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Clippers Signings - Analyzing the Deals - DeAndre Jordan

Well, it's been an interesting day. It's been an interesting few days for that matter, but today has been a nice resolution - at least to a couple of things.

The Los Angeles Clippers signed two players and walked away from a trade today. And while each of the decisions involves a fair amount of risk, you can't help but admire the bold determination of Neil Olshey and the Clippers' front office.

In case you missed it, the Clippers today:

I already went over the Billups deal. Now let's go over the Jordan deal.

Star-divide

On Sunday afternoon, Jordan signed an offer sheet with the Golden State Warriors for four years and about $43M. Essentially, the deal starts at $10M per season and includes the 4.5% raises a team is allowed to offer external free agents. The Clippers had already put a contract offer of 5 years and $40M on the table for Jordan, so matching the Dubs offer only involved an extra $3M total - but, the annual amount is an increase of over $2M per season on average - and those kinds of numbers add up fast when you start getting close to the luxury tax.

Is DeAndre worth $10M plus per season? I was asked this question by Nate Parham of Golden State of Mind the other day, and you can go look at my answers over there if you like. The short answer is no, but that doesn't mean that the Clippers were wrong to pay him that. As Eric Pincus tweeted today, if the Clippers are overpaying Jordan by $10M over the course of the next four years, you can think of it as an investment in the franchise as a whole.

There are at least three reasons to retain DeAndre Jordan at this time that go beyond his measurable value on the basketball court. They are, in no particular order:

  1. Because he's close friends with franchise cornerstone Blake Griffin. I don't want to overemphasize this - you don't necessarily want to coddle the star, nor should the Clippers rush out and sign Blake's brother Taylor. But signing Jordan sends a message to Griffin that the franchise is willing to spend money, and if it also improves BG's work environment so much the better.
  2. To send a message that these are not the same old cheap Clippers. I'd say that message has probably been delivered more forcefully in the last four days than in all the Brand/Maggette matching, Mobley signing, Kaman extending, Baron signing transactions of the past decade combined. The idea has been a bit outdated for a while, but the greater NBA-verse can't help but have noticed after the Clippers spent $18M on Caron Butler and DeAndre Jordan while simultaneously making a serious play for Chris Paul. On the other hand, if that $18M turns out to be a massive overpayment for these players, it only re-enforces the perception of the Clippers as being incompetent. But dispelling the cheap perception is easier to control, and still worthwhile.
  3. As a message to Chris Paul. This is decidedly less important now, but then again the Paul deal may already have been resurrected, and will always be a possibility the Clippers should prepare as long as he's in New Orleans. Paul is rumored to see a young Tyson Chandler in Jordan and supposedly covets him as a teammate. (By the way, I ran into Mike Smith in Playa Vista today, and he was able to verify the CP3-Jordan story I relayed yesterday. Two seasons ago, during pre-game warmups, as DeAndre was soaring through his pre-game dunk show, Paul took notice. He turned to someone next to him and Smith heard CP3 say "Why don't we have a guy like that?", or words to that effect.)

So for now, the Jordan signing is all great. Of course, it's not my money. Furthermore, the Clippers still have Eric Gordon and Blake Griffin on rookie contracts. When it comes time to pay the two cornerstones big boy money, will the Clippers be willing to possibly take a luxury tax hit? The way the roster stands today, the team can pay Gordon and Griffin without going above the threshold - but if indeed they were to sign Paul (or any other big name of course) they would most certainly go where no Donald Sterling has gone before. Will that prospect keep the team from pursuing big opportunities that come their way? Will it (FSM forfend) cause them to lose Gordon? It's not year one of Jordan's contract that presents a problem - it's years two through four. So we'll just have to wait and see.

I'm going to close with a question: I cannot think of another NBA player who got a larger salary increase from one season to the next since the 1999 CBA that established the rookie scale and player maximums. (Kevin Garnett and Michael Jordan got some crazy paydays before that.) It would have to be a second round pick, or possibly a late first rounder. Gilbert Arenas got a bigger percentage increase: from about half a million to $8.5M in 2003. But Jordan's raise of over $9M (from about $1M to over $10M) has got to be one of the richest in recent NBA history - it's even bigger than Juwan Howard's ridiculous contract in 1996. Does anybody know of any other contenders for the title of biggest raise? Even if there might be bigger raises out there in terms of raw dollar amount, I feel rather certain that DeAndre Jordan is the first player in NBA history to got from a six figure salary to an eight figure salary overnight.

Congrats DJ. Now go and earn it.

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Who are these "Lakers" you speak of?

"Every existing thing is born without reason, prolongs itself out of weakness, and dies by chance" -Jean-Paul Sarte

by Jayq on Dec 12, 2011 8:50 PM PST up reply actions  

I feel like we should be at this point

If we land Chris Paul, we’ll be (arguably) the best in the West.

by Ricekrispy10 on Dec 12, 2011 9:01 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm a little pissy about this contract

Hope DJ explodes this season (more than he did last)

"Every existing thing is born without reason, prolongs itself out of weakness, and dies by chance" -Jean-Paul Sarte

by Jayq on Dec 12, 2011 8:49 PM PST reply actions  

He improved about 200% last year... you're asking a lot.

Most people, I was one, thought he wasn’t much and would probably be gone by now. I was wrong, but improve more? Look at his stats.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 8:54 PM PST up reply actions  

i could see him getting to 8pts, 10 boards, 2.5 blocks a game this year.

but he has no low post offensive skills, which will limit his scoring. Not that Gordon, Butler, Griffin, etc. need help.

by LJ Hann on Dec 12, 2011 8:57 PM PST up reply actions  

well, this depends. last year, in 32 minutes, he averaged 7 and 7.

i would be sincerely pleased with his development if he can get to 8 and 10 in the same minutes (so maybe 9 and 12 in what you propose)

by LJ Hann on Dec 12, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Sorry to rain on the parade...

He HAS TO improve free throws. Other than that just some normal young player progression anywhere near the jump he made last year and we are golden!

by bdpjumbi on Dec 12, 2011 9:28 PM PST up reply actions  

Um

he averaged 7 and 7 in 26 mpg last year. He was a 10 and 10 guy per 36 last year.

Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.

by ClipperChuck on Dec 13, 2011 12:20 AM PST up reply actions  

Lucas?

When your mom is really mad at you does she scream “Lucas!”
BTW, you do a very good job.

"I gotta have more cowbell!"

by PV Mike on Dec 13, 2011 7:36 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm hoping for improvement...

But I don’t expect it to be as big as last year. If he got his free throw% to maybe 60 percent and got his minutes up (fewer fouls) to around 32 to 36, that’d be great.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 8:57 PM PST up reply actions  

I think the PG situation will have a positive impact on his scoring.

With Baron Davis being injured and Bledsoe being thrown in to the fire what we got out of BG and DeAndre was pretty amazing.

With Vet leadership in Billups and Caron Butler ability to spread the floor… It can only get better for the front court.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:02 PM PST up reply actions  

DJ and Improvement

DJ is never going to be a great scorer. But he can do some things well, and there are at least three areas where we can and should expect improvement, all of which will make him significantly more valuable (you mention most of them yourself).

1) Free throw shooting. If DJ can ever get to 75% here, it will make a world of difference. Players can do it – look at Karl Malone’s career FT pcts. He may never get to 75%, but he’s got to get better.

2) Fouls. He’s got to stay out of foul trouble and stay on the floor.

3) Post defense. DJ is a terror from the weak side, but he’s still a mediocre post defender. He can and should get better here.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:14 PM PST up reply actions  

Did you just call DJ a freak down below?

And I gotta say that I thought that the critique on DJ’s potential for offensive improvement in the GSOM piece was pretty harsh too. Something along the lines of no potential whatsoever. But then, you got a thing against lefties.

I was upset by Hollinger’s breakdown. He deigned to say that getting Billups was a nice move. Very big of him. Doesn’t like (slightly) overpaying DJ and providing continuity and a strong young complementary core. Doesn’t like signing Caron Butler, which fills a hole nicely, was best available by far, and timetable of deal accords with potential AFA improvement.

But the biggest factor is the relationship with Griffin, which is dynamic and symbiotic and hard to predict. Obviously BG provides all sorts of positives to DJ and his future potential and performance: he motivates him, makes him practice harder and play harder, and BG’s focus and intensity and presence (hey, so when are we going to over to work out?) give DJ an upside that he would never have otherwise. But DJ is giving something to Griffin too, which is harder to gauge. Griffin is funny and subtle and deadpan, and DJ seems like a guy who loves to laugh and have a good time. DJ’s amazing basic physical persona is something that Griffin can respect: there aren’t a lot of guys who can hang with Griffin in the gym. But there’s also the sidekick factor. Griffin is such a star and so special and charismatic, so humble and intense and competitive at the same time, he’s the kind of guy who needs a sidekick as well as a posse. Gordon is a fellow gunslinger, some one that BG wants to go into a fight with every game. DJ is the classic loping southpaw sidekick, not an assassin like Gordon, but still essential. A mentor and quarterback type like Billups is another key ingredient, but the Clips have a roster full of guys who will help Griffin do what he needs to do. DJ is near the top or at the top of that list.

And I wanted to mention his offensive potential, which SP snubbed. No, he’s never going to hit the perimeter jumper. But I believe that DJ can master a nice lefty hook if he works at it, and he can put together a decent post game. It’s going to take time. Think about how long it took Kaman to develop into what he is, and Kaman can shoot and do all sorts of things, but he still can’t finish around the basket like DJ. DJ’s range will never make it out to 15 ft, and I’m not sure what his shot would even look like. But he can become a much better player by extending his range out to 5 ft. And it will get there, I think, in time.

Somewhere it said that he had 17 touches on the block last year. He had that many in the first two summer league games, and he looked awful. But by the end of summer league he was starting to make some plays. And he’s going to keep working hard at it, working alongside Griffin for years to come now. He’s going to get better, even if SP thinks he’s a doofus freak.

by citizen zhiv on Dec 12, 2011 10:12 PM PST up reply actions  

Just kidding

What was kinda funny edgy last night seems a bit harsh in the morning. Long day for all of us Clipper fans, but especially our Fearless Leader. I know that SP wasn’t dumping on DJ.

Probably a pretty big day here at CN yesterday. Got me back in. Very happy to be here.

by citizen zhiv on Dec 13, 2011 6:11 AM PST up reply actions  

that was so cool

DR. J-ordan

wine um, dine um, 69 um

by flightofthegriffin on Dec 12, 2011 11:15 PM PST up reply actions  

LOL.. I loved that one!

"look, you can find any coach you want, bring him in here and run the situation. But I don't think they are going to do as good a job as I do." -Mike Dunleavy Sr.

by CLiPPz WeRD 12 on Dec 12, 2011 11:15 PM PST up reply actions  

yep

thats the one i always refer to. that there just shows the cats dexterity and freakish all around athletic ability. my eyes were opened with that move. there are too many details of intricacies that point to more beautiful canvass, but now is not the time to delve in to that. he needs a GOOD coach!

heeeyyy do not any of us and any details of DJ’s summer workout with The Dream?

Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin]getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -Steve Perrin

by Takebb909 on Dec 12, 2011 11:52 PM PST up reply actions  

OMG Thank you so much! I was looking all over the YouTubes for the same play but with Stu Lance’s reaction. I remember watching it live and laughing as he was mad about how Jordan scored.

by ILL Eagle on Dec 13, 2011 12:17 AM PST up reply actions  

Man, the Dubs screwed themselves...

Olshey kept saying he would match and the Warriors renounced a couple of guys and withdrew Reggie Williams QO making him a free agent! He’s gone and what has GS done… what CAN they do now? They messed up bad.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 9:01 PM PST up reply actions  

I think theres a huge backstory there that we dont know about....

I think we coordinated it well with Houston to make an offer to Marc Gasol while GSW was helplessly watching their back up plan vanish.

and the fans their looooved Reggie Williams.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:04 PM PST up reply actions  

Really? Conspiracy?

You think Olshey and Morey were sending love notes? No, that’s nuts. I don’t know what Morey’s up to down there but I don’t think he’s sharing with anybody.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 9:07 PM PST up reply actions  

I think they timed Marc Gasol's offer right....

They offered Gasol a contract the minute GSW offered Deandre.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:10 PM PST up reply actions  

I see...

And the ball’s in Memphis’ court and GSW can’t do anything about it… or wait… did Gasol sign that offer?

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 9:20 PM PST up reply actions  

They forced Memphis hand

I think they didn’t expected to land Gasol. But if they wanted a chance at it, this was the moment.

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 9:22 PM PST up reply actions  

From the French

To the right. Based on the well know fact that right handed people are graceful, and left handed people are clumsy. Sorry lefties. Ya freaks.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:49 PM PST up reply actions  

I almost spit out my coffee...

"Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted" – Albert Einstein

by Another son of Mike Smith on Dec 12, 2011 11:34 PM PST up reply actions  

If it was a conspiracy than

we can expect a Gomes, Foye for trade exception trade to come in the future as a thankyou

"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right"unknown

by bestclipfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:11 PM PST up reply actions  

A little off topic here but...

Why should the Clippers revive talks with NBA / NOH for CP3? The Clips roster is now deep and set with a good mix of young blood and experienced vets. Assuming that Billups report and is a happy Clipper, which I think he will be, this team is primed to go deep into the playoffs. Just look at the roster:

PG Billups / Williams / Bledsoe
SG Gordon / Foye / Leslie
SF Butler / Aminu / Gomes
PF Griffin / ?? / Thompkins
C Jordan / Kaman / Cook

That’s a roster I’d be comfortable with against ANY team. The team is deep with two players capable as 6th man of the year candidate in Mo and Kaman. Sign a backup PF to spell Griffin (Kris Humphries: Kim don’t love you, but Clips Nation will), and we’re set to make serious noise in the NBA. Why sacrifice the Minny pick now? Let’s hold on to it, see what other offers we get, or see where we will place when the ping pong balls drop. If we get a top 3 pick in 2012, we can either draft a stud and not worry about the luxury tax threshold when Griffin and Gordon are due for their raises, or trade it as a package to make compliment Griffin and Gordon.

by Rob Lo on Dec 12, 2011 9:01 PM PST reply actions  

Damn damn damn...

…to make compliment Griffin and Gordon. Proof read fail.

by Rob Lo on Dec 12, 2011 9:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Answer:

Chris Paul is awesome

by Michael White on Dec 12, 2011 9:03 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

He is

That he is… but he’s also leaving NOH this offseason. So why not sign him through FA?

by Rob Lo on Dec 12, 2011 9:04 PM PST up reply actions  

Because we can get him now

by Michael White on Dec 12, 2011 9:06 PM PST up reply actions  

I mean, we are (and I can’t believe this is actually a true comment) legitimately in title contention by adding Chris Paul. Adding Paul and keeping Gordon now seems more realistic. I part with the pick and don’t even think twice. If you have a chance for that, you take it.

by Michael White on Dec 12, 2011 9:09 PM PST up reply actions  

True...

I just feel that the Clips can attain either CP3 or Deron without having to part with any of their young talent and the Minny pick?

I guess I’m greedy. I want to have the cake and eat it too.. =/

by Rob Lo on Dec 12, 2011 9:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Oh, I’m greedy too. I don’t want to wait.

Plus, too much can go wrong. We KNOW we can Paul now (well, theoretically anyway), why wait and give him a chance to say no? He’s saying “yes” now.

by Michael White on Dec 12, 2011 9:12 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

high school logic seemed to apply perfectly well in this situation

Stern is the school bully everyone hates. He picked on the Laker kid, the Hornet kid, the Rocket kid, and the Clipper kid… so the other kids decided to ignore him. And now he’s reaching out because he realizes the error of his ways.

So I figure why not apply it with CP3’s impending free agency.

by Rob Lo on Dec 12, 2011 9:21 PM PST up reply actions  

And I’m REALLY happy with getting Billups

by Michael White on Dec 12, 2011 9:34 PM PST up reply actions  

Not a popular opinion but I have to admit...

With the looming change in the lux tax, sending out Gordon instead of the pick, might be the best long range play. I also think Olshey knows it.
The idea that Billups negates CP3 is hyper-dumb. Short season, too many games, teams with depth get to the playoffs. Then you go with your best players.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 9:38 PM PST up reply actions  

i was thinking that

of course that assumes the pick will be a succes.

by XXDC2XX on Dec 12, 2011 9:40 PM PST up reply actions  

It's true

I’ve been thinking this for a while now… but not saying it, frankly. I still think the Clippers have the leverage to include EITHER the MIN pick OR Gordon. But if NOH wanted Gordon, that’s a no brainer to tell you the truth.

Both? I’d do it if I believed they had a better offer than one or the other. But I don’t believe that.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:51 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

if we do end up trading Gordon

who do we start at shooting guard, Billups? Mo? Pleasedon’tsayFoye? If you say Butler does that mean it’s Gomes2.0?

Fire Jasen Powell!

by chrisd on Dec 12, 2011 9:59 PM PST up reply actions  

get Ariza back

slide Butler to shooting guard. Should work nicely.

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 11:45 PM PST up reply actions  

Amen and halleluja

I’d give up both if I had to, but I’m not sure we have to. Certainly wouldn’t hesitate to give one or the other.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 10:49 PM PST up reply actions  

why take the cake if you cant eat it?!

"Fresh out the airport/ Fresh out the chair with the clippers/ Like Sean Livin' thinking, hmm/ I'm trying to get it like Sean get it" - Wale "Beautiful Bliss"

by T_Silk on Dec 12, 2011 9:23 PM PST up reply actions  

Your right we Shouldn't.

But I think the Clippers are going in to it with wayyy more leverage and the league knows it. Some one tweeted that NBA front office realized the mistake they made by playing hard ball. I personally don’t like the fact that Chris Paul can only sign two years and he’s got bad Knees.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:07 PM PST up reply actions  

To hell with luxury tax

If Sterling loves basketball and would want a championship for the Clips, then by all means pay the luxury tax in the future! The Lakers paid for it to get championship rings.

by Jakespeed on Dec 12, 2011 9:02 PM PST reply actions  

Based Upon A League Wide Player Value Rating (PVR)

an advanced that I created several months ago based upon last season’s performance DJ was worth a hair under $8.5 million for last season.

by Buddahfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:08 PM PST reply actions  

Using the same PVR system Blake was worth about $15.5 million last season and EJ about about $8.5 million. Kaman about $1.25 million and Mo Williams about $1.7 million

by Buddahfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:14 PM PST up reply actions  

Yeah....

But I bet that shit didn’t factor in ones friendship with a superstar.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:15 PM PST up reply actions  

You Are Correct

But I expect DJ to get better and up his value from $8.5 million a season to over $12.5 million a season based upon the PVR system.

by Buddahfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Does anybody know when the Clippers can negotiate a new TV Contract?

That’s where the real money is at, and with CP3 and Blake Griffin, it might be lucrative enough that a luxury tax hit wouldn’t matter.

by dodgergabe26 on Dec 12, 2011 9:08 PM PST reply actions  

i was thinking of this very thing this morning...

Seeing how the Angels used some of their new TV money from Fox to get Albert Pujols and C.J. Wilson, maybe the Clips can re-negoiate a new deal…of course, it’ll be contingent on getting Paul and locking up Griffin. If the Clips have an opt-out in their FSN contract (like the Angels had), they have the leverage in that FS West/Prime Ticket are desperate in keeping their existing programming, because they’re losing the Lakers, Galaxy, and the Pac-12, and possibly later the Dodgers. It’s also possible that the (NHL) Kings might join the Lakers’ networks after their FSN deal is up; AEG owns them, the Galaxy, and 25% of the Lakers.

Stay tuned…

by Shawn H on Dec 12, 2011 11:23 PM PST via mobile up reply actions  

Michael Redd

According to Baskeball-reference.com Redd went from $3M to $12M one year. Second round pick like DJ
Whats so funny about DJ’s contract today was that none of the experts seemed to understand how the Clippers cap hold for him worked. Most of them were trying to figure out who the Clippers amnestied to sign Billups. Even Larry Coon had it wrong. Not often you see a second round pick go to $10M in his first contract

by Beasel on Dec 12, 2011 9:11 PM PST reply actions  

that was funny

Coon had it wrong. Hollinger was way wrong.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

steve

I would be much obliged if you would check your email
thanks

by LJ Hann on Dec 12, 2011 9:17 PM PST up reply actions  

got it

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:52 PM PST up reply actions  

Is that what it was? The caphold didn't go up because he was a second rounder?

No, it must have been because we’re used to capholds for 1st round picks which are much much higher. So arcane a detail, we’ll probably never see it happen again.

by John Raffo on Dec 12, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

It’s probably a loop-hole that they should close in the future.

by shay on Dec 12, 2011 9:30 PM PST up reply actions  

second rounder is part of it

Him being a second rounder is part of it – there are different rules for first round picks. But the biggest thing is that cap holds are rarely so much smaller than the actual contract. (Joel Anthony was an example last year.)

The specific confusion came on the offer sheet. The offer sheet becomes the cap hold for the team EXTENDING the offer. Coon (and I for that matter) thought it became the cap hold for both teams.

In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd

by Steve Perrin on Dec 12, 2011 9:55 PM PST up reply actions  

doesn't sound logical

so a team puts in an offer and hampers the other teams ability to do other deals until they can resolve the offer sheet?

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 11:49 PM PST up reply actions  

follow your logic

and teams would be able to throw multiple offers around just to tie up someone else’s cap?

Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.

by ganima on Dec 13, 2011 12:10 AM PST up reply actions  

No, only there own cap

Golden State used up $10Mil in cap space by making the offer to DJ. They didn’t get that space back until the Clippers matched the offer. The Clippers cap space was unaffected by the Warriors offer. I think this is the main reason the new CBA went from 7 days to 3 days to match. So the offering team isn’t restricted by having to wait for the offer to be matched.

by Beasel on Dec 13, 2011 5:46 AM PST up reply actions  

In the next few years if the Lakers decline (which is a strong possibility), Clippers will be the biggest show in the second biggest market, so why not dip into the luxury tax? I have no doubt that the team would still be profitable (probably more profitable). And also with Donald Sterling net worth in the billions now, what’s a few million to him.

by shay on Dec 12, 2011 9:11 PM PST reply actions  

well if the Lakers can land DH

then they stay relevant. But it will be bumpy ride, because DH seems to see them as one of a number of possible destinations and Orlando doesn’t seem to be as desperate as NO.

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 9:24 PM PST up reply actions  

just a thought

Clips can make a run at DH with Kaman + DJ + Aminu + Bledsoe + Minny pick + throw in Gomes as well. I think that’s a better deal for Orlando than what the Lakers can give them. One great way to make the Lakers irrelevant and the Clips relevant.

by Jakespeed on Dec 12, 2011 9:35 PM PST up reply actions  

Sounds like Orlando's FO

is delusional as to what they believe Dwight Howards intentions are. They think he’s gunna resign.

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:37 PM PST up reply actions  

Thought we can’t trade DJ

by shay on Dec 12, 2011 9:45 PM PST up reply actions  

Good.

Im over him. I want the NBA to get screwed on the deal

by Akram47 on Dec 12, 2011 9:34 PM PST reply actions  

Forget what I just said

Ken Berger has a new article up- no new information except for 2 tidbits.

1. Bledsoe might be the only new thing in the deal- we could safely get rid of him now that we have Billups. A PG rotation of Mo, Billups, Cp3 would unquestionably be the best of all time.

2. If we do somehow keep Mo in all this, he might get amnestied, but it could be someone else as well (Gomes?).

by NewCavsfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:40 PM PST reply actions  

Bledsoe

New in the deal, he wasn’t being offered in the first deal ??

by XXDC2XX on Dec 12, 2011 9:43 PM PST up reply actions  

He was the supposed "sticking point"

We were already giving up EJ, MInny, Kaman, Aminu, and they also wanted Bledsoe. At least that was the rumor.

by NewCavsfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:53 PM PST up reply actions  

This has been disproven

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Dec 12, 2011 10:03 PM PST up reply actions  

gomes would be better

but then we only have butler at SF. At least foye is a option to use sparingly at PG.

by indy818 on Dec 12, 2011 9:43 PM PST up reply actions  

in the new deal CBS & Ken Berger are saying

it’s both Eric’s, Gordon and Bledsoe. The report has it that because we have Billups we can now add Bledsoe, and that Gordon and Minny pick where always in it (same report as the ESPN one earlier). It’s listed in the fan shots, but here: http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/33847714
can u say NO DEAL!

Fire Jasen Powell!

by chrisd on Dec 12, 2011 9:48 PM PST up reply actions  

also of note as soon as that article went up, Coon says the rumor is NO can have Minny or Gordon

so it’s basically more of the same BS with 2 different sides to the story, one with both EJ and Minny and one with only 1. So annoying at this point.

Fire Jasen Powell!

by chrisd on Dec 12, 2011 9:50 PM PST up reply actions  

So Billups would start at SG I presume......

That might actually work with CP3. He and Paul are both good defenders, and Chauncey is much bigger than CP3 or Mo.

by NewCavsfan on Dec 12, 2011 9:53 PM PST up reply actions  

if that's the case:

it would make our back court small, but i think some of our best basketball last year was when we went with the 3 guard line-up.

Fire Jasen Powell!

by chrisd on Dec 12, 2011 10:04 PM PST up reply actions  

I strongly doubt that

So the deal cratered over E Bled? Come on now.

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Dec 12, 2011 10:03 PM PST up reply actions  

It makes almost no sense

But that is what everyone was reporting earlier. Whether they were intentionally mistaking EJ and Bledsoe so EJ wouldnt get mad is another issue.

by NewCavsfan on Dec 12, 2011 10:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Why would the Clips walk away, only to come back with more leverage and yet UP the deal?

I’m starting to entertain the conspiracy theory that others are whispering about. Did the NO owners suddenly switch hats and pull an inside deal with the Clips to acquire Billups?

“Psst… We’ll feed you the winning bid, but then you have to include Bledsoe.”

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Dec 12, 2011 10:57 PM PST up reply actions  

Im pretty sure another team would know that their offer was higher, i don’t buy into this

Newbie

by gdl on Dec 12, 2011 10:58 PM PST up reply actions  

The idea would be for the league, knowing the other bids, to tell the Clips what to bid at the last moment

"i know huh........freakin clippers man.....its like a wild ride rooting for this team....gotta love em....(sometimes) lol" In GrIfFin We TrUsT

by SilverClip on Dec 12, 2011 11:00 PM PST up reply actions  

ok, enough of this shit

good night yall.

I hope that when i wake up, Eric Gordon is a Clipper.

At least let us keep him or the minny pick.

by indy818 on Dec 12, 2011 9:54 PM PST reply actions  

Edit
I hope that when i wake up, Chris Paul is a Clipper.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 10:54 PM PST up reply actions  

edit
I hope that when i wake up, Chris Paul and Eric Gordon are Clippers

by LJ Hann on Dec 12, 2011 10:55 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

stern

screw david stern and the nba, clips shouldnt cave, they have the leverage, the package should get worse over time not better.

by ImranQ on Dec 12, 2011 10:04 PM PST reply actions  

+1

I would even reduce the package as each day passes….. suck on that Stern!

by Natedog1977 on Dec 12, 2011 10:13 PM PST up reply actions  

I would be fine with that...

Go with what we have right now and then try to get CP3 through free agency.

we’re cheap, like to drink and are pissed off.

by ClipperBEAST on Dec 12, 2011 10:12 PM PST up reply actions  

bobcats...

they’ll end up trading kwame for cp3

by herro on Dec 12, 2011 10:28 PM PST up reply actions  

The Clips have the leverage now

Clips have now a serviceable point guard in Billups. Why trade for CP3 for an arm and a leg when the Clips have the leverage?

by Jakespeed on Dec 12, 2011 10:40 PM PST reply actions  

Because CP3 at the point and either Billups or Gordon at the 2 makes us a contender

The 35-year-old Billups at the point next to Eric Gordon doesn’t.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 10:56 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't know about that

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Dec 12, 2011 11:05 PM PST up reply actions  

I do

Current roster may be a playoff team, but not a contender. Don’t underestimate how good Chris Paul is. He’d be the best player on the team. Blake would be second best.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 11:28 PM PST up reply actions  

Not underestimating anything

Yes CP3 is good. But last time I checked he hasn’t won a championship. The Clips have leverage now. Let’s see how this plays out.

"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.

by Jax on Dec 12, 2011 11:36 PM PST up reply actions  

Agreed

As long as it plays out with Chris Paul in a Clippers uniform.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 11:40 PM PST up reply actions  

You should clarify

only the basketball blogs are ghost towns, the football blogs are as busy as ever.

"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right"unknown

by bestclipfan on Dec 12, 2011 10:59 PM PST up reply actions  

Silver Screen and Roll isn’t too bad. I normally hate Laker fans, but the ones on there are much more tolerable (and they seem to get a lot of traffic judging from the number of comments).

by shay on Dec 12, 2011 11:53 PM PST up reply actions  

This team now is deep in every position.

Maybe one last sign Rhino or Ike and we are ready for the rough 66 game schedule.
If CP3 can happen keeping EJ than we look very Championship.

by ENCUEROMAN on Dec 12, 2011 10:59 PM PST reply actions  

We don't have any space anymore

"Every existing thing is born without reason, prolongs itself out of weakness, and dies by chance" -Jean-Paul Sarte

by Jayq on Dec 12, 2011 11:19 PM PST up reply actions  

Still have the $2.5MM exception

specifically for teams who go from under the cap to over. And can also sign an unlimited number of Diogu-type guys to the veterans’ minimum.

Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.

by boltsfan21 on Dec 12, 2011 11:30 PM PST up reply actions  

So do we think there is a deadline for this deal?

Like by Tuesday?

"..We have the talent and capabilities so why not go for it?" BJ Raji

by AcmePacker21 on Dec 12, 2011 11:27 PM PST reply actions  

sure hope so, following these rumors makes it difficult for me to be productive in any other area, namely work.

Newbie

by gdl on Dec 12, 2011 11:33 PM PST up reply actions  

I too can't help but feel

we overpaid DJ. He hasn’t proved to me that he’ll be any more than Diop, Haywood, or Dampier. All of which were albatross (or still are) contracts (although all paid by Cuban). I love the guy, but still, 8 figure contracts (especially under the new CBA) should be few and far between. I’ll give it to him, that when you see like Biedrins (and his awesome free throw shooting) making 9 mil, DJ seems like a bargain.

Sports are funny. Old guys, you’re pay a additional premium for past accomplishments (See Jeter, Derrick), young guys you’re pay a premium for potential. We’re still paying DJ as the player we think he’ll become, not the player he is now, so you can’t but help think he’s making more than you should. You have to think, nearly the best case scenario, he lives up to his contract, but I’d still give it like a 50/50 chance he does that. I’d say there’s still a way bigger chance he lives it down more than he’s viewed as steal by the 3rd and 4th year.

I agree though, we didn’t really have a choice to pay him, and keep him as the center of the future. Sadly Kaman just hasn’t been consistent enough, and just such a pain that you never know which Kaman is going to show up quarter to quarter, game to game, or year to year. Getting a quality center doesn’t even appear to come around in an entire draft class, so if you think you got yours, you gotta hold on to it, especially one as young as DJ. Just gotta hope he’ll live up to it, and at least be a Tyson Chandler (from like 3 years ago), or Emeka Okafor. Both of which were at one time viewed as overpaid, but still productive, not a 8 figure backup.

by osamu on Dec 12, 2011 11:43 PM PST reply actions  

that's the way it is

rookies and superstars are underpaid, non superstars get overpaid past their rookie contract, especially centers. Possible exceptions: veterans coming off an overpaid contract looking for a ring.

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 11:55 PM PST up reply actions  

plus DJ is the type of healthy center

Blazers are willing to pay 8,7 million just to let a center rehab for the 3rd year running.

by BelgianClipper on Dec 12, 2011 11:57 PM PST up reply actions  

+1

The alternative is to eventually pay a guy like Diop, Haywood, Dampier comprable $$$.

You price not only to value but to the next best option and in a world where Varejao, Biedrens and Okur all make big $ you’re going to end up paying a premium for a starting center.

Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.

by ganima on Dec 13, 2011 11:26 AM PST up reply actions  

im a lil late posting this and people prob wont see my comment but...

i know it’s practice but cant i expect a lil bit more from dj’s offense after watching this clip during the summer: http://www.nba.com/clippers/video/2011/06/02/20110602DeAndremov-1723664

by shimmywitbillycrs on Dec 13, 2011 12:27 AM PST reply actions  

+1

that clip brought tears to me eyes. would be $ if he can consistently shoot like that.

by bewilder on Dec 13, 2011 5:29 AM PST up reply actions  

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