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Around SBN: The Gift Of The 2003 Tigers

Larry Brown the next LAC coach? No thank you.

[Note by Steve Perrin, 03/10/10 12:07 AM PST ] Sweet merciful crap, there's a lot going on.  I sort of think the Larry Brown thing is significant in all of this.  As our resident Bobcats expert, I wanted to promote citizen ClipCats FanPost to the Front Page.  I don't necessarily agree with everything here, but this is coming from a Clippers and Bobcats fan who has been watching Larry Brown coach the Bobcats for almost two seasons now, so it's a very informed opinion.  Most significant perhaps is the obvious but important distinction that we are almost 20 years removed from the first time Larry Brown coached the Clippers - we wouldn't be getting that guy, we'd be getting the current version of Larry Brown.  Steve

[Note by Steve Perrin, 03/10/10 12:17 AM PST ] A quick clarification:  Citizen ClipCat wrote this BEFORE the Clippers announced the ouster of MDsr.  In order to get it to the top of the Front Page, I updated the time stamp, but it was posted several hours before anyone knew MDsr's fate (unless ClipCat has some super secret source he hasn't mentioned). 

MadGlove posted a recent FanShot indicating Larry Brown has let the Clippers know he would be interested in returning as coach.  Many citizens appear to enthusiasticly support this idea just as Bobcats fans did when he became coach here in Charlotte.  I was one of those who initially believed Coach Brown was just what the Bobcats needed.  Back when he coached the Clippers, I became a die-hard Clipper fan and believed he was pretty much the greatest basketball coach ever.

However, a lot has changed since then, and the Clippers wouldn’t be hiring the 90’s version of Larry Brown. While he has had a Hall of Fame career and is still very popular in Charlotte (Tar Heel roots help a lot), I do not agree that he would be a good coach for the Clippers based on his "accomplishments" during his two year tenure in Charlotte.  More after the Jump

Star-divide

1) The System - Players and fans have been frustrated with Dunleavy's tight control over the Clipper offense.  While LB in my opinion is a far superior as in-game coach to Dunleavy, he is no less controlling.  Baron Davis is pretty much the antithesis of the type of PG that Larry Brown wants (efficient distributor, defense oriented, definitely not a chucker).  I'm not at all sure that Baron and Brown would be able to successfully coexist.

2) Rotation – Brown has kept a very tight rotation relying heavily on his starters. This season Gerald Wallace leads the NBA with 42.0 MPG. Stephen Jackson plays 40.3; Boris Diaw logs 35.4 and Ray Felton plays 32.6. None of the centers (Chandler, Nazr, Ratliff and Diop) have been able to stay healthy or productive playing long minutes so they are mixed and matched as needed.

Dunleavy tried a similar strategy early last season with the Clippers, and injuries quickly followed. Charlotte hasn’t had major injury problems under Brown, but last season Charlotte lost 7 out of 8 games in April to miss the playoffs. Could have been coincidence, but the team looked very flat and tired at the end of the year. This year, signs of fatigue are already appearing, and another late season collapse would be tough for Brown to explain.

3) Reliance on veteran players – Brown has totally overhauled the roster to create the type of team he wanted, and that team is heavily stacked with veterans. Rufus on Fire (Bobcats blog) includes a line in almost every game review lamenting the lack of playing time for last year’s draft picks, Gerald Henderson and Derrick Brown. Meanwhile, mediocre vets like Stephen Graham and Flip Murray have taken up too many of the limited bench minutes. If you’ve been frustrated with the amount of playing time guys like Tim Thomas, Cat Mobley and Ricky Davis have logged the last few years at the expense of developing prospects, Larry Brown is not the coach for you.

4) Personnel Decisions – The inner workings of the Bobcats front office can be difficult to comprehend with president/owner MJ, GM Rod Higgins and Brown all playing important roles. The exact roles each of them plays in decisions is not particularly well defined, but there are a couple consistent principles. Even before Jordan bought the team, he hired just about everyone, usually old friends, and he brought in Brown and Higgins. Meanwhile, Brown has major input into all personnel decisions and is the most influential voice as to who plays for the Bobcats.

In that role, Brown has consistently made moves that maximized short term value by bringing in vets with long, expensive contracts that fit his system (Boris Diaw, Vlad Radmanovic, Gana Diop, and Stephen Jackson) as well as shorter term rentals (Raja Bell, Juwan Howard, Tyson Chandler, Flip Murray, Stephen Graham, Theo Ratliff and Ty Thomas). Charlotte has traded away two future 1st round picks and its previous two 1st round selections prior to Brown’s arrival. They dumped Emeka Okafor for future salary cap flexibility and instead will pay Tyson Chandler, Nazr Mohammed, Gana Diop and Alexis Ajinca a combined $27.6 million next year. As a result, Charlotte will be well over the salary cap before free agency begins this year. Signing both of their own primary free agents, Ray Felton and Ty Thomas, would almost certainly push them into luxury tax range.

5) Winning – Prior to Larry Brown, the Bobcats were horribly mismanaged by rookie Coach Sam Vincent (aka the Ham Biscuit). At one point, the players locked him out of the locker room at halftime, and Charlotte fans pretty much unanimously called for a new coach. Brown came in and won a whopping three more games than Vincent last year. This year, he’s coaxing another incremental improvement from the team, but the "success" he created is not sustainable. Charlotte will almost certainly decline next year due to its lack of cap space to re-sign even its own players and the lack of development from recent draft picks. 

The Clippers are set up with all the tools for long term success, and they need a coach with some amount of patience who will work for more than just short term success.  I would prefer a new coach next season who is totally committed to coaching the players he has and is not endlessly remolding the team into his image.  I'm not sure who that coach should be, but I'm pretty sure it shouldn't be Larry Brown.

Comment 29 comments  |  1 recs  | 

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We need a defensive coach

Like Vangundy or Avery Johnson. But not Larry we got a good young core. I’d hate to see Eric Gordan traded for Raymond Felton because he can’t control the rock sometimes.

by clippa j on Mar 9, 2010 1:58 PM PST reply actions  

Good points

I was initially all for this idea, but you make some great points. And thinking about it further, it’s definitely true that he tends to be the guy who sacrifices the future for the present…even if the present means being .500.

It’s also true that he tends to fall in love and out of love with players for seemingly random reasons.

There’s no question that he’s a great coach, but maybe the personnel control would be too much.

In general, I’m in favor of a separate GM and coach anyway.

by madglove on Mar 9, 2010 2:45 PM PST reply actions  

Without reading all of this

I’m thinking that it was posted before the Dunleavy severance. That makes it much more interesting. CC did the slightly shorter version on the Larry Brown fanshot. More later.

by citizen zhiv on Mar 9, 2010 8:32 PM PST reply actions  

Larry Brown

We would be lucky to get a coach the caliper of Larry Brown. He won with the Clips in the 90’s before DTS screwed it up.

by mrbiff on Mar 9, 2010 8:40 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Uh no

Brown is in the late 60’s, I think it would be more wise to get a young coach.

Ask New York and Detroit what “Caliber” coach Larry Brown is…he quit on both teams and negotiated expensive buyouts for himself.

This is going to be my team, and we're going to rise together.
-Clipper Darrell

by oasisman on Mar 10, 2010 12:13 AM PST up reply actions  

Totally Agree Mr.Biff!

I mean a lot of the negative stuff they were saying about Larry Brown, they were saying back then, too! And I don’t claim that he does have faults. But he wins games and would be a presence and would be the claiber of coach that would draw top free agents who want to win. Actually my dream coach (and the coach I’d pursue if I owned the team or was GM with authority to hire the coach of my choosing) would be Lenny Wilkens. I realize he’s up there in age now and may have lost interest in coaching but to me even though he is the winningnest coach of all time, he is also the most underrated. He could help Chris Kaman the way he helped Jack Sikma and he doesn’t have a big ego and players really like playing for him. Another coach who would be interesting is Coach K of Duke. However he has never coached in the NBA so it would be risky.

by Kind67 on Mar 11, 2010 5:20 AM PST up reply actions  

Edit to My Post Above (Titled Totally Agree Mr. Biff)

I meant to say in the second sentence that I don’t claim that he doesn’t have faults. But I think the positives far outway the negatives with him. Especially in that the negatives are probably exaggerated.

by Kind67 on Mar 11, 2010 5:23 AM PST up reply actions  

Byron Scott?

I know his success is a tad limited, but he’s shown both with NJ and NO that he can get some results. Maybe he wouldn’t be that bad of an option.

Though I suppose we can just wait till the summer and literally offer the HC job to anyone that ____ (fill in with superstar FA’s name) wants as a way to attract a signing.

by TheNewbster on Mar 10, 2010 12:42 AM PST reply actions  

The problem with Byron is

the last time he and Baron played together they got in a fight, there is no guarantee that anything is different between them now. I continue to think that the best case scenario for the team is to get a good GM and to somehow get JVG back into coaching.

LeBron or Bust !!!!

by bestclipfan on Mar 10, 2010 7:02 AM PST up reply actions  

well-written and thoughtful analysis/points presented here

To which I say SO WHAT? We’ve made the playoffs what, 4 times in the time the team has been in LA? He was responsible for 2 of them. Not to mention 3 finals appearances, 1 championship, and a sh#tload of conference final and semi-final appearances. The guy is a winner, something that is foreign to these parts. So he favors veterans, I’ll concede that, but guess what, any veteran, winning coach does. You think van gundy or any of the other names being bandied about are gonna wanna sit here and be part of a total youth movement and 5 year plan? Hardly. Personally I’m tired of playing for next year or 2 yrs down the road. This team has been doing that since I’ve been a fan. Time to win already, and with a little tweaking and a legitimate presence in the huddle, this team has a shot. Bring on the nomad.

by Joe Wolf's Mullet on Mar 10, 2010 12:48 AM PST via mobile reply actions   1 recs

So what?

The fact that he would gut the team for short term gain, a gain that is 1) neither sustainable nor 2) even that good (in the case of Charlotte they are a .500 team in the East.) it seems like a pretty big red flag. Especially since if it just goes badly, Brown will bolt, and Clipper fans will be left holding the bag.

But hey, who doesn’t love the idea of trading Eric Gordon for Tayshaun Prince.

by Michael White on Mar 10, 2010 8:13 AM PST up reply actions  

Dunleavy will be missed

I had been a Clipper fan since before the D Manning draft. I have lived through many bone head moves but this takes the cake. Dunleavy was the best thing to happen to the Clippers since they left Buffalo. I was not completely sold on this coaching ability but in his General Manager position he was great, even his coaching was better than anyone we had in Los Angeles. PLEASE don’t tell me about Larry Brown, the one who gave us RANDY WOODS as his personal pick in the draft.
I never thought I would say it but I QUIT as a Clipper fan, good luck with Donald, the idiot

by Fdannymanning on Mar 10, 2010 6:19 AM PST reply actions  

interesting time to bail

when there are endless possibilities before us and a possible golden age of this godforsaken team.

oh well, laters!

p.s. randy woods, eh? people who live in glass korolevs shouldn’t throw stones.

by Joe Wolf's Mullet on Mar 10, 2010 6:54 AM PST up reply actions  

Sam Cassell,the answer for the new Clipper coach.

Sam Cassell is the right person to take over the coaching for the Clippers,He will not take anyones or Davis antics.
He is a proven leader and coach when he played.His energy is excellant.Davis will put up or shut up with Casell if the Clippers have to live with him.

by Vegas Mike on Mar 10, 2010 9:37 AM PST reply actions  

If Larry Brown comes on board (AGAIN) I'm done - RANT

I’ve been a Clipper fan since they first moved to LA in 1984. Back then good Laker tickets were a very difficult purchase at the Forum, but you could walk up day of – and purchase good tickets at the Sports Arena. I sat middle of the lower level about 10 rows up – and LOVED IT. I grew to like the Clips and went to see them many times. I have media guides from the 80s with the General Gary Grant on the cover. I saved all the ticket stubs from back then and look at them amazingly now. It’s a rabid following that continues to this day. I moved to Texas (and now Alaska) and have purchased the NBA package every year it’s been available with the single sole purpose to watch the beloved Ralph Lawler call Clippers games.

I never cared about losing seasons.
I never cared about racist owners or lame GMs.
I never cared about Laker fanboy bashing.
And I NEVER cared about “the curse”.

All of that is subjective.

What is not subjective is that Larry Brown quit on the Clips when things got rough in 1993. He didn’t get fired, or retire, he walked away, in the worst way possible – to coach Indiana. I believe he called in to ESPN to announce it at the end of the season. Oh by the way – at the end of a 41-41 season and a playoff appearance. Why would this franchise want him back? So he can make a fool out of Clips Nation again? Like ClipCat says, no thank you.

Only two things would ever make me renounce my fan-ship – if they fired (or somehow forced out) Ralph Lawler, or if they re-hire Larry Brown. Clippers fans deserve better. And that is not subjective.

by bones_boy on Mar 10, 2010 11:28 AM PST reply actions  

Uhh if they hired Larry Brown

I would at least give him a chance to screw up before renouncing my fan ship.

LeBron or Bust !!!!

by bestclipfan on Mar 10, 2010 5:23 PM PST up reply actions  

I thought that was kind of interesting/funny

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1003495/index.htm a 1992 Sports Illustrated article written after Sterling last hired Larry Brown. It’s worth reading just for this quote:

“Oh, god, my phones don’t stop ringing, everyone saying,’ Thank you, thank you, thank you for Larry Brown,’ " Sterling says. “It’s like a religious experience.”

9:21 LAC - Offensive foul on C. Smith

by LancasterGordon4Eva on Mar 10, 2010 8:36 PM PST reply actions  

Awesome article...

You should make it a Fanpost… it’s a classic.

by John Raffo on Mar 11, 2010 10:31 AM PST up reply actions  

Thanks for promoting the post Steve.

I thought about writing this the first time Larry to LA rumors came out but decided the rumors weren’t worth considering until Charlotte’s ownership situation was settled. Then, this all seemed to be a dead issue until I read Madglove’s FanShot.

Now that Dunleavy is gone, I’d be even more worried about bringing in a personality as strong as Coach Brown because I don’t see anyone else in the Clipper FO who could counterbalance his impulsive tendencies to make bad trades. And it’s also pretty discomforting to still be hearing rumors about Brown reaching out to other teams even after MJ bought the Bobcats and while he’s supposed to be leading his team to its first ever playoff berth, which he’s seemingly mortgaged the team’s next couple of years to achieve. It’s the wrong kind of distraction at exactly the wrong time, yet it’s habitual with him.

It’s a little awkward to be called a “Bobcats expert” if only because quite a few Charlotte fans are still drinking the Larry Brown Kool-Aid. There’s a very wide range of opinions on LB over at Rufus from fans who trust every move he makes because he’s “a genius” to a guy who reminds me a lot of our old friend FireDunleavy.

I wrote the reasons Brown shouldn’t be hired to coach the Clippers, but that’s not to say he doesn’t have good qualities as a coach, too. He does command his players’ respect in a way very few other coaches do. He is still a great basketball teacher (at least for the players he wants to teach). He gets his players to play hard and to adjust their game to function as a team in a way few other coaches can. If he would focus on coaching, make an honest effort to develop young players as well as the vets and leave the personnel decisions to someone else, I think he’d be a great coach just about anywhere. But asking Larry Brown to do all that is asking the impossible.

by ClipCat on Mar 11, 2010 7:22 AM PST reply actions  

Larry Brown would mean no LeBron

Not sure if it’s been mentioned yet, but a couple of Olympics ago Brown froze out LeBron, Carmelo, and Wade I believe. These three guys all hate Brown for it and I doubt they’d play for him.

by Hooch20 on Mar 11, 2010 8:43 AM PST reply actions  

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