great post, Bob
One of the best I’ve seen in a while on this site.
citizen bob
i hope you remember everything you said in this post at the end of next season. about AI about Gordon and Blake. you seem quite off. but that is just a IMO. did you get to watch any Clipper games last year?
by Takebb909 on Jul 26, 2009 3:33 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Couldn't disagree more
Tmac and Ai are shells of the players you are remembering so why upset the balance again to make a move for a short term disappointment?
Also, these amazing closers only have one finals appearance between them and that ended a 4-1 defeat. Can’t have closed out too many playoff games.
Now, how can you tar young EJ with this brush after his rookie year? Look at one of the best closers in the game today, Kobe. Did you know he was that great a go to guy after his rookie year? Of course not. Kobe was younger but who cares? EJ had a great first season but is still trying to find himself as an NBA player. You are not going to know if a player has that ability to finish until they have experienced a few opportunities to do so in important games.
I know everyone harps on about go to guys but there is only one MJ, One Kobe. I’d much rather have a couple of options than the one guy who gets double teamed. Get me griffin inside , Gordon outside or a pick and roll with those guys and I’ll happily take that risk.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
by ClippersUK on Jul 26, 2009 3:53 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
strongly agree with UK
also Gordon at times late in last season showed very strong signs of being a closer. A couple of times I could remember was in our last game against the Lakers where he hit amazing shot to bring it within 3 then forcing Kobe to hold him illegally and allowing Baron getting a much shot that got much closer then it probably should of, and he made a couple of very clutch 3s in both the NY game. And also Blake can become a go to scorer in the post he may need a couple months to adjust but he will get there then when Blake gets the double he will pass the ball out (which he showed in Summer league he is very good at doing) and give it to an open shooter. To sum it up Gordon is probably much closer to being a go to scorer then Kobe was his rookie year.
In Gordon we trust
not so much the ability but the mindset
i think citizen bob’s point is that EJ’s abilities as a scorer are excellent but he doesn’t necessarily have the mindset or personality to be a go-to guy. You can say what you want about Kobe as a rookie and those airballs he shot in the playoffs, but the fact that he took them over and over in the same game shows you that he had that mindset even as an 18 yr old rookie.
I hope EJ can develop that mentality because I think he can be a beast. He’s got the tools to be an awesome player in this league.
AI and McGrady dont need to be allstars...
They just need to be the best offensive players on the team. Every championship team in recent history has had a definable hierarchy – they have all had leaders who were the indisputable go-to guy in tense situations. This is what separates the good teams with the great teams. In an ideal world the best player would also be the best defender – ready to handle any situation on either end of the floor. The Clippers have some fantastic team players (a necessity in any elite team) but they do not have a definable best player – except Baron who last year was not up to the task.
Personally, I would do my best to get Gerald Wallace as I think he is a star waiting to breakout. If he was unavailable my next choice would be McGrady – if his prognosis for a comeback was reasonable. Iverson could fit the role but only if his team is capable of covering his mistakes on defense and I think the Clippers have this from our big men. Although Iverson is not always a defensive beast, he is capable of top level defense – just his brand of high risk high reward defense. On offense, he has throughout his career been the most dominate offensive presence on the court. His speed compensates for his lack of size and gets him opportunities bigger guards can’t find.
In short, Iverson addresses the Clippers biggest need right now – easy fastbreak buckets (where we rank last in the league). When Iverson heats up, he changes the game. Even if he is a shadow of his former self he would still be the best guard to ever wear the Clipper uniform. There is no doubt IMO that should Iverson join the Clippers he will immediately become our undisputed go-to guy – for good or bad. Gordon, Thornton and Griffin may get there but for the next few years at least they are likely to be followers more often than leaders.
by citizen bob on Jul 26, 2009 10:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Do not agree
I just have to note that I disagree with a number of aspects of this post.
I do agree that Eric Gordon will be more suited to a #2 option role but it is too early to tell and he could assert himself further this year.
What I disagree with:
There is no way to tell, at this point, whether Blake Griffin is a #1, #2, #3 or #4 guy, I don’t see anything that has happened to far to preclude him from possibly being a #1 option.
AI? T-Mac? Those guys are basically corpses at this point and they certainly won’t be of a use by the time Griffin and Gordon are able to meaningfully contribute at a level that will get us to even a 2nd round situation.
You don't see anything to preclude Griffin from being a no. 1 option?
I would suggest that any number 1 option who is a PF has to be a deadly midrange shooter. At this point, Griffin is not. Hopefully he will develop that aspect of his game. But he doesn’t have it now.
Lets hope BG is not our #1 option next year
The Clippers have always been loaded at PF. BG is no exception, but it is highly unlikely he will be even comparable to Brand for a few years at least. The #2 option is all we can hope for this year – unless the year turns out to be a disaster. If I recall there were periods where Thornton was the #1 option last year – look at how we did then.
Iverson and TMac are not needed as 42 minute guys anymore but either of these players at 70% is better than any other of our players at 100%. Iverson would immediately be the undisputed best player on the team. Name me another player than could even compete skill wise. He is a crafty veteran on a contract year that could show our young undersized SG how to get open and handle pressure.
Iverson is still capable of spreading the floor and demanding the complete attention of the entire opposing team. Any elite shooter can get this attention but Iverson thrives in it. That’s exactly what we need right now. Plus for the price he is a major bargain – not a minor bargain but a major one. Remember – all true genius’s have personality quirks – he is not referred to as Artificial Intelligence for no reason.
by citizen bob on Jul 27, 2009 12:38 AM PDT up reply actions
I know you are obviously the manager of the
Allen Iverson and Tracy McGrady fan clubs Citizen bob but the statement “either of these players at 70% is better than any other of our players at 100%” is not a correct one, I would argue.
You are telling me that the Iverson and TMac of the last couple of years is better than what we’ll expect from Eric Gordon or Blake? Or even Baron if he gets his shiznits together?
Iverson would in no way become the undisputed best player on our team. He would be coming off the bench if we got him, and god hope we don’t.
He is far from an elite shooter nowadays and he would be a short term fix that comes with loads of baggage on a team that isn’t predicted to win a title this year.
BTW, I had no idea the AI was meant to be Artificial Intelligence. Thought it was just his initials!!!! Maybe it’s artificial because if he had real intelligence he’d see that his team mates can score if he passes the ball to them too!!!
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Hmm
UK – AI was never an elite shooter. He was an elite scorer. There’s a big difference between the two. There are not very many of those in the league, which is why they get paid so much money.
What Bob likely means is that AI would become the leader of the team because of who he is. I don’t think he’s the best “player” any longer.
What exactly is AI’s “baggage” that you’re referring to? I don’t really want to rehash the AI stuff here, but you’ve got to do more than just repeat oft-uttered canards IMO.
AI has averaged over 41 mins per game and over 6 assists for his entire 13 year career. Thus, your suggestion that he doesn’t pass the ball is simply untrue and he’s undisputably a tough player who plays hurt, unilke, um, dare I say it, Kaman and BD.
Finally, as I’ve mentioned in other posts. AI would seem to fit well with MDSr’s iso-based offense. He’s like a guard version of Zbo who can pass.
We probably won’t sign AI, but Bob’s opinion on this is spot – on (to use the British vernacular).
Alright.
Yep, I agree with you but Cit Bob has put he was an elite shooter so my post responds to that comment.
Hang on though. Don’t start interpreting Cit Bob’s post into your way of thinking. It clearly states that Iverson would immediately be the UNDISPUTED best player on our team. Not only the best player, but apparently undisputed.
Well, I’m disputing that!
He also states that Iverson/TMAC at 70% is better than any of our players at 100%. Well, I don’t know if Citizen Bob is still living in 2001 but that just isn’t true. Eric Gordon is arguably as good a player as either of those guys already.
You either want me to repost all the Iverson stuff I’ve posted on other threads here or not. Baggage was my way of summarising what I’ve put before. Basically the downsides to having him that we’ve had discussed here. For me, the main one, and only one I’ll bring up here, is his attitude. Gives all on the court, not disputed, but doesn’t turn up for practices and feels he doesn’t need to abide by team rules. That sort of thing can harm locker room harmony and chemistry. We don’t know how impressionable our young players are but I don’t want them around him at this stage of his career when he’s been moaning non stop about his back and coming of the bench etc. He just wants playing time for himself, what he’s always wanted.
You can bring up career stats here if you wish but career stats don’t display the downturn in those stats over the past 2/3 years do they? Jax, you are a basketball fan with good knowledge (although John R may not agree), so I won’t insult your intelligence to ask if you’ve seen much of Iverson over his career BUT how many times does he hog the ball on isolations and shoot? When a player has built his career around that style and his body slowly degrades, following all the battles he’s been in, he’s slowly going to become less able to do these things. Like a boxer who takes his career too far, he’ll end up turning the ball over more and his shooting % will continue to decline.
Do we want Dunleavy’s ISO based system? No. You yourslf has said you hate his coaching. So why would you now be recommending players into a system that the coach has said he is changing?
I’m glad you agree with Bob (although you’ve changed some of the things he’s said to suit your argument) as it gives us something to chat about.
We’ll just have to disagree about Iverson, like so many fans have done previously!
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
When did AI not turn up for practioes?
He made one comment eight years ago about practices.
If AI is quickly degrading then move on. Two years ago he had one of his best years ever.
Jax, just so you know I'm not someone
who pulls things out of thin air and posts them, here is the link
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3730471
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Undisputed Best Player Does Not Always Mean Highest Scorer
Look at the Spurs – Ginolbli and Parker consistently lead the team in scoring but neither are considered the undisputed best player on the team. The same logic can be applied here. I did not mean to infer that Iverson would be the highest scorer or the best defender on the Clippers. Instead I meant to infer that due to Iverson’s experience and his ability to handle pressure, he could be considered the team leader and that this would be undisputed. The main problem I have seen over the years is that nobody on the Clippers wants to step up and win games through willpower alone. Iverson would correct this deficiency immediately.
Heirarchy defines victory. When the players cannot rely on the team leader (aka Baron and to some degree Dunleavy) then the team will struggle regardless of talent. I would rather see Iverson do his thing and miss than see Kaman blow a layup. At least when Iverson shoots, we have a chance at second chance points.
Look at Iversons career – has anybody won more games in the last minute? If you can find somebody, do you think they would be available for the MLE?
Just to correct a misconception here – I would not want Iverson on the Clippers if LeBron was available. Since he is not, we are forced to choose amongst those players that are available and that we can afford. A 1yr MLE deal would be a low risk – super high return type of deal. Good businessmen usually just at these opportunities.
Preclude in the long term...
… In the short term, I doubt he will be more than an very good garbage man (Elton Brand) next year.
I agree, unless he is able to develop a consistent mid-range game it is doubtful he will be a #1 option in this league but I am not going to write off that possibility before he has played an NBA game.
Amare and the old Suns
Back when Amare was a beast…he had no midrange….yet was still the number one option because he was such a beast. He was surrounded by a lot of capable options from outside and that took care of the problem.
Anyone who thinks TMac and AI are "go to guys"
…hasn’t watched basketball in at least 3 years.
That’s just sheer absurdity. And If you’re yelling at the TV screen for someone to shoot the ball, you might not have a good understanding of what’s going on out there. This team’s problem wasn’t that people didn’t shoot the ball, it’s that people took bad shots and made very few of them. Neither Iverson, nor TMac, would change that at all. They would only make it worse.
Blake Griffin needs to be groomed to be our go-to guy. Until then it’s Baron.
Thank you
Blake does need to be groomed but I’d also like Gordon to also in order to give us another option who can take the pressure shot from outside if Blake sees the D collapsing on him and needs to get the ball pushed back out to the perimeter.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
That's ridiculous madglove applied to AI
The year before last AI had one of his best years ever. I get that you don’t like AI, but let’s be fair.
Try to stay with the convo
The topic is about Iverson as a GO TO GUY. Iverson was never Denver’s go-to guy. That year you’re speaking of, Melo was in the top 3 in the league for buzzer beaters and game winners. He was far and away their go to guy. For a guy who tries to criticize John R for relying on stats and not watching games, you seem to have serious gaps in your memory there.
And what does “one of his best years ever” even mean? What is that based on? His numbers that year were consistent with the last 3-4 years in Philly. Only his scoring was down and his FG% was up. That’s about standard.
Iverson hasn’t be THE go-to guy since he left Philly. Period.
I know you have this desperate desire to like AI, but let’s try to be accurate.
Madglove - you are blinded by your hatred of AI
He was a go to guy 2 years ago. He had a great year 2 years ago. Let’s not unnecessarily attack each other. No, I don’t have a “desperate desire to like AI.”
Well, hang on, he's just pointing out the lack of accuracy
in your post. You are looking at the stat line for the year and claiming it was a great year.
Yep, he scored over 26 ppg and had 7.0 assists. But his team went out in the first round of the playoffs when he was one of the two go-to guys on the team. Again, another good example of the man putting up loads of stats but not taking his team to the promised land.
I don’t want that this year. Got that last year with ZBo.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
madgloves hates Ai
ClippersUK wants to rebuild for the “future.” Madgloves thinks I’m impatient because I want to win now, even if it is for a year…
At this point, I’m thinking that Ai could be the best option as our go to guy. Right now, I’m not even thinking about selling tickets, whereas who can help our team more. Does signing Iverson for a year deal improve or postpone Gordon’s talent? We can look at it this way: Iverson can teach Gordon a thing or two about basketball. Iverson was, and possibly can still be a very dominant scorer with good- decent court vision. If Gordon can start passing the ball a bit more, we’d know it’d be worth it. Plus, keep in mind we’re still talking about Gordon being a starter and Iverson being a 6th man. That leaves Gordon with approx 30 or so mins and IVerson with 25+ mins.
Anyways, all you had to do was open up a bit and be optimistic. Back to ClippsUK comment on Jax about hating Dunleavy’s playing style, its true. We hate his playing style. But keep in mind that Iverson seems like that player that can thrive off of Dunleavy’s iso. plays.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
What?
Please show me where I said I want to rebuild for the future? When I posted in that thread asking you to point that out, you conveniently didn’t post again!!!!
I said we should continue to build around our current core of young players, not bring in one year rentals that are past their best and could cause more disruption than could bring good.
Back to the other comment. If you hate Dunny so much and want him replaced, why would you want to bring in players who play in that style still. Makes no sense. Even the Dunny has claimed we are going to run more. We have multiple threats on the floor so why would you want to run ISO plays regularly. We aren’t Cleveland with one superstar and no-one else.
Then, hypothetically, if Dunny gets fired as Jax would like, you are left with Iverson, causing disruption as a new system is put in place and he wants to hog the ball and do crossovers and shoot fade away jumpers from 18 feet when we just want the pick and roll run for Blake. Great stuff.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
How can you forget your own question from 6 lines above?
It was: Where has AI caused disruption?
The Answer (pun intended): Philly
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
I guess for those of you who misinterpreted my question
what I was looking for were specific instances, not cities.
So I'm not the only one seeing this
Cheers. Thought I was in the twilight zone or something….
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
OK Jax.I've been reading your posts for about a year now
And noticed that you like other people to have to continually backup their points with further details whilst you can throw stuff out there like AI being a go to guy 2 years ago, having a great season when his team got swept in the first round along with other things. Put your reasons up cos your points sometimes have nothing behind them
Well if you go to the following page at Wiki, you’ll see a whole section on Fall Out With The Sixers where it describes him storming out of the gym, falling out with a coach that then got fired and loads of other stuff. There is even another section called Contraversy!! Read it and learn!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_iverson
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Look UK
It cannot reasonably be disputed that AI had a great season two years ago, that he was a go to guy on the Nugs, and that the team had significant injuries. You’ve come back with what I believe are incorrect arguments trying to oppose the point.
OK,
So I assume that you are now agreeing that he’s been a disruptable person in the past who has missed practices in multiple teams, like I told you an hour ago!!
You must be as I’ve backed up those points and you’ve stopped talking about them, right?
Whether or not he had a decent season two years ago (A go-to guy now, not THE go-to guy), how can you be happy for this type of character guy to come into our roster, with a style that goes against the way we are going, with those character traits and be happy with it?
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Let's be clear
You’ve accused me of not backing up my points when in reality you made a number of arguments that I have established are not correct about AI while at Denver.
I also think that you’re description of AI’s play is highly inaccurate and unfair to him. Among other things, AI has been historically on systems where he is supposed to be the go to guy (the “ballhog” as you describe it) and that doesn’t make him a bad player; quite the contrary. Those systems basically called for giving AI the ball and getting out of the way.
Why criticize AI for doing his best in systems that were designed for him to do that? The only reason that I can see why you would do that would be if you just do not have a sophisticated knowledge of the NBA. While I’m not saying I possess that type of knowledge, at least I can recognize when I’m wrong.
I disagree that what you are trying to describe is disruptive; rather, as I mentioned, HOF coach Larry Brown, who coached AI in Philly, believes that future HOFer AI is a great player. In addition, he had no issues in Denver and has mellowed somewhat.
Overall, I think that it would be foolish not to sign AI for a year at the MLE or lower to come off the bench, if he’s comfortable with that.
Dammit. I was happy to move on but not with a last post like that!
I don’t think my play of AI is highly inaccurate and I didn’t criticize him for doing his best in systems that were created for him.
I’m sure from your comments you think in the UK we play with a rock (instead of THE rock) and dribble around the dinosaurs but it’s the same game. Isolation plays are still run for players that can take other players off the dribble and drive to the basket to finish or dish it out.
I understand the best parts of Iverson’s game and I did agree with you that he has been an elite SCORER in his career. But his teams have never been that successful (apart from the 2001 trip to the finals – which they lost), so I wouldn’t class him as a winner although he leaves everything on the floor. IMO, his determination on the floor is his best characteristic. However it can also be his achillies heel as he takes too many shots in my opinion and gambles too much on D for steals.
Statistically, he had a great year 2 years ago. I’ll leave it at that.
If you try and argue he’s not been disruptive in his career, I feel that you know less than I thought about how players integrate into a team and also what leadership means.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Well at the time, Ai as the #1 option (don't think about Denver yet)
at Denver, he was probably #2.
In Clippers, he’ll probably be #6 (no more like 2 or 3 option but a sixth man.) Really, we’re not leaning towards Iverson becoming that GO TO GUY every single play, but it’d be nice to know we have a very big weapon off the bench.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
Wow
This thread has changed as the original argument by Bob was that he was being signed to be our go to guy and that he was better at 70% than the rest of our players at 100%.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
OMG
Read your post above when you criticized me for not backing up my statements. You left with little choice but to respond, my man.
I know basketball is popular in parts of Europe (if the UK is part of Europe). I used to live in Europe and played organized basketball there. My comments were directed at your post, not at Europeans or Britains in general.
With respect to AI and character, I would suggest that he comes from a very different place than you and I and that he relates far better to most of the players on the team than we do. Check out who has criticized AI over the years and who hasn’t. I’ll leave it at that.
IF THE UK IS PART OF EUROPE???????
That explains who I’m dealing with I suppose.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Now you've done it
Are you now going to tell me that no Britains see British interests as being separate from those of the rest of Europe?
Either you are stupid, which I don’t think is the case, or you’re just trying to score points, which is too bad.
In addition
I do suspect that as a Britain you might not understand some of the subtleties behind the comments, the various US subcultures, and how those issues can come up in the context of a sport like basketball. Just like we wouldn’t understand the various British subcultures and how to interpret behavior within such subcultures as exhibited on the soccer field (or is it pitch)?
Hey,
I’m sure I don’t and I do understand your point. First good one tonight eh – ha ha
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Its daytime in Clippersland.
Most Clippers fans would probably look at the time and see that its 2:52
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
We've avoided the racism issue on this blog
But that doesn’t mean it’s not there.
Jax, c'mon mate
Where is your sense of humour?
Maybe the way you meant it didn’t come across but it looked like you put “if the UK is part of Europe”!!!
If you meant it in the way that the UK likes to think of themselves as seperate due to their heritage, monetary policies etc then I missed the cleverness of your post and my apologies.
Please don’t scare me the with “Now you’ve done it” title again though – he he he
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
a cup of tea, mate?
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
So ClippersUK
how are we going to rebuild around our young core? By adding younger cores within the young core? Isn’t that just like rebuilding for the future? How will Ramon Sessions exactly take us to the playoffs if we already have 3 point guards. I’m not saying Ramon Session can’t contribute, I just don’t see it likely for him to play the 2. With that, who is going to backup the 2? We already know that Telfair currently is the most likely candidate for the 1 position. Is Telfair NOT a future point guard at 24 years old? Does he not have potential? I still see potential (even though Fan of Bulls doesnt [trying to lighten the mood*].
Okay, I wouldnt rely on Telfair just yet for the future, just saying that we’re adding not downgrading by adding Allen Iverson. We’re still very capable with competeing for the future (or his year and the next.) And when Iversons 1 year contract is up, its easy to say that we can still possibyl snag a good sg/ sf combination like Joe Johnson (although I’m not sure if I would call Joe a sf..still)
The thing is, we can’t always rebuild around the young core. I like the idea of having more talent around the young core, but we won’t always draft guys like Thornton or Gordon. We need to get guys who can help us compete now.
Oh btw, let me add on that if we’re not competeing in the playoffs, we’re in rebuild mode. Seems to me that ClippsUK, you think we can.. compete.. and build? I want to point out that we’re not exactly Portland with Brandon Roy. Eric Gordon is far from Brandon Roy. Blake is far from Brand (and who really knows the comparison of Blake yet.) Exactly how are we going to build around a young core? Wait, wait, let me add on to what the Clippers needs are now. Gotoscorer, a backup sg (maybe even pg), a backup sf, A LEADER, and an efficient 6th man. Seems to me that Iverson fills up most the categories (except sf.)
Anyways, I’m sure me and Jax wants Dunleavy out. BUT our ambitions are to keep the Clippers winning. “If you hate Dunny so much and want him replaced, why would you want to bring in players who play in that style still.”
Im sure JAX would agree with me that we WANT the Clippers to win, even if it involves Dumbleavy. And the fact of the matter is, Dunleavy will most likely be Clipeprs head coach until his contract is up, even then we won’t know if he will still get an extension.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
You've wasted all your time because you can't read
I said we should build around our young core, not rebuild.
I’ve explained to you before that we have a superb core of players at certain positions. I like Blake, Eric, AL and DJ for the future (3/4 years into the future) and I think adding Ramon to that would help that grow.
I’ve explained that I don’t want to always rebuild. Ridiculous statement and I never said it.
I also said to you on multiple occassions that I was realistic and said we should be aiming playoffs this year but we weren’t likely to win the NBA title. You twisted that to not reaching the playoffs.
With regards to what the Clippers need. They don’t need a disruptive player who could be a bad locker room influence. They don’t need someone who takes too many bad shots. They don’t need someone who gambles on D so his steal stats look good but the other team get plenty of easy baskets when he misses. They don’t need a mercanary who is after another paycheck before he retires.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Well tell me, is Clippers getting Sessions a possibility at this point?
Mil. is just waiting for a deal for Sessions as Sessions is a RFA. So keep in mind that GETTING Sessions isn’t OUR option. Even so, Sessions isn’t sure he even wants to come here since we have 3 point guards. He wants Telfair out. Wow.. Sessions is managing the Clipeprs now?!?!?
Btw, why the hell would we want to reach the playofs if we cant compete? Oh let’s reach the first round and lose, why not lay it out on the line? Iverson can possibly take us further if he was a 6th man, rather than our 1st man.
You, my friend, need to clear up your statments as I need to learn how to “read”.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
Go away and read the section about
Sessions coming to the Clippers.
I explained all this to you there. Can’t be bothered to repeat it all now.
Key phrase: I am a realist.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Most likely I didnt read the comments
as I didnt even post a comment in there. But I believe there were recent articles of Sessions thinking 3 is too many at the 1 spot.
Please read to me, since I can’t read UK.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
Try the thread
Clippers in the lead for sessions so now what. You were probably heavily medicated when you posted so I don’t blame you for forgetting
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
by ClippersUK on Jul 27, 2009 3:08 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
HAHAHA funny you said that
Im also assuming you forgot that Sessions is a RFA? Also, Im assuming your delusional enough to forget that Session wants Telfair out FIRST. Tell me, which article was more recent? Sessions want telfair out first, or LA in the hunt for Sessions. Los Angeles time, please.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
Maybe it's because you're in England and can't watch all the games, but
your point is not correct. Denver two years ago went as far as it could possibly have gone, given that their center (Nene) and their PF (KMart) were injured for almost the entire year. AI and Melo carried the team. And yes they made the playoffs, unlike the Clippers.
AI wasn’t a good fit in Denver because the team had another evolving go to guy in Melo. So they traded him to Detroit where he couldn’t play in a great team oriented offense (go figure). I think he’d be pretty good in MDSr’s iso offense. You don’t. I get it.
Being in England has nothing to do with it.
I have access to as many NBA games as yourself Jax. International League Pass Broadband gives you access to EVERY regular season NBA game during the season. The only way I lose out is having to watch Clipper games via TV feeds, you don’t always see everything that is going on.
Just so you know Jax. The Nuggets center that year was Camby with Nene off the bench so they had their starting center. KMart always misses loads of games due to his injuries.
Getting swept against LA with no Bynum wasn’t the greatest result when you’ve got 2 All Stars in your team. Maybe they couldn’t have got past the Lakers but no wins.
AI wasn’t a good fit in Denver and isn’t a good fit in Clipperland. He’s a good fit where he can have the ball loads, have plays run for him and generally think he’s the top dog.
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
We can agree to disagree
FYI – they don’t generally have plays run for AI. He just takes it and scores over anyone in his path. Which ain’t bad since he’s 6’ tall. (Which is one of the primary reasons why he’s going to the HOF. ) I guess future hall of famers just aren’t good enough for the 19 win Clippers.
Yep.
Not when they’re way past their prime but don’t realize it.
Or should we also sign up Charles Barkley just b/c he’s a “future hall of famer”?
Correct.
In his prime would be great but not now.
And you are saying we will be a 19 win team this year? We will hopefully be more than double that so if you are then trying to put AI on a playoff challenging young team then…….NO
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
They would sign him for 1 year to come off the bench
I think the guy still has something to bring. You don’t. Time to move on.
All of us in ClipperNation knows..
it probay won’t end right then and there..
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
One thing to consider
is that EJ was mostly playing out of position. With Harris out, Gordon or Mayo played point whenever Rose was out of the game.
His size probably does hurt him the most. Considering that if he were to make the team as strictly a SG, he’d be sharing a back court with Paul, Williams and likely Rose or Harris. Paul is “listed” at 6’0", Rose and Williams are at 6’3". Rose’s 6’3" is shorter than EJ’s 6’3" though.
gordon will make it some time in the near future
he is a great young talent that will be an all star one day
GO BULLS
by FAN of the BULLS on Jul 26, 2009 9:59 PM PDT reply actions
I like Gordon in an underdog role
He’s perfectly cast as a Clipper. And while he may not demand the ball, and not shoot himself out of slumps, we already know he’s going to take the shot given the opportunity.
It seems that Griffin may have to step up and take on the role of the #1 option, and why not? The main thing is that they already understand it’s a partnership, and I don’t sense any ego’s getting in the way between the two of them.
Btw, this is hillarious
we turned a “Gordon not joining USA” post into a,
SIGN IVERSON OR NOTpost.. GG
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
He raised a point about lack of go-to guy.
That was last year. But unfortunately, he followed it up with talk about a decling disruptive HOF’er who takes takes too many shots!
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
Everybody declines in age at one point,
but Iverson is still very effective at what he does.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
"Practivce.. we talking about practice..?"
“Not a game…but practice.”
Not really, we talking about.. Practice..?
No, but now your telling me that Iverson can’t score?
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
You recommend.. threats?
I just post.. never have recommended a threat in my life.. rofl.
Btw, whats the point of recommending threats…
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
Good thing
Can’t stand when people recommend threats. It’s just not cheery, and it’s not usually good advice either. But if you were to recommend a threat, what kind of threat would that be?
Megan Fox..
*melts
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
That's well spotted
And very funny. Oblivious to the poster though!
Bingo! Oh me oh my!
by ClippersUK on Jul 27, 2009 3:06 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
JaxduhSun seems to be quite the contrarian. :p
Stuck in limbo.
Not exactly
I opposed Ai to Clippers at first, but I’m keeping an open mind because Davis does get hurt and Gordon can use the rest. This just provides more scoring punch in our bench. I’m not trying to buy shitty stocks. (:
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
EJ?
Am I missing something? Why does everyone refer to Eric Gordon as EJ? Doesn’t Gordon start with G? What about EG?
I still call him EG
but the J refers to Eric Gordon Jr. People have been confused for some time before also. lol.
Mike Smith on Eric Gordon: "The Clippers may have found their go to scorer."
On a second note, I want Novak back!
It seems to me...
that the hopes some of us have for Iverson this year were brandished upon BD and Ricky Davis last year. The veteran Davis boys would be the go to guys on our team, and with Ricky Davis making very little money, we were adding a 20 point scorer for very little risk. I don’t know how many times last season we sat and watched Ricky in his superfly suits yukking it up with an impressionable Mike Taylor on the bench while Dunleavy gathered the rest of the guys around him during time outs. Ricky might not being hurting us very much on the court because he rarely plays anymore, but I don’t think he’s helping Mike Taylor’s development or professional attitude either.
I don’t think that Iverson, Baron, Zach, or Ricky Davis are necessarily bad guys, but you wouldn’t compare their work ethic to a Battier or Jerry West. Regardless of how many points they score, their tarnished reputations were deservedly earned over the years. They might be good locker room guys in terms of party planning and strip club outings, but you don’t want the young kids to see veterans going quarter speed in practice and rolling their eyes at the coach.
Adding Iverson to our squad this year would be a step backwards after ridding ourselves of Zach and rebuilding with a young nucleus. I don’t think that we can realistically aim for a playoff spot this year. We might be able to sneak in if everything in the West breaks exactly the right way, but it’s a long shot. Adding Iverson might help us win a few more games, but you have to weigh his impact on the chemistry of the team and the development of our young guns. At a certain point this season, Eric, Blake, and Thornton will have to step up and hit game winning shots and not defer to Baron, Ricky Davis, or someone like Iverson. The sooner this happens, the better off we will be as a franchise.
Many years ago, Donald Sterling bought in an aging Dominque Wilkins to sell tickets. The human highlight film didn’t have many highlights left, though he did put up 30 points occasionally to remind us of the talent he once was. Unfortunately, we were just as atrocious with him as before. The further we can move away from those bad old days, when the Clippers were the dumping grounds of aging legends, the better off we will be.
Dunleavy, despite his flaws as a coach, has done a pretty good job as a GM. He didn’t have very many cards to play this off season, but he played well with the cards he had. Last year, our only bright spot was EJ. This year, there is some hope for the franchise. Winning Blake in the lottery had alot to do with it, but so is getting rid of Zach’s contract and turning that into two servicable backup players who is capable of growing with our young nucleus. Now to see if he can make that work on the court. If we can double our wins from last season, it would be a minor miracle. It still won’t get us to the playoffs in the West, but it will satisfy alot of long suffering fans I’m sure.
by MichaelCage on Jul 27, 2009 4:57 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
You raise some good points about AI
I’m really just looking for a scorer off the bench and think he has enough gas in the tank to handle 20 mins / game. I’d take the risk. I can understand why some others don’t want to take that risk. I don’t really think that this is similar to a ‘Nique situation because AI wouldn’t be starting and AI would come cheap.
Re MDSr – I think that another coach (and Griffin shooting touch) could take us very close to the playoffs, if not in the playoffs. We’ll see what happens with MDSr.
Iverson on the bench...
didn’t work very well in Detroit last year when Iverson made it clear that he is more effective as a starter. Dunleavy has to convince Iverson of a bench role on a Clippers team that is much younger and have alot less veteran leadership than Detroit. This is potentially disastrous if and when the losses begin to mount. I can’t see Iverson being very pleased if he’s sitting on the bench at the end of a close game or if one of the youngsters take and miss a last second shot that Iverson believes belong to him. Iverson’s competitive desire can’t be questioned. But that desire might be detrimental to the growth of our youngsters and the franchise at this point in time.
Moreover, a classroom, an office, or a basketball team can only contain so many bad apples before the whole system collapses. Again, I’m not suggesting that people like Baron, Zach, Iverson, or Ricky Davis are bad guys, but they’re not known to be the hardest workers in practice. On a team with a young nucleus, you might be able to tolerate one or two slackers and hope that their attitude doesn’t rub off on the youngsters (Mike Taylor, DeAndre), but if you have three or four slackers (1/3 or 1/4 of your team), then you’re asking for trouble.
Let’s not take a step backwards after taking a few baby steps forward this off season.
I dont think anyone
Suggested MDSr be the backup 2. I’d say its crazy to bring him up, but then you’re Jax.
by John R on Jul 27, 2009 6:49 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
veering the topic a bit
in what scenario can sessions be traded? some variation of a sign and trade. i would love the idea of swapping, somehow Taylor who’s from milwaukee, and Ricky Davis to milwaukee for Sessions and Bruce Bowen.
by Takebb909 on Jul 27, 2009 5:22 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Steve owes me
a beer for the number of hits on this one
its true
The number of folks who like to smash your particular brand of dumb is growing.
by John R on Jul 27, 2009 6:51 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Don't you have a rock to crawl back under?
Who let you out?
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