Clippers at Atlanta - Game Preview
by Steve Perrin on Feb 3, 2010 8:00 AM PST
in Game Previews
Email
Print| 2009/2010 NBA Regular Season | ||
|---|---|---|
 |
vs. |  |
| 21-27 | 30-17 |
|
| Philips Arena |
||
| February 3rd, 2010, 4:00 PM | ||
| FSN Prime Ticket, 980 AM |
||
| Probable starters: | ||
| Baron Davis | PG | Mike Bibby |
| Eric Gordon | SG | Joe Johnson |
| Rasual Butler |
SF | Marvin Williams |
| Marcus Camby | PF | Josh Smith |
| Chris Kaman |
C | Al Horford |
The Back Story:
First meeting of the season. The teams split two game last season.
The Big Picture:
Assuming the five of them can make it from Chicago to Atlanta without getting sick or injured, the Clippers' 'magic bullet' lineup of Chris Kaman, Marcus Camby, Rasual Butler, Eric Gordon and Baron Davis figures to get a real challenge tonight. That group has been pretty uncanny this season (the loss to New Jersey last week notwithstanding, but we'll use Marcus Camby's first quarter exit as an excuse there). But the simple fact is, that group has conveniently missed some tough road games - on this trip alone they weren't together at Denver, or at Boston, or at Cleveland, nor for a whole slew of tough road games before that. So while the gaudy 11-2 record is great, it has been fattening up on home cooking for the most part. But after authoring the best road win in a while (perhaps all season) last night in Chicago, I'm ready to believe. It's certainly true that the team is better with Chris Kaman in the lineup. Without him, halfcourt baskets are pretty arduous work. With him, he will score his 20, but more importantly he commands enough defensive attention that the rest of the Clippers find a little more space in the halfcourt. Oh, and given that this game is in Atlanta, even if they start Butler, let's hope they can find a lot of minutes for Al Thornton. Al's from Georgia and he has owned his home state Hawks in his two seasons in the league.
The Antagonist:
Apologies to Hawks fans, but I have trouble thinking of these guys as 'elite.' Some of the numbers indicate that they are. They're the fourth most efficient offense in the league, and their defense is still in the top half at 12th. They're 19-5 at home. They've already completed a four game season sweep of the Celtics (man, does Boston not want to see these guys in the playoffs). But c'mon - it's the Hawks. Part of my attitude is no doubt due to the fact that they don't tend to play well against the Clippers. Last season LA beat them in Atlanta by 24 at a time when the Clippers couldn't beat ANYBODY. Two seasons ago LA won in LA with a team that consisted of... well, go look at the box score if you need a good laugh. So in my little myopic world, the Hawks remain far too inconsistent to be considered elite. However, in the real world, this team is loaded. They just had two players named to the All Star team (Joe Johnson and Al Horford), and Josh Smith who missed out may be their best player. Add in a couple other solid starters and a sixth man of the year candidate in Jamal Crawford and yeah, these guys are talented. Still, they seem beatable, because, well, it's the Hawks.
The Subplots
- Back to backs. Both teams played last night in the central time zone - the Clippers in Chicago, the Hawks in Oklahoma. So neither team is going to be particularly fresh when they wake up this morning. The Clippers won their game, the Hawks lost to the Thunder - their second straight defeat.
- The long and winding road. Get ready for those Google map graphics on Prime Ticket again tonight. But yes, the Clippers have done a lot of traveling this trip. This is the last game before they finally return to LA. An improbable win tonight would salvage a 3-5 trip for them and get them back to LA with a little momentum. A loss and a 2-6 trip is more likely.
- Long tenured coaches. Quick, name the two longest tenured-coaches in the NBA (seasons coaching the same team). Easy right - Jerry Sloan and Gregg Popovich. Now name the next two on the list. Not so easy. The answer is Mike Dunleavy Sr. of the Clippers and Mike Woodson of the Hawks. Kind of hard to believe, really.
- Al Horford, All Star. Al Horford is a nice player. But an All Star? He's averaging 13.3 points and 9.6 rebounds per game. Meh. Yes, the Hawks have lots of weapons on offense so they don't need him to score much, which is nice. But it's not like his PER of 18.9 is that eye-popping. I have it at 19th in the league for players 6'9" or taller. So again I say, meh. Horford follows in a long line of lackluster Eastern Conference All Star centers - Dale Davis, Jamaal Magloire, Brad Miller, and of course perennial selection Ben Wallace. If Chris Kaman had been drafted by his home state Pistons (who picked Darko Milicic instead), he'd be a six time All Star. (Yes, it's hyperbole.)
- Al Thornton versus the Hawks. Two seasons ago, the Clippers faced the Hawks in the throes of a 3-9 stretch without starters Chris Kaman and Corey Maggette who were both out with the flu (and of course without Elton Brand). Then rookie Al Thornton scored a then career high 33 to lead them to victory. Last season in Atlanta, Al scored 31 in an LA win. In four career games versus the Hawks, he has averaged almost 28 points per game. Al isn't getting a lot of minutes currently in his bench role - but hopefully MDsr will at least give him the chance to heat up a bit, given his history of lighting up the Hawks. Besides, Al's parents will be in the crowd, so it would be nice to let them see their boy play a little more.
- Baron Davis versus Mike Bibby. Mike Bibby has been a pretty good point guard on the offensive end in his career, but he's experiencing a drop off in this, his 12th season. The Hawks have so many weapons that he's down below 9 points per game, easily the lowest scoring average of his career. Then again, his minutes are also down with the arrival of Jamal Crawford. Bibby has never been known as a top defender at the one, and Baron needs to light him up when he's on the floor. Basically, the Clippers need to win this matchup.
- Josh Smith versus Marcus Camby. Believe it or not, Josh Smith has matured. Three seasons ago, he took 152 three pointers. Last season he took 87. He's below 27% for his career - and an athletic freak when he's attacking the rim. This season, he's taken 3 threes through 46 games. Consequently, he's shooting a career-high 51% from the floor and helping his team every night. He's also top three in the league in blocked shots. Having said all that, he's the kind of guy that Marcus Camby can sometimes shut down. He may get loose on the weak side as Marcus drifts away looking for blocked shots, but his perimeter game won't kill the Clippers, and Camby seems to enjoy the challenge of shutting down young whippersnappers like Smith. It will be an interesting matchup to watch.
-
Movie Quote:
Livingston, Ocean's Eleven (2001). I must admit, I have a weakness for a fun caper movie. And it doesn't get a lot funner or more caper-y than Danny Ocean. Basically, George Clooney and Brad Pitt are old-school movie stars - great screen presence, dripping in style. Fun stuff.The moment you set foot on that casino floor, they'll be watching you like hawks. Hawks with video cameras.
- Get the Hawks perspective at Peachtree Hoops.
24 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Al seems so out of favor with this team
I want to blame his struggles and silly mistakes on the fact that he doesn’t have consistent minutes from game to game and doesn’t seem to be getting any guidance out there, though I don’t know if it’s true. I could certainly see how it could affect him, at least this past month. He went from playing over 32 minutes a game in November and December to 21 minutes in January. Seems he’d be given more of a chance if he had a 3 point shot. I’m guessing he’ll either be traded or wont get an extension and let go next year.
by dulciusEXasperis on Feb 3, 2010 9:17 AM PST reply actions
you are misled
he was extended with Eric Gordon sometime last year. Thornton is actually in our books for next year
Hmm...
It would be nice if his shot was more consistent, but I think it’s his defense that keeps him off the floor. He gets caught in the wrong place an awful lot and his footwork’s a mess. That’s alright if he’s out there with Gordon but it can be a disaster when he’s out there with Ricky Davis.
Adjusting to his new role
The November minute totals are misleading because Gordon went out, Thornton was a starter and playing really well for the most part. But the “magic bullet lineup” (not sure I get the magic bullet thing, could use an explanation) is based on Thornton (and Craig Smith) coming off the bench.
Even so, his appearances seem briefer than one would expect, and his play in the role of scoring sub has been inconsistent at best. He seems to have changed his game, especially his shot selection, and he’s attacking the rim a lot more, and hitting the offensive glass as well. He has hit a lot of shots, it seems, at moments when the Clippers need a hoop. But he should be even more effective. And lately Craig Smith has stepped up as the Clippers most obvious and consistent scoring option coming off the bench—the Camby-Kaman-Smith rotation is pretty solid and effective, and it’s notable that DJordan got a DNP last night with Kaman coming back. If Smith and Thornton were both humming along at about the same level the Clippers would be doing well.
Thornton is also kind of a glaring question mark for next year at this point, especially since his adjustment to the new role has been so mixed.
by citizen zhiv on Feb 3, 2010 11:13 AM PST up reply actions
I believe...
Steve’s use of “magic bullet” references the medical phenomenon of a single magical “fix” for a certain condition or illness. If I’m not mistaken the original use of the word was in regard to Penicillin and it’s “magical” ability to treat Syphilis. But I’m not sure about that. (The polio vaccine would be another good use of “magic bullet” in this context. Conversely, we’ve also seen it said that there is no “magic bullet” for cancer.
I think I’ve also seen the term used, confusingly, in regard to JFK’s death… the “magic bullet” that bounced around inside JFK’s body (or skull) with such disastrous results.
I assume SP’s referencing the former form, by which he means that the Clip’s “magic bullet” lineup cures all ills. I’ll agree with that.
Here come The Clippers!
Hope AT gets better minutes, he has played Real Good against ATL in the past.
Everything starts out New, Gets Old and Dies or is Destroyed.
AT always plays well at home
he is from the ATL, time to breakout
i was wondering this the other night, watching thornton dlag through another unremarkable game:
Have the clips mishandled/not developed him to his full potential? Or is he just not that good? I don’t really know the answer to that one. I think we sometimes overrate our “young talent” (we think everyone, gordon, thornton, miles, richardson, maggette) is a young stud brimming with potential but a lot of those guys have ended up average or fizzle out completely. I just wonder when al goes to another team if he will really make us regret not playing him a lot or if it will be “remember al? Whatever happened to him?”. I like his game at times, but I maintain that he seems to have an extremely low bball IQ, taking some ill-advised shots, committing silly charges that would make rhino blush, and getting into quick foul trouble. Then again as a team the clips do all of the above so again, is it al or is it the team/atmosphere he’s in?
by Joe Wolf's Mullet on Feb 3, 2010 1:26 PM PST via mobile reply actions
You and I had this interchange a few days ago, but I’m still unconvinced that Thornton is worse than Butler at all, and certainly don’t understand why Thornton is considered such a drain on this Clipper team. Both players have pretty pedestrian PER’s, yet Thornton’s in higher (11.7 compared to 11.2) and Thornton makes up for having the weaker TS% by being much stronger on the boards. Yes, Butler can “stretch the floor” I guess, and its easy to make that argument the day after he has a really impressive game last night, but before last night the guy has struggled. I could stretch the floor too if you just told me to stand out at the three point line and shoot the three whenever someone passes it to me, especially if you are unconcerned with the rate by which that 3 pointer goes in. And Butler essentially has to be in a system where there are post scorers. Kaman goes down and Butler is still trotted out in the starting lineup getting big minutes over Thornton. I don’t understand that. It’s not like Skinner and Camby need adequate space to operate in the paint.
So, if you believe PER is an any indicator (and yes I realize a lot of you don’t) then the big difference between Thornton and Butler must be defense. Here again, I don’t see it. Defense is one of those things where beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Clipperblog crushes AT for being a moron and always out of position while giving Butler kudos for making an adjustment on Deng last night. While shutting down Deng was nice, it came after the dude was abusing Butler early. Butler has been burned by plenty of opposing SF’s this year (Gay is one I remember vividly) so I don’t see where Butler gets a reputation for being the strong defender. I suppose a lot has to do with the opinion that Thornton is stupid, but he has better size and is better (in my opinion) suited to lock down an elite opposing SF, which there are a lot of in this league. Butler is considered the better “team defender” a point I can’t dispute, but I just don’t see how the gap between these two players (on both ends of the floor) warrants the extreme split we are seeing in playing time.
by Michael White on Feb 3, 2010 1:52 PM PST up reply actions
I dont think Al is stupid, but I think he has very low confidence at this point.
He came in out of shape in the beginning, then started to hit his stride. Now he is in that funk he began the season with.
I've never met Thornton so I won't comment on his intelligence
The challenge he presents to the Clippers is the same thing it has always been. He does only one thing well and that is score, and he does everything else very poorly for his position. He doesn’t score efficiently enough, often enough, to make up for that fact.
He burns many possessions with his attempts to score and doesn’t produce many possessions.
He appears to have shown significant improvement this year, but he is still among the worst in the NBA.
Butler is not great and is below average himself, but his saving grace is that the alternative is Thornton. The Clippers’ problem is still at SF, and to a lesser extend SG.
Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball
I kinda like how Al matches up against other PF's
He handles Zach Randolph pretty well last time they met. He’s a pretty strong guy and handles the slower players (such as the PF’s) fairly well. He’s beastly on offense. Posts up against his man pretty well usually drawing a foul or two from his defender.
by dulciusEXasperis on Feb 3, 2010 3:24 PM PST up reply actions
The main problem with Thornton at the 4
Is that he is a very poor rebounder for a 3. Even if you are correct that he is getting stops, someone has to get the board for it to matter.
Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball
Butler = Better squad play
Here’s a reference that I first got from KA earlier this season (the stats are current): http://basketballvalue.com/teamunits.php?year=2009-2010&team=LAC&sortnumber=3&sortorder=DESC
Take a look at the top three squads (in terms of minutes played). Not surprisingly, the Gordon-less one is the worst. But then, you can see how the squad with AT is significantly worse than the one with Butler.
The difference in their PERs is relatively small. The real difference, then, seems to be their respective grasps of team play. I’m not sure what that means exactly, but it appears to be very real. Sometimes certain players just move better in coordination with the whole.
AT sometimes looks pretty clunky out there, wouldn’t you agree? I like PER alright, but it’s not telling enough of the story in this case.
Incidentally, Craig Smith comes out looking surprisingly good here, especially when he’s subbed for Camby.
Excellent post
It’s what you said and that Sool spreads the floor. Just listen to BD talk about him.
Forget about the rebounding and other issues.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
by Jax on Feb 3, 2010 9:36 PM PST up reply actions
This is good advice
How do you lead the league in points per game in AND eFG% 08-09 and miss the playoffs?
Forget about rebouding and come in 13th in total rebounds and 22nd in DRB%.
So unless your goal is winning basketball games, ALWAYS forget about the rebounding.
Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball
Sad day for you today
I feel sorry for you. you must be lost.
Btw, your post makes no sense.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Not to you
I guess it wouldn’t.
Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball
extremely low bball IQ,
Gotta agree there. There was a shot he took in the 2d half of the Minny game, when we were down but still not out of it. He was dribbling at the top of the key with a guy in his face and a wide open EJ waiting in the ready position 6 feet to Al’s left.
Instead of hitting EJ for the wide-open three ball in rhythm with EJ’s feet set, Al pulls up, jack-knives his legs, and launches an off-balance two (his feet are straddling the line). EJ looks away in disgust as the shot clanks off the rim and Minny collects the rebound and heads the other way.
An EJ 3 there, where I’ll bet he’s 60%, could have brought momentum but Al instead takes a shot he won’t make 3 times out of 10, and that would net only 2 points even if successful.
by benoit benjamin's two left shoes on Feb 3, 2010 1:58 PM PST up reply actions
Don't go out on a limb there. ;-]
“An improbable win tonight would salvage a 3-5 trip for them and get them back to LA with a little momentum. A loss and a 2-6 trip is more likely.”
You think?
by benoit benjamin's two left shoes on Feb 3, 2010 1:48 PM PST reply actions
"...Camby seems to enjoy the challenge of shutting down young whippersnappers like Smith."
I can picture Camby yelling, “Hey, you kids! Get off my lawn!” as he swoops in for a block. Crazy old man Camby.
While it would be nice to see Thornton have a big game, I find it funny that it might add to his problems. Imagine having a great night in front of your family and friends, and then playing only 5 minutes the next game. Seems crazy? Well, his minute totals for the last 5 games are 26, 7, 33, 25, and 12, so it’s possible.
Whether he deserves more consistent minutes or not, I have to believe that the inconsistency isn’t helping. I know I’d be going nuts if I was trying to help the team and impress the Coach without knowing exactly how long of a leash I have on me.
by Handsome_B._Wonderful on Feb 3, 2010 2:48 PM PST reply actions
everyone mentions his minutes but fails to
mention the fact that EJ has been dealing with injuries. I think Al has been out of favor for a long time already, like since he was replaced in the starting lineup.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Days of NBA Lives: Wherein Roy Hibbert tap-dances to Maine
- Grizzlies Valentine’s Day cards are the key to love
- Kevin Love would like the NBA to take the MLB’s approach on All-Star games
- Kobe Bryant fires a few hilarious salvos at Jeremy Lin
- Brandon Jennings states the obvious regarding his 2014 free agency, everyone goes nuts
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
