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Clippers Summer 2010 - Is That It?

The Clippers have had some pretty busy offseasons lately.  In 2008, they signed Baron Davis, and for about a week at the beginning of July, they appeared to have both Davis and Elton Brand in the fold, before they got Falked by FElton and his agent and Brand went to Philadelphia.  They followed up the loss of Brand with a one-sided trade to get Marcus Camby from the Nuggets.  The following season, they won the lottery, drafted Blake Griffin, and traded Zach Randolph (acquired six months before) in a move that simultaneously helped transform the roster and set them up to have cap space this summer.

The summer of 2010 figured to be the biggest of all.  The Clippers entered the offseason with a new GM, needing a new coach, and with $19M in their pockets.  The offseason isn't over yet, but it is mid-July, and all of the big name free agents are settled.  So how's it going so far?

Star-divide

Meh.

The offseason started ominously, with the Clippers sitting on the sideline while the other teams in need of coaches filled their jobs.  We're told that they were doing their due diligence, conducting phone interviews, and patiently creating their list of candidates.  Maybe.  Or maybe they were waiting for the market to settle, seeing who would still be available, and finding out what kinds of offers other teams were making so that they were certain not to overpay.  You're less likely to get into a bidding war if you're the only team who still needs a coach.

Did the Clippers miss out on any great candidates while they were on the sidelines?  Time will tell.  There was a report that they had asked the Celtics for permission to speak with Tom Thibodeau, but no face to face interview ever occurred.  Dwane Casey, one of their finalists, was almost hired in Atlanta, so they risked losing him by waiting.  In the end, they hired Vinny Del Negro, a choice most of Clips Nation (myself included) seems ambivalent about.  Suffice it to say, I'm not surprised he hadn't been snapped up by another team.

The draft was certainly a highlight of the summer.  Drafting 8th, they were ecstatic when Al-Farouq Aminu, the athletic small forward they coveted, made it to them.  Then, they aggressively pursued another pick, and traded to acquire Eric Bledsoe from Oklahoma City at 18.  To top the night off, Willie Warren, a player who had been considered a lottery pick eight months earlier, was still available at 54.  Things were looking up.

When free agency opened on July 1, no one really expected the Clippers to secure the services of LeBron James, but at least they got an invitation to make a presentation.  With no head coach and no owner in the meeting, the Clippers had the smallest delegation and made the shortest presentation of the six candidate teams.  Was that a problem?  Probably not, given that LeBron was never going to pick LA, but it came off in the media as the Clippers once again being a small time organization not worthy of being taken seriously.

But even if we knew the Clippers weren't going to get LeBron, $19M to spend on free agents is nothing to sneeze at, so hopes were high that the team would make some significant acquisitions.  Well, as of July 14, the team has signed Ryan Gomes, Randy Foye and Brian Cook.  Yippee.

Don't get me wrong; these aren't actually bad signings.  And unlike many other franchises this summer, the Clippers didn't overpay (much) in any of these contracts.  Foye can be a capable backup at both guard spots, something the Clippers desperately need.  Gomes has started more often than not for several seasons in Minnesota, and an experienced small forward is definitely a good acquisition.  Cook is pretty terrible, but you're not going to get great players for the NBA minimum; not when you're the Clippers. 

When Gomes was signed, I actually assumed that he was being signed to add depth on the wing, and that there was still another significant signing in the works.  After all, the team still had about $10M to spend, even allowing for a contract for Sofoklis Schortsanitis, MBFGC.  But almost a week later, with Mike Miller, Kyle Korver, Travis Outlaw and Josh Childress all signed, it seems as if maybe the team is done after all.  They have way too much money to spend on a backup, small forward seems to be the only spot where they need a starter, and none of the small forwards left on the market are worth the money they have.  Basically, the choices are Ronnie Brewer, or one of the veteran guys with baggage - like a Josh Howard or a Richard Jefferson.  It could certainly still happen - but I'm feeling more and more like Ryan Gomes was acquired to be the starter at the 3.  Leaving the team a whole lot of money to... to... well, to put in Donald Sterling's pocket, I guess.

Being under the cap has some advantages certainly.  Maybe they have their eye on a player that another team is looking to get rid of.  There's a long time until the season starts, and a lot more can happen.  Maybe we're being too hasty if we think that the Clippers don't have any more big moves left in them.  But that's what it's beginning to feel like.

For one thing, with so many teams carrying tons of cap space still, not to mention that half the NBA seems to have a huge trade exception, the Clippers are far from the only option for the remaining free agents and/or salary motivated trades.  The Suns and Jazz each used their trade exceptions from their departed stars to reload their rosters, the Suns with the small forward I most wanted, Josh Childress, and the Jazz with an upgrade over Boozer in Al Jefferson.  The point is that if the Clippers think they can be opportunistic and wait for the perfect sitation to come along, I'm not so sure that's true.  There will be plenty of teams interested, and with available money, if some intriguing player suddenly finds himself on the trading block in the near future. 

If both Willie Warren (signed to an unguaranteed contract today) and Sofo (expected to get an offer this week before he leaves to join the Greek National Team) make the team, that brings the roster to twelve.  They have to sign at least one more player, and could sign up to three.  MDsr always liked to carry 14 contracts, leaving one roster spot open.  But Eric Pincus seems to think the Clippers will carry 13 contracts this season. 

Whatever the number, if the Clippers only have minor deals left in them this summer, it's going to be a major letdown in what was supposed to be the biggest offseason in the history of the franchise.

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Great summary

pretty much agree with everything you said. Even the fact the team carries only 13 spots seems like a cheap move, especially considering the team has 4 rookies.

FA in 2010.

by ClipperChuck on Jul 14, 2010 12:07 AM PDT reply actions  

Patience

Sorry, I’ve said this on other threads as well. 2 summers ago, we were busy debating the value of Josh Smith, then somehow the trade for Camby came thru. There is still August and early Sept, a lot of stuff left to be decided for a many teams.

Many FA’s and restricted FAs are still available. I’m sure there has to be another move left.

This is going to be my team, and we're going to rise together.
-Clipper Darrell

by oasisman on Jul 14, 2010 12:24 AM PDT reply actions  

Olshey was a GMMDSr protege IIRC

there can still be one of those salary dump moves.

Guess we do have to practice a little more patience.

by bacek on Jul 14, 2010 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

HECK NO!

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Camby came over on July 15th

So big news tomorrow?

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

You're probably right...

There’s a long way to the start of the season, and hopefully I’ll feel silly for having written this by then. The problem with the patience argument is that my puny brain isn’t seeing what’s out there. The Clippers lost Brand on 7/8 and got Camby on 7/15. Laying low and waiting for golden opportunities to use your space is a great strategy – if you’re willing to roll your space over to the next summer.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Jul 14, 2010 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed

I think the tone of your post is that it seems like this is it, and if it is…“Meh.”

And I think that’s completely fair. It’s been a lackluster free-agency period thus far. I always laugh when I see teams (like the Wizards) stockpile ex-Clippers. Seems strange to me to go after guys from a pathetic lottery team. Yet that’s exactly what we did with Gomes and Foye.

Not that they aren’t good players and not that they won’t contribute, but they sure as heck don’t know how to win. They sure don’t help change the culture of the franchise, which is what the FO has talked about.

We’ll have to see what the rest of the summer looks like, but thus far it hasn’t been a great off-season. I’m still hoping they find a way to trade for Battier or Prince.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

We'll see

Great summary, and that’s exactly how it feels. Going in sequence, I think you jumped ahead to the three FAs and could have put a beat in there. Foye and Gomes seemed like nice, intriguing signings, as long as there was going to be a starting SF added to the mix. But then those guys, the ones who were picked off already, started going. And that was at the same time that the Clips signed Brian Cook, of all people.

Cook isn’t such a bad fit for a 12th or 13th man. It seems as if he’s able to get onto the floor better than Novak, and he’s a shooter who can spread the defense. I love Novak of course and think he’s a better player for the right coach in the right system, but there just never seemed to be any minutes or situations for him, even in a season when BGriffin was injured. So Cook is in that slot, the stretch 4 who doesn’t play much. Maybe he’ll play more than Novak did. Whatever.

Interesting point, that Gomes is good enough that Brewer doesn’t seem to make sense. But that doesn’t mean the Clips shouldn’t see if they can get him for a good price.

The main thing is that the Clips need a Camby deal, to find a guy who is good, in a pricey deal that has a couple of years on it. Prince is the obvious guy. Daye should be getting his minutes in Detroit. A deal for Prince and Hamilton would be impressive and turn them into a playoff team, but I’m not sure what the Clippers would want to give up, and the deals they’ve already made make it impossible. Instead of Hamilton, the Clips have Foye. Meh.

But there are probably some other candidates besides Prince. SP mentions that other teams have money and exceptions, so it’s not so easy.

But saying that that’s it, and nothing’s going to happen, is almost pathetic Reverse Mojo by SP. Sometimes when you have the card though, you just have to play it.

by citizen zhiv on Jul 14, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

I didn't want to say it

Mentioning the jinx cancels it.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

You've been doing enough lately

Trying hard in your own way, I know. Tough times for us all. I give SP credit: he didn’t hesitate here.

by citizen zhiv on Jul 14, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

re-sign

so does this mean there’s no chance we’re re-signing sool or the rhino?

by shimmywitbillycrs on Jul 14, 2010 12:30 AM PDT reply actions  

I'd like both, please!

14 players sounds fine to me and having 4 starters return plus a PF big to help with/against Griffin can’t hurt these youngsters at all.

by chrisd on Jul 14, 2010 12:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Re-sign

I’d say Sool is gone… you don’t need Sool and Gomes, two borderline starters, in my opinion. Smith still seems like a distinct possibility, with or without Sofo. Many if not most teams carry an extra big.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Jul 14, 2010 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

Skinner too in that case...

That would just leave 1 or 2 more spots…

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

Sool is a 2-3 tweener who could fill in

while Aminu gets his game together, or in case someone gets injured. We really ought to sign him (or someone comparable) right away, but I don’t think we will.

Instead, I predict that Aminu will demonstrate over the course of summer that he needs more time, and the Clips will eventually succumb with a much lesser pick-up at the wing.

Even if Aminu proves me wrong, I still don’t see why we are resisting redundancies at the wing, especially with all that cap space. Are we supposed to go into the season with only one experienced SF?

Actually, I’m growing convinced why we’re reluctant: DTS prioritizes profit at the exclusion of all else. I’m largely interested in witnessing my team’s evolution into a winner. But if that’s simply not the mission, wow, then I don’t have good reason to be here. One shouldn’t stay with an abusive spouse.

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Jul 14, 2010 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

I would love to have Rhino back...

Do you see this happening Steve?

"I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it." – Donald Sterling

by Dow Jones on Jul 14, 2010 3:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

I've been PATIENCE since 1983 for a summer like this....

but to only be let down by waiting and waiting season after season. This was suppose to be our biggest summer ever! One thing I love about CLIPPER NATION is that we stand above every outcome knowing that there is a little hope with a little faith to succeed. But every summer has been the same and I sure hope this is the summer for change. Not just for DIEHARD Clipper fans but to prove other organization, sports write, etc wrong.

by LAClippers1983 on Jul 14, 2010 1:06 AM PDT via mobile reply actions  

My goodness, you have endured some PAIN!

"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.

by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Jul 14, 2010 1:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

83? That's nothing.

For those of us a little farther south the relationship started in ’78, and the heartbreak a year later, when we signed our LeBron. Bill Walton was a hometown boy, the best center in the league, and just 2 years removed from leading Portland to an NBA title. Of course, his foot was no match for the curse…

by boltsfan21 on Jul 14, 2010 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

olshey better have a impact player up his sleeve

because man, if we go into this offseason with one major hole and came out with ryan games? after a bargain like jchill was snatched up? absolutely ridiculous.

the draft was great but cmon, ryan gomes? a fine backup, but a starter?

by shap on Jul 14, 2010 1:19 AM PDT reply actions  

i still have hope. Im not digging sofo and i'de prefer smith to come back.

I like smith alot and sofo still to me is the big no-no

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 1:24 AM PDT reply actions  

"Leaving the team a whole lot of money to... to... well, to put in Donald Sterling's pocket, I guess."

BINGO!

This is why I think nobody should renew their season tickets. If the Don doesn’t want to spend, then why should any of us?

"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.

by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Jul 14, 2010 1:25 AM PDT reply actions  

yea plus threw clipsxchange, tickets from season ticket holders are SUPER DIRT cheap. :)

Last year, i payed 4.50 for a monday game against the mavericks. 4.50!!!!!!!!!!!!! You cannot get a better deal than that…..unless there free…..lol

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 1:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

Wow.. Yeah that is cheap.. LOL

"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.

by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Jul 14, 2010 1:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

One of the BETTER perks of being a clipper fan. :)

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 1:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'd rather pay more and have them winning! It'd be nice for a change.. lol

"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.

by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Jul 14, 2010 3:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

WeRD uP!

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 7:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

somewhere in the 300's. i think like 331

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

yeah see...

almost not even worth going if you’re sitting up there…its terrible

"I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it." – Donald Sterling

by Dow Jones on Jul 14, 2010 4:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

Were you up in the 300 section?

Its horrible up there, you are looking down on the jumbotron for heaven’s sake….me and my buddy already re-upped for a half-season ticket package – 21 games.

I’m not excited about this offseason, but I gotta be there to give my Clips some love

"I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it." – Donald Sterling

by Dow Jones on Jul 14, 2010 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe I don't agree with everything in Steve's article then.........

Whilst Jefferson is younger and been playing out of position in Minny, I’d take Boozer over him.

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Jul 14, 2010 2:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

Perhaps

but they were tired of Boozers act. He has proven himself NOT to be a character guy. So I think they are glad he is gone. Addition by subtraction.

I guarantee you that Jefferson’s numbers will be amazing by virtue of playing with DWill. Utah did a great job of getting back on the horse. They will likely miss Korver more than Boozer.

Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)

by mikey p on Jul 14, 2010 9:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

I thnk he is....

My opinion of course. The big question will be on Al fits into Sloan’s offense. Many (most?) players who spend some time in Utah outperform there career averages. But it has to be the right kind of player.

Pre-injury Al Jefferson was a complete monster. If they got that guy, it’s an upgrade.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Jul 14, 2010 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

agree, if healthy he's a big upgrade

great post player now on perennial playoff team? will help them immensely against the Lakers…

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

True but I didn’t see the same dynamic player post injury

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Jul 14, 2010 11:12 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

Larry Sanders...

Shouldve picked him for our SF….this dude is incredible I only saw him play one game but hes a great defensive player and can hit the three and other shots…
Incredible motor unlike Aminu

by JJClipperfan on Jul 14, 2010 2:24 AM PDT reply actions  

Patterson or Hayward

Those two are gonna be All Stars.
Aminu? Is Darius Miles 2.0

Donald Sterling is the Worse Owner of All Time

by DonaldSterlingSucks on Jul 14, 2010 2:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Nah, he's not that bad. Remember, he's still 19-20. At least were not dealing with a struggling 26 year old al thorton.

Things still looking up in my opinion.

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 2:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

that's a quick conclusion

on a player with one summer league game and zero nba games.

by XXDC2XX on Jul 14, 2010 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

no...

hes strong and fast enough to play both positions

by JJClipperfan on Jul 14, 2010 2:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

As you suggest you're "being too hasty".

As you suggest you’re “being too hasty”. Just like the other night after the first Summer League Game when you all immediately wrote off the season and all the players on the floor for the Clippers. FYI season starts in November. No need to overpay for over the hill players to make you last in the Clippers corner past July 12th. A lot will go on for most teams between now November. Only 13 players? That leaves room for veterans without dropping hot prospects. I’m not convinced Gomes is the starter or for long. Sterling? I’ll agree with most of the worst things you could say but…Olshey very smart guy. Figure him for most of the good moves and good picks of the Dunleavy era, MD Sr was a horrible GM – egoed out as both GM & Coach. You all don’t like Vinnie, OK but he actually did well at Chicago, players liked and were loyal to him. Much more then can be said for Dunleavy. It’s too early for you to nickname the rookies or the season. We’ve got a long way to go.

BTW The villain of the Elton Brand departure wasn’t Falk it was Dunleavy. FYI everybody in the front office knew Brand was going to leave didn’t want to play for Dunleavy. Only one who didn’t believe it was Dunleavy. Then because his ego said he’d work him and get him to stay he went behind Brand’s agent’s back (A major crime in Hollywood much less the NBA) and thought he’d even convinced Elton to take less money (Mike’s
a genius/idiot) then after giving Dunleavy enough rope Falk ordered Elton to literally leave town and accessibility to MD Sr. This story was confirmed to me directly by a now former NBA senior exec.

by Plus15 on Jul 14, 2010 3:43 AM PDT reply actions  

The benefit of the doubt has to go to Olshey at the moment

as he had a good draft I think (you cannot judge Aminu after 1 summer league game – that IS ridiculous). He addressed the major two holes we had with good prospects.

However, people aren’t just throwing wild money around for some of the mid level guys. Guys like Hinrich, Childress could have been got without breaking the bank or giving much back. They aren’t over the hill players at all.

Why go for a backup SF in Gomes when we have just drafted Aminu, who can play backup minutes behind a legit SF starter?

As for VDN. I actually like him. I like the fact he’s got some bottle taking on Paxon in Chicago. I think the young players loved him over in Chicago such as Noah, Gibson, Rose. Look how he brought Gibson in instead of Tyrus Thomas and gave him an extended run and they have unearthed a little gem. Yep, he made some embarrassing mistakes (e.g. running out of timeouts) but he was a rookie coach. Never been an assistant before either. He took the team to the playoffs twice and had to play Celtics (and look how good that series was) and the Cavs. Tough pickings. I think he’ll do well here.

As for the Brand thing. Let it go. Personally, I don’t believe that. Faulk and FElton will always be the villians in my eyes.

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Jul 14, 2010 3:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

Paxon and VDN
I like the fact he’s got some bottle taking on Paxon in Chicago.

I thought that it was Paxon who went after VDN. Can’t think of anything more humiliating than, your boss fires you then follows you out to the parking lot to kick your @$$. That just says loser to me, like something that would happen to Charlie Brown. I know it didn’t happen just that way, but still.

by TheCasualFan on Jul 14, 2010 7:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

What exactly are you going on about here?

It didn’t happen that way so what are you talking about. He didn’t get fired during this incident. It was a falling out over Noah’s playing time.

Yes, Paxson was the agressor (from all reports) but Vinny stayed cool and didn’t retaliate. He used him some extra mins to try and get wins to secure a playoff spot. I like that in a coach. He wants to win. Maybe to save his job but he wants to win nonetheless.

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Jul 14, 2010 7:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

Vinny stayed cool and didn’t retaliate.

I never heard the expression, “showed some bottle”; I guess that’s what it means.

by TheCasualFan on Jul 14, 2010 7:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah...

I don’t really get your “assessment” about VDN being a loser.

However I did laugh about the fact that something like that probably would happen to an adult version of Charlie Brown. He gets fired from his middle management job and gets beat up by his boss on the way out…LOL

"I want someone who will, you know, let me put it in or who [will] suck on it." – Donald Sterling

by Dow Jones on Jul 14, 2010 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

lol

"Put the icing on the cake ladies and gentlemen" - Ralph Lawler vs. The Grizzlies

by In GrIfFin We TrUsT on Jul 14, 2010 7:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

i knew it was missing something

Seriously, it would help to get more access to the FO or for them to communicate more with us. I may be able to help Steve if you are intetested.

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 8:06 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

"Falk ordered Brand"

I forget, who works for who? This is the part of the story I never understood. If MDsr had Brand agreeing to a deal in principal, agent or not, major crime or not, then seems like you put him in the genius category. Everyone knew he was leaving, but for a lack of backbone to stand up to his agent, he was going to stay? MDsr almost pulled off a major coup when everyone else had given up.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Jul 14, 2010 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh noes

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Disagree

You have to retain your franchise players. If you can’t do that, you shoulnd’t be the GM (de facto or real).

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

And actually just about everyone thought he was staying

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

Wasn't talking to you

Was talking to Plus15.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Jul 14, 2010 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ah, sorry

I won’t bother you again.

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ronnie Brewer

He can’t shoot a lick and all his bball IQ would be negated by VDN.

by supac on Jul 14, 2010 6:14 AM PDT reply actions  

Biggest offseason in franchise history?

Only if you thought the team was actually going to sign Lebron or Wade. Otherwise almost everybody on this board acknowledged the rest were not max guys so its not huge loss missing on them. Sure, they missed out on JChill but signing him wouldn’t be even close to signing Baron in 2008, so I think one would still consider this summer a let down if you were expected the biggest offseason ever.

I don’t hate any of the moves, I would have liked Childress but missing out on him doesn’t have me too worked up. Teams can get killed making bad moves, moves that can hurt for 5 or 6 years. The Clippers star player hasn’t even played a game yet, so again it might not be a bad idea to take this cap space and hold onto it until you can formulate a plan as to how to best complement Griffin. Spending for the sake of spending will make you feel good for a week, then crappy for the 5 years you are waiting out Joe Johnson’s contract.

by Michael White on Jul 14, 2010 7:44 AM PDT reply actions  

Yes and no

“Spending” doesn’t necessarily mean spending badly. Josh Childress for around the MLE is a far better deal than Joe Johnson at the max. It’s a deal I would have liked to see the Clippers TRY and make.
The Clippers are in a funny situation… their reputation is that the owner is cheap and the franchise is poorly run. You want to prove you’re not? Make solid front office hires and spend your cap space… again, that doesn’t mean you have to spend it badly.
In the case of Childress, a certain amount of transparency in the FO would help. The Clippers desire for secrecy and their sensitivity to criticism exacerbates an already bad situation. If you look like you’re doing nothing… then we assume you’re doing nothing. I understand the need for stealth… but the Clips front office seems rather obsessed with it… and right now, it doesn’t serve them well.

by swamigusto on Jul 14, 2010 8:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Perhaps

They are taking things slow in part because they really don’t know what they have. Their supposed best player, BG, hasn’t yet played an NBA game. Maybe it’s prudent to see how the team plays in game situations before committing more money.

Having said that, I would think that they could get a feel for the team from practice. Of course, they need a coach and offensive sets to judge, and they’ve had one for only about two weeks now. If they had hired the coach earlier, would that have helped? Don’t know the answer.

These are all questions that I’d like to posit to the FO and VDN though. I saw the Foster questioning of VDN in another thread and it didn’t appear that VDN was asked those kinds of questions. So maybe the FO is more open then we suspect but the questions just aren’t being asked.

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

I very much agree

The Clips’ cheap image hurts their chances with free agents, which ultimately hurts their chances of winning. Assuming that winning is a major goal, the FO needs to demonstrate a willingness to spend. Don’t spend it badly, of course. But by all means spend it, even if it means taking on spare parts at some extra cost. I really don’t see how a $35/5 contract for JChill could have hurt us too badly… And man it would have helped both team morale and public image. I’m speculating a bit here, but we certainly would have had a deep team with demonstrable FO and ownership support, and all with cap space to spare.

The Clips’ reluctance to take on spare parts- to pay a little extra for quality roster redundancies- is really weighing on me now. I hope the FO comes through eventually. The fans shouldn’t be left to scheme about winning by themselves.

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Jul 14, 2010 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

People are getting carried away with missing out on JChill. I wanted him to, but holding him up as the difference between successfull offseason and poor offseason is rediculous. His value would have been on the court and not the public image which would be forgotten within 2 days of the signing. Was the public image bump from signing Baron Davis lasting? After all, he was the premier free agent that offseason. All that matters is what happened on the court and the team still sucks and therefore the team is still a laughingstock. Swami is at least being fair and saying that the lack of transparency is a reason for concern, while you seem to be saying that the Clippers didn’t try to sign Childress. We of course don’t know if that’s the case.

The Clippers cheap image doesnt’ hurt their chances with free agents, the Clippers being bad at basketball does. Worry about being good, not about good PR coming from signings.

by Michael White on Jul 14, 2010 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agree generally

But, the Clips cheap image DEFINITELY hurts their chances with free agents. That’s a no brainer. The Clips have one of the worst images in pro sports. More free agents would definitely consider the Clips if they believed that the owner was committed to winning.

But obviously in the end, winning is the cure-all. I agree with you 100% there.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

"It's the Clips"

I’m not fixated on JChill. I don’t know what sort of effort the Clips put in to signing him (which is part of the problem), but we all can see that we’re still sitting on tons of cap room while quite a few decent players have been swept up. Either we’re not trying hard enough (priority problem), or we are trying but players aren’t choosing us (image problem). My response to both those possibilities is, “get off your asses and do everything you can to sign another decent guy or two.”

Of course, if we go overboard and spend enormously, then that could cripple us for years. So I was using the $35M/5 JChill contract as an example of something that couldn’t have hurt us too badly, yet it surely would have been a positive shot in the arm. A similar or at least pro-active signing before the season starts would naturally help us on the court, AND it would send a positive signal. True, the public at large will forget about it soon enough, but not so much the sports writers or players on other teams. Our PR department might use the signing as another example of DTS’s seriousness of mind. But most of all, our own players will get the message, “We’re on a team that’s well financed and has its head on straight.”

Suppose instead that we don’t make a new signing before the season starts. Sooner or later, someone is bound to get injured. If that happens to be Gomes, then suddenly we have Aminu starting with some scrub backing him up. What kind of signal does that send? Man, we have all this extra cap space and still no one to play the 3. I can see Baron and others muttering, “F%&^ this.”

Winning will of course cure any and all lingering image problems. But the cause-effect relationship also goes in reverse to a significant extent: Our image problem hurts our chances winning.

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Jul 14, 2010 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

Two things

- I think the problem with complaining about the JChill contract is that we have no idea how much it would have cost him to be a Clipper instead of a Rocket. The Rockets have a great rep around the league as a committed franchise with a super smart GM and a championship history. The Clips are the exact opposite. How much would it have cost to get JChill to agree to come here instead? $10 mil more? $15? If the Clips signed him to a $50m/5 yr contract, would we be happy?

- Great point about Baron though. I don’t think anyone is paying enough attention to how vital Baron is to the success of this team next season, and how important it is to get him at least one player who Baron respects. If Baron is unmotivated, this team is done for by December. Guaranteed. As much as I like Bledsoe, they’re not turning the team over to him, and we’ve all seen how bad Baron can be if he feels like there’s no hope. It would be nice to get a vet in here who Baron respects and wants to play with to keep him motivated. Right now, it’s Baron, Kaman and a bunch of kids. That’s just not going to cut it.

For the record, JChill isn’t that guy either. Which is why I supported a trade for Iggy, and why I think trading for a guy like Prince would be great for the team. Prince or Battier…I’d love to see them find a way to make that work.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Um...edit the 1st point

No idea why I thought he was a Rocket. Anyway, ignore all that.

The Suns have Steve Nash…done.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Good point that JChill isn't the respected vet (yet)

I like C’s Up’s point (below) that with our cap space we might trade Gomes for an upgrade later on in the season. I’m a little worried that we will have folded by then, but perhaps not. Still, we don’t have forever to make something of ourselves while Baron’s with us, so I’d prefer to make a bold move before the season starts.

Gomes sounds like a fairly nice piece who fits our needs in a few different ways. I’m curious to see how it plays out, esp if the guy has decent range. But I’m also kind of wondering if we walled out better players by signing him.

More generally, I’m worried that the FO believes they can build some kind of ultra-light DC10. Can we fly high with so few extra parts? I really doubt it.

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Jul 14, 2010 3:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed

I agree with all of that. They can’t count on making some move at the deadline. Historically, the Clips have been out of it by then. Sure they probably think that won’t be the case with this group, but youth can’t be relied on to play consistently, and this team has way too much youth to rely on.

Plus, our vets are notorious for inconsistent play as well. It’s not like Baron and Kaman are rock solid 20/10 guys night in and night out.

This team has a lot of holes and I don’t love how it’s built for next season. Two inconsistent vets and the all 21 and under team. That’s a recipe for a sub-.500 team.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Shoot for the moon

The clippers should take a 1 year flyer on T Mac what do they have to close if he stays healthy they have a great player a former all star, he should be open to joining a young athletic team that if they win it would increase his value & he would not be counted on to play major minutes.

by Willie Reise on Jul 14, 2010 8:12 AM PDT reply actions  

Craig Smith just posted on twitter:

“Nets fans thank u so much I would love to so we will see what happen.”

Are you effing kidding me? Hopefully he got way overpaid so I can feel less crappy about losing our Laker-killer, the rare bright spot last year.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 8:21 AM PDT via mobile reply actions  

I don't think that sounds like anything.

He’s gonna play in the NBA next year, I don’t think anyone doubts that.

by swamigusto on Jul 14, 2010 8:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Hmm, maybe I'm missing something

Why’s he thanking the Nets fans though? And saying “I would love to”?

I’m confused as to why you thought I was saying he wouldn’t play in the NBA next year…

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 9:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

You said, "Hopefully he got way overpaid..."

As though he had signed with the Nets. As for the rest of my remark, I’m agreeing with you… Clips should sign him and sign him now, not wait for someone else to grab him.

by swamigusto on Jul 14, 2010 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

But the Nets are in the NBA...

I was guessing he had possibly received an offer from the Nets.

Yeah, I would way rather have the known commodity in CS than take yet another risk in Sofo. Too many variables to even hope for a real season.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

realisa has another tweet...

saying Smith probably not going to Nets. Whatever.

by swamigusto on Jul 14, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

<3 realisa

She’s usually right. Phew.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

Does the lack of spending have anything to do with the lockout?

Do owners just want to sit on the cap space and pocket the money now before the lockout potentially happens?

Pardon me, but I don’t know much about lockouts (except the baseball one when I was a kid was when I stopped watching baseball for good).

by Newtybar on Jul 14, 2010 9:05 AM PDT reply actions  

That's a good point.

If (and according to some, when) the lockout happens, Sterling would be hating it if he were paying players that weren’t actually playing.

Bingo! Oh me oh my!

by ClippersUK on Jul 14, 2010 9:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

no one gets paid during the lockout time...

I think you may be referring to the new CBA agreement which will try and reduce player salaries in favor of owners…a dollar in the near future will be worth more than a dollar today. It makes sense from an ownership viewpoint to not have long term commitments under the current rules…hopefully DTS hasn’t figured that one out yet.

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

Possible

Also possible is the cap comes down and caps out the space the Clippers saved.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but the cap going down affects all teams...hence, the Clips would still relatively be in a better position

I’m not necessarily espousing the idea of not spending – but I wonder if there is a strong incentive (with the Clippers or other teams) to refrain from long term deals until they know what the new CBA will be

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 9:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's been on my mind from the start :(

This may not be the best time not to spend. Everyone keeps using the “seller’s market” rationale, but that’s not really taking into consideration the probable lockout.

In previous lockouts, did we even make it to the trade deadline? Presumably that’d be where our cap could become really valuable.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 9:42 AM PDT up reply actions  

It doesn't even have to be a lockout

The rules will change with the new CBA in ways that cannot be completely predicted, even by those closest to the dealings. There will be intended consequences and unintended consequences.

But great assets are always great assets.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Hope remains...

Hopefully we can still use our cap at the trade deadline as a 3rd party to help some desperate teams try to shore up their bench’s with veterans, in some vain hope to beat the Lakers and Miami. If we’re not going to be contenders this year, we might as well take advantage of that fact. Though, I’m not experienced enough with trade-deadline-trades to have any inclination of how this could play out.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Great assets are always great assets.

Okay, so who exactly are you advocated the Clippers target?

by Michael White on Jul 14, 2010 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

Now?

Pfft, you got me. There are no obvious targets. Sessions would still be a good pickup if they can move Baron for space, but I wouldn’t even know where to start with that space. Have to look hard at it.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions  

What about Sergio Rodriguez?

Is he even interested in staying here?

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

I can't imagine any of the euro players would want to play overseas this year.

By the time they came back, they wouldn’t get anything like what they could get in this inflated, pre-CBA market.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

Sorry meant Rudy Fernandez who John R had mentioned

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Jul 14, 2010 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

I like Rudy and he hates Portland. But he hates Portland because he’s the backup SG to Roy. Gordon is a much more complete player so I assume Rudy would be a backup here too so I’m not sure that would work out for him as opposed to returning to Europe.

by Michael White on Jul 14, 2010 10:28 AM PDT up reply actions  

Trade targets, who is capped or taxed that wants to change that?

$58M and $70M

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 9:47 AM PDT reply actions  

you interested in VC or Rashard?

I’d think Magic would be happy to get a trade exception for either of them…Rashard’s is non-guaranteed in two seasons. So, is god-awful contract would only be for this season and next. His production fell off a cliff last season (why?)…but he can be a stretch four or slide to three.

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 10:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

They don't have the space for either guy anyway

Have to find players <= like 9.5M probably.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

I see, just looking at open cap space situations...

That’ll be tough – package deals would make trades for bigger contracts feasible…but I can’t really think of anyone I’d want to unload off this current roster unless it was a star-quality player coming back.

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

You have reached the core of the matter

Any trade of Baron and Kaman probably looks more like treading water than improving since those are productive guys.

Coaches don't matter. - Bill Simmons, The Book of Basketball

by John R on Jul 14, 2010 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

What's Cleveland going to do post-Lebron?

Are they going to try and build off Mo/Antawn? Or are they going to blow it up and start afresh? Varejao and Mo could fit salary-wise…but are they worth a future 1st round?

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

Tayshaun Prince would be the guy

but the Pistons would surely insist that Hamilton go with him. By the way, I would be totally open to something like that, but it would require parting with Kaman, which I’m not willing to do. And I don’t think Detroit wants Baron.

Turkoglu would have been an ok option. It’s not a great contract, but it expires in time for the Clippers to extend Griffin. Why not give him a solid SF who can shoot it during his first three years?

If it were Hedo vs. unused cap space, why didn’t they look into it?

Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)

by mikey p on Jul 14, 2010 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

Toronto got Barbosa for Hedo

A player Colangelo loves from his Phoenix days and who is better than anyone we could’ve given up without opening an even worse hole at the 1 or the 5. It wasn’t a straight salary dump, and we don’t have any assets we can afford to give up except cap space.

by boltsfan21 on Jul 14, 2010 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

True

Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)

by mikey p on Jul 14, 2010 12:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

Orlando was always too deep of a team.

Wouldn’t mind taking Brandon Bass or JJ Redick off Orlando’s hands, but I want to stay away from VC and Lewis.

by Erik O on Jul 14, 2010 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

I have a feeling Gomes will be traded

in the addition of a starting SF. I think he will be traded in acquiring a SF and then Aminu will be the backup 3. It’d be a waste for AFA to be a 3rd stringer, and Gomes would be good trade bait for a team trying to add depth at the wing position. Maybe a sign and trade for Jefferson in San Antonio…

by baronycamby on Jul 14, 2010 11:30 AM PDT reply actions  

This doesn't make sense

Why would the Clippers sign Gomes to trade him a few days later (which is against the rules) for another 3. Why wouldn’t they just sign that other 3 (Tmac/Howard) straight up.

by C's Up on Jul 14, 2010 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

Thats what im saying

I think the Clippers are finished making moves this offseason. I think they might use their capspace at the trade deadline to swing Gomes for an Iggy or Prince, If it looks like one more piece can push us into the playoffs

by C's Up on Jul 14, 2010 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

exactly right - which is why I've been confused about why there has been so much chatter about other SF signings this past week or since the Gomes signing

the team could use some big bodies…or pursue some trades. I think there are enough of guards (core of Baron, Gordon, Foye and Bledsoe is promising)…

Baron, Foye and Bledsoe should hopefully be enough for PG duties.
Gordon, Foye, Bledsoe, Warren, Gomes? at SG.
Gomes and Aminu at SF.
Griffin, Cook, Gomes?, Aminu? Sofo? at PF
Kaman, DJ, Griffin? Cook? Sofo? at C

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Looks like a solid team that's a starting SF away from the playoffs

Could use a backup PF in case that Griffin guy gets hurt again. Only one knee injury away from Cook and Gomes as the starting forwards. Yikes!

Seems like a proactive FO would have done something about that.

by ClipCat on Jul 14, 2010 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

Good points

Especially given Blake’s injury last year, it would seem like a no-brainer to put a veteran PF behind him so Blake doesn’t have to play too many minutes right off the bat. I mean, he’s essentially still a rookie.

That lineup btw is not a starting SF away from the playoffs unless that starting SF is Lebron James. The core is good, but also really young, and the backups are average at best.

This team should be better than last year, but if it takes 50 wins to make the playoffs again, this team has no shot.

by madglove on Jul 14, 2010 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

Guess I was just a little more optimistic

Which just makes the inevitable fall harder. But I believed that adding a Childress or Miller to the team would put the Clips in the mix with the top 10 teams in the West. That’s a tightly grouped bunch, and injuries probably would have broken some ties. So I certainly agree that nothing was guaranteed, and the ole Clipper injury curse could have ruined the team’s chances.

But the Clips would have fielded a very solid starting lineup with no major weaknesses and at least a decent bench with a lot of flexibility to move players around. Unfortunately we’ll probably never know what could have been.

by ClipCat on Jul 14, 2010 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

yeah, we definitely need a big behind Griffin, unless you feel comfortable with some combination of Sofo/Gomes/Aminu/Cook plugging in there

I think we actually need one more center…if Kaman gets injured, DJ would need a backup. Cook should not be used for more than 10 min/game if that.

The only alternative in that scenario is to play small ball with Griffin at C. So yeah, we definitely need one more big…

by banandy on Jul 14, 2010 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

It will be a BSkinnz type who will be signed at the minimum to backup at C.

A legitimate backup PF needs to be brought in too.

by Michael White on Jul 14, 2010 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Good point about swinging Gomes for an upgrade later on

That’s one argument for keeping a chunk of the cap space. If that happens, it’s a good call.

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Jul 14, 2010 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

"Meh" is not necessarily a bad thing...

Especially as I watch other teams make horrendous moves this offseason. Besides possibly Childress and Korver, there was not an attainable piece that would have made sense. Would anyone really want Gay/Matthews/Outlaw/Tyrus Thomas at the awful contracts that they signed? And who knows, we still may get Brewer cheap.

by BtheKUTA on Jul 14, 2010 2:25 PM PDT reply actions  

For example

“Meh” is way better than paying Luke Ridnour and Darko a combined 36 mil.

by BtheKUTA on Jul 14, 2010 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Confusion

Brian Cook? America’s confusion continues….

by 3up3down on Jul 14, 2010 2:28 PM PDT reply actions  

Is it Ground Hog Day?

Once again my optimism has diminished and I’m kicking myself for renewing my tickets. Someone please tell me that Blake Griffin can live up to all the hype. I’ve got a sneaking suspicion, he will end up like every other high draft pick we had over the last 14 years. I really don’t see anything to get excited about Brian Cook, Ryan Gomes, Randy Foye as opposed to Steve Blake, Rasual Butler, Craig Smith, Travis Outlaw and the 09/10 team sucked.
Someone please tell me that Blake Griffin can live up to all the hype.

By the way I was hoping we would make Tracy McGrady an offer just to get some buzz and maybe a fan or two more in the seats. Could you imagine if your livelihood depended on selling tickets to this side show?

by YW8 on Jul 14, 2010 11:49 PM PDT reply actions  

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