Do people see now
by clip shot on Mar 17, 2010 10:18 PM PDT
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PrintJust how not good kaman is. He got outplayed by a guy who's undersized at the center postion. Is there more people who want to trade him? and if you think he's so good please explain why. I want to see the reason in your logic.Good game tonight clips. I've been saying for months even when he made the all star team that he should go. I wish baron could go as well but i think he can play if we were winning. I dont think Kaman can keep up a good pace of an all star all season long. And i know baron can be a closer and hit the big shot.
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Assuming you're talking about Bogut...
Kaman has completely different circumstances than Bogut. Kaman plays great in the pick-and-roll, but only if the ball-handler is attracting a lot of defensive attention. Since Baron can’t shoot well enough to get the defense to step up, Kaman is immediately doubled if he gets the dish.
With Jennings, Bogut has a point guard that has seemingly limitless range, as well as being lightning quick. The defense MUST step up, and defenders MUST go over the screen, so Bogut has wide open layups. Put simply, I don’t think that Bogut is the difference-maker, it’s all Jennings. Without Jennings, Bogut has to work on his own; and on his own, Bogut isn’t very efficient (see: every other year before Jennings came along).
Actually Jennings isn't that great of a shooter, I believe his FG% is worse than Baron's.
"Buckle your seat belts, folks. This one's doing down to the wire." -The inimitable Ralph Lawler.
by Gordon for President on Mar 18, 2010 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions
Yup. Baron - 42%, Jennings 37%.
"Buckle your seat belts, folks. This one's doing down to the wire." -The inimitable Ralph Lawler.
by Gordon for President on Mar 18, 2010 10:07 AM PDT up reply actions
He shoots 38.6% from three-point-range though
Given that Baron is over 10% worse than Jennings from beyond the arch (28.2%), I think my comment stands that Jennings requires guards to go over screens, and Baron doesn’t.
If you don’t step up on him, he’ll drop 55 on you, which is a lesson the entire league has learned after the Warrior’s made the mistake of not respecting that jumper.
I wonder...
How many guys shoot better from three-point-range than they do from inside the arch? That’s pretty weird. I’ve never noticed that in anyone else (though, I’ve never really looked for it).
Read the preview Citizen...
I work my fingers to the bone, and then you ask a question I just answered. This is the thanks I get.
Three. There are three players who shoot better from three than two (who have taken more than 100 threes).
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Mar 18, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
*facepalm*
My bad. I really do appreciate your research though!
It’s interesting, though, that the other two aren’t the primary playmakers on their teams and never really create for themselves. Those guys are both at their best when LeBron is creating for them, while Jennings is creating his own shot practically all the time. This just adds to the mystery that is Brandon Jennings.
I suppose I should propose a new question, then. What kind of player off the dribble is better from three-point-range than two-point-range?
FYI
eFG%
Baron Davis 44.3%
Jennings: 42.9%
TS%
Davis: 49.9%
Jennings: 47.5%
by Michael White on Mar 18, 2010 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions
The Difference
Jennings is a rookie, and BD is a _ year veteran. And just as important, the Bucks and Jennings play a much easier schedule in the east.
Just pointing out that even when you add weight to the 3P% (eFG) Baron still shoots the higher clip. Their respective experience levels is irrelevant when game planning against the pick and roll.
By the way, the TS% for both players is dreadful.
by Michael White on Mar 18, 2010 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions
That said...
I still think defenders aren’t safe dropping back on the pick and roll with Jennings, while they are pretty safe doing that with Baron.
Stats
Kaman 8-13 FG 20 Pts, 7 Reb, 3 Blks
Bogut 8-15 FG, 18 Pts, 11 Reb, 4 Blks
Also Bogut and Kaman are both 7 ft.. Are you high?
you guys must have man crushes
You bring up the stats for one game check the season stats and it will show kaman is a bum. Bogut is not 7 if so he’s grown since he’s day playing college ball at utah where he was listed at 6’10.Why do people continue to make excuses for kaman your either have the will or you dont.Did he get a double double no how often does he get a double double. Not very often.And i said he played good but it’s one game he will go back to 3 rebounds no blocks 16pts by next game if not the next one in the next 3 games. And if your talking about defenders in a pick and roll situation yes there supposed to go over the screen if not kamans supposed to bump the ball handler up so the player can recover.Then he’s supposed to sprint back to man (kaman and sprinted lol)When is clip nation going to wake up and see how he should be gone for something that’s worth something. He holds value (some what) And if he played so well how come drew gooden got talked to after the victory.Not Kaman, speaking of gooden him and kaman are in the same boat underperformers
Bogut is a C
period
to say that he is not is retarded.
Chupa! Chupa!
by DonaldSterlingSucks on Mar 17, 2010 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions
his season stats are
18.8 ppg (at 48.8%,) 9.1 rebounds, 1.7 assists, 1.2 blocks, 74.8% from the FT line.
9:21 LAC - Offensive foul on C. Smith
by LancasterGordon4Eva on Mar 18, 2010 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions
You're logic is flawed...
Strike that. Your logic is non-existent.
You bring up the stats for one game…
You’re the one who made a FanPost that was focused on this one game.
Bogut is one of the absolute best centers in the league right now.
Kaman played well. You’re timing is the other thing that is missing, along with your logic.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
by Steve Perrin on Mar 18, 2010 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm amazed
That our friend here has managed to generate 28 comments on this.
by citizen zhiv on Mar 18, 2010 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions
That's because Kaman
is about as polarizing here as health care reform. Anyways he’s obviously misinformed. I was at the game, if anything Bogut is bigger than Kaman.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Mar 18, 2010 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions
On TV Bogut looked bigger too.
But while the post above is obviously stupid, it can (on occasion) generate some good side debates, like discussing the pick and roll game vis-a-vis Baron and Jennings.
by Michael White on Mar 18, 2010 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions
I've always convinced myself that Kaman isn't a legit 7 footer...
…but that’s because when we took a picture together for one of the season ticket-holder events, our heads were the exact same size, and I’m only 5’11" :(
sorry clipshot but I dont agree with you about Kaman
I think he’s very skilled, but coach has played him too many minutes. I think he’s going to be more productive when he plays about 30min a game
yeah I think playing 40 min. a game is wearing down on him
there is a reason many playoff contenders rest their stars before the playoffs.
LeBron or Bust !!!!
by bestclipfan on Mar 18, 2010 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions
Not to mention...
…the coaches have been treating him as a #1 option all season. He simply isn’t. Kaman isn’t the problem, nor is he the solution; he’d be a good supporting player if anyone else on the team could step up and lead.
Totally!
It probably sounds too simplistic, but it seems logical that since Kaman doesn’t like the double team, he shouldn’t be the #1 option. All of the #1 options who play on good teams in the league punish teams for double teaming them, regardless of their position.
Maybe it’s not that black and white, but I sure wish Kaman wouldn’t panic when he gets doubled… it would make life so much simpler for him.
not if you check there per You guys must be the ones who thinks he should have been an All Star
When you think of a center (and im not talking about a legend) a role player since everybody can agree that what kaman is.You would think of defense block shots protecting the rim. Rebounds and some offense. He has offense other than that.It goes down hill. His off rebounds are beyond low he’s blocks are beyond low his fg is low the only thning that he does really well is shoot ft.He’s an avg def rebounder.Bogut is doing better than kaman in everything just about besides ft.If you like stats he’s 22nd in per he wins us 6.3 games a year 31st in rebounds. He’s second in usg which makes it worst the fact that he’s not getting a double double.33 in TO which means he turns the ball over allot in the league he’s either 2nd or 3rd 42nd in asst 39 in true shooting. And to say he’s the same as Bogut is laughable if your a stat man.Brooke Lopez would be more of comparison best off mins played.He gets less touches less def rebounds but wins in every other category. And if you were to put Kaman with the bucks they would lose more games. Even if he played less minutes. He doesnt have enough of a drive to get more rebounds
If you want to be an allstar or be a winner
some would say our best player others would say our 2nd best and that’s just not the case Chris Kaman is the white version of eric dampier.If robert swift was on the team you guys would think he’s great to huh. lol
I don't know why they love him so much either
If you go back and look at championship teams, they all had a powerful front-court. They were always aggressive on defense, had the ability to effect shots, protected the rim, and would rebound on both ends. Kaman does none of that, why do you think having him is going to produce anything similar?
by ChrisPaulFTW on Mar 18, 2010 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
For the record...
I’d take Kaman over such luminaries as Luc Longley, Fabricio Oberto/Francisco Elson or Rasho Nesterovic. Who are those guys? Just the centers of a few recent championship teams. The difference is the Clippers don’t have a Shaquille O’Neal, Tim Duncan, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant or Kevin Garnett on their team. You know what, neither do 25 out of the other 30 teams…
Couple of problems here chief, you are getting ahead of yourself talking about championships. Let’s figure out how to make the playoffs on a regular basis. Next we need to acquire or develop a star. Chris Kaman is not the root of the problem, he’s just a part of the equation.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Mar 18, 2010 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions
You're right we don't have that player...
And excluding The Detroit Piston every championship team has had one. So where do we go from here?Lucky for us this offseason gives us a chance to acquire one. Wade, Bosh, LeBron, and even Joe Johnson would work (assuming the Clippers still have a solid team around him.)
So we sign a franchise player but unfortunately even having one of those players still isn’t enough because you need a presence down low as every championship team (excluding the Bulls) has had. You can mention Oberto, Elson, and Nesterovic but not one of them was the steady rock in the frontcourt of the team; in fact all of them were playing behind Tim Duncan. So could Kaman work as a side man to a better post presence? I would say so. But could someone else less talented just as easily work with a better post presence? I’d say the names you mentioned earlier clearly state yes.
This is why we made the playoffs in 05-06 and were so successful. Chris Kaman was playing behind Elton Brand who had the tenacity to keep us in games. Therefore, Kaman is not good enough alone to help us into the playoffs. He is a side-option and since his is such, he is expendable when it comes to rebuilding this team.
P.S. He always looks like he has a wedgie creeping up his butt whenever he’s running up and down the floor.
P.P.S. Kris Humphries.
This is where Blake Griffin comes into play
he has all-world talent. If he becomes the next Chris Webber then all of a sudden we have a very potent combo at the 4 and 5. You almost always have to draft this “super star” (Lakers – Magic Johnson, Celtics – Larry Bird, Bulls – Pippen, Bulls – Jordan, Lakers – Kobe, Spurs – Duncan, Heat – Wade). Or you can really go for it and trade away a lot for this player (KG and Shaq [for the Heat]). The only real big free agent signings really have been Shaq to the Lakers, Zo to the Heat and Tracy McGrady to the Magic, otherwise you see overpaid guys like Rashard Lewis, Kenyon Martin, Grant Hill (with the injuries and all), Larry Hughes etc etc. Why would their current teams let these guys leave to begin with? They obviously have the best idea on their health, skill and talent… so if they do let them leave that’s very interesting.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Mar 18, 2010 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Good centers aren't easy to come by!
For some reason this guy or gal clip shot dislikes Kaman and i don’t understand why. Kaman
this year has by far exceeded any expectations that this Kaman is Kaman 4.0. He still leads
all centers in scoring and his rebounding has gotten better now that Camby isn’t here. So i
ask you my friend tell me who the hell is out there that you think the clippers can get that is
better than the cave man. If you want to hate on somebody why don’t you hate on the highest paid player on this team who is grossly under performing!
Check your stats
He’s rebounding has gotten worst thats the part that upsets me the most he was averaging 9.5 with camby he’s averaging 9.1 right now he’s 2nd in the league in points not 1st and he’s number 5 in mins but is 12th in rebounding number 2 in TOs and if you go by per he barley makes the top 20 in centers wich means he is luc longley or joe kline just with more offensive game he also shoots the most out of centers and has one of the worst fg% I think we should trade him to the bulls or phili for iggy or deng and go after david lee or chris bosh. I wish we would have gone after josh smith but MDsr and i dont see eye to eye. Or trade him for who ever gets evan turner and try to draft monroe or cousins.And i did hate on bdiddy but he’s not worth as much as kaman I just dont like the fact that he plays with no heart like b diddy and we can’t have two of those. But i know when push comes to shove bdiddy will take the final shot and have a better shot at making it than kaman.I’ve also see bdiddy be a winner and take his team to the next level. Kaman no i’ve seen kaman miss lay up after lay up panic in the double team he’s not a rookie. I wish he would reach his potential and to hear Dirk say how good he is but it doesnt show up in the games every night astounds me.
Your writing hurts my eyes and brain
So let me get this right, you agree he is the 2nd highest scoring center and he is the 12th best rebound big man… sounds like an above center to me. Your solution is to trade him and draft a rookie PF to somehow replace him. Awesome.
FA in 2010.
by ClipperChuck on Mar 18, 2010 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Your the one who needs to check your stats!!!!
As of this morning he is still leading all centers in scoring you can check it on yahoo sports stats.
Also for the record Kaman had 8.8 rebounds when Camby left and now he has 9.1 rebounds.
So basically i don’t know where you get you stats but your the one who’s wrong. You just
hate Kaman and i don’t know why because the big goofball is producing thats much more
than i can say about your stats.
No i want to trade him
for a sf His stats should be better i dont think people are getting it.There’s guys in the league who play 10 mins less and get the same or more rebounds. Not to mention i dont think he can be on the same court at the same time as blake. And the guys i said replace him with would play center. He takes more shots than anybody as well at center. He’s the kobe of the center when it comes to the most shots taken.
New trade idea...
Chris Kaman + Baron Davis for Chris Bosh (sign-and-trade) + Jarrett Jack (check his stats here)
Then move our first round pick for a second rounder this year + future first round considerations.
These moves leave us with enough money to sign Lebron.
Bosh / Jordan
Griffin / Sofo
Lebron / 2nd Rd. Pick
Gordon / Free Agent?
Jack / 2nd Rd. Pick
Jack and EJ are both good outside shooters, and with a front court of Bosh-Griffin-Lebron, that’s probably all that they would need to do LOL..
I think that lineup could do some damage.
"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.
You think a lineup of Bosh and Lebron could do some damage huh?
by Michael White on Mar 19, 2010 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions
They played pretty well together in the Olympics
But I’m not sure if Bosh can take a back seat to anyone.
I'm pretty sure Bosh would take a back seat to LeBron
if it increased his chances at winning a championship, which it would.
LeBron or Bust !!!!
by bestclipfan on Mar 19, 2010 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions
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