NBA Trade Rumors - Paul to the Clippers - Take 2
by Steve Perrin on Dec 13, 2011 9:59 AM PST
in Trade Rumors
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PrintObviously, this story is not going to go away easily. Stein and Broussard of ESPN have an updated take on it this morning. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on it, but thought I'd get it on the front page for everyone to discuss.
Stein/Broussard are back to insisting that both Gordon and the Minnesota pick were in the deal Sunday night/Monday morning. Frankly, I just don't think that passes the sniff test. Let's assume the Clippers did offer that. Why would the Hornets not take it? Why in the world would they hold it up over the likes of Eric Bledsoe?
Sources close to the talks insisted Monday night that both Gordon and the Minnesota pick were on the table for much of Monday's talks, but that's one of the main reasons that the Clippers backed away. NBA.com quoted a source close to the talks on Tuesday questioning whether the league "can come back far enough" in negotiations, because the Clippers are determined to surrender no more than one of those prized assets in a deal for Paul.
Even this quote doesn't make a ton of logical sense. "On the table" to me means that the were in an offer the Clippers had made. If they were in the trade, then it doesn't follow that it was the reason they backed away. It seems more like, as almost everyone else reporting on this story has said, that the Hornets asked for both, and the Clippers refused all along. That doesn't say "on the table" to me at all.
It's fascinating to me that Stein/Broussard had their version of the trade (Gordon and pick in, Bledsoe the snag) up to the point that it feel apart - then they changed back to saying Gordon wasn't in - and now they're back to saying Gordon was in. The ESPN echo chamber is a funny thing too. The rest of the ESPN-verse has been running with the version that Gordon and the MIN pick were both in the deal. This 5-on-5 is insistent that the Hornets should have taken that deal - but isn't it more likely that that was never the deal?
We may never know the truth; but we may get an inkling if a new deal goes through.
Here's what I find most interesting. On a straight value basis, I would include Eric Gordon and the pick if it was the only way to get the deal done. You don't get a lot of chances to acquire a player like Chris Paul. Besides, Gordon is due to get a big raise next year, at which point he will probably be overpaid. Including him gives the Clippers some breathing room to put other pieces around Paul and Blake Griffin.
BUT - you can also be greedy here and try to get Paul AND Gordon or, maybe better still, Paul AND the pick. The Clippers have the leverage here - the very fact that this trade is being discussed again so soon pretty much proves that the Hornets have no where else to turn for a deal for Chris Paul. So it stands to reason that the Clippers offer isn't getting any better today, right? It's all about what Stu Jackson (acting as the Hornets GM at this point on behalf of the league) is willing to take.
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Exactly how I feel.
Unless the NBA improves its bargaining position, then the Clippers have no reason to give in to their wishlist…not yet at least.
Steve it is just bad writing
I am sure it is like what everyone else is reporting that both are in the conversation only because the Hornets are trying to get both. It makes absolutely no sense to hold it up for Bledsoe or the rumors that the league helped steer Billups in our direction so we can include EB.
They mixed up the two Erics
No other explanation.
Broussard and the rest of the Four Letter are fools. Woj is running circles around them this week!
Elton who?
by StudioCity.B.Free on Dec 13, 2011 10:14 AM PST reply actions
dude realy loves your name
Been bumpin' Clip Nation ever since Jeff McInnis iced that 20-footer to beat the Suns in 2002.
is the dudes name Willie?
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
Broussard
ESPN, please fire him. He’s a joke.
by Hengtime81 on Dec 13, 2011 10:15 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
His source
Is Eric Gordon part of the trade?
by DonHwan on Dec 13, 2011 10:50 AM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Photo
You guys need to check out the photo on ESPN NBA front page. It is priceless.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:16 AM PST reply actions
EJ>Minny Pick
Come on Steve, even if that unprotected Minny pick becomes the #1 pick in the draft, there is no way that you can predict that it turns into the next BG or the next Candyman!! In EJ we have one of the premire SGs of the league and only getting better, NOW!
There's a couple ways to look at it
After EJ signs an extension, the player drafted from the Minny Pick will be payed a lot less. Let’s say EJ signs for 12 million, and the draft pick makes 5 million. That leaves 7 million to spend on another player. In the current market, that could net you ….. Kwame Brown. OK bad example.
The part to consider is that DTS is the one who has to sign the checks.
What is the NBA waiting for?
Are they going to hold off on trading Paul until a new owner comes in? I don’t buy that they’re just going to let Paul play out the year and walk at the end. They have to get something. Unless another team somehow jumps in ( and I have no idea what team that would be) I imagine this trade will be re-visited by the end of the week. Eventually the NBA Hornets will pick one. At least that’s what I’m hoping.
To me it appears ESPN likes to use the word deal instead of offer. I imagine most of there sources have come from the NBA, which has been telling them: Gordon and the pick are in the offer. ESPN then tells it as both Gordon and the pick are in the deal.
Washington Post
I came across an article from the Washington Post regarding Billups. There was line which caught my eye and found disrespectful:
Billups told ESPN NY’s Ian O’Connor over the weekend that he would consider other options if the Clippers came after him.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:37 AM PST reply actions
so he would let 14M slip away?
a man of principles!
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Must be nice to be able to do that
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
BS
Point of clarification: If you read the actual ESPN article, Billups never mentions the Clippers. It is BS made up by the writers, Cindy Boren and Matt Brooks
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:53 AM PST up reply actions
I though so
they just went: Billups will retire if claimed by a non-contender, clippers are non-contenders so Billups will retire if claimed by the clips…
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 10:55 AM PST up reply actions
are they allowed to do that?
Is this journalism?
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
by Newton Pham on Dec 13, 2011 10:55 AM PST up reply actions
Steve Perrin
Should call those two on the carpet.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:56 AM PST up reply actions
interested in seeing if getting a third team involved or taking bad contracts
Would let us keep Gordon. Has to be some team we can maybe flip Kaman to that can give a young talent to the Hornets for us so we can keep EJ. The number one team that comes to mind is the Pistons with Stuckey or Spurs for Gary Neal/Blair or Neal/Splitter (amnesty Jefferson for the cap space)
by KillaClip on Dec 13, 2011 10:42 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Houston
Already was at the table and obviously desperate for a center. If not K-Mart, I’m sure there’s a way to at least get one of their young assets (Hill, Thabeet, Budinger) over to the Hornets.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
That should do it i think
Out of all of this I think the Hornets just want a young talent that is a sure fire starter from day one which is understandable. I think we can get that player in a three team deal using Kaman we just have to grind harder maybe have to take a bad contract from the third team and Hornets though.:-(
by KillaClip on Dec 13, 2011 10:55 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Contrats are part of the rub
Assuming we keep EJ, taking on any additional long-term burden is tough. We can make it work but it adds that a level of uncertainty once we need to negotiate new deals and continue bringing in complimentary pieces while operating under the luxury tax.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
that would be the battle
Making sure EJ and BG both get the amount of money they deserve. I would hope at least the bad contracts fill the depth needs in some form while any leftover holes could be filled with vet mins off the star power of CP3the and LA.
by KillaClip on Dec 13, 2011 11:25 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
K-Mart2
Wouldn’t be a bad buffer to EJ’s loss.
Not sure how the deal would work, but assuming Kaman and sweetener (AFA or Bled?) is enough, then K-Mart2 to us and then EJ + Minny pick to Hornets.
K-Mart2 is on the books for two more years at $12M. We’ve got our team set for two years which I guess makes me a little nervous but worth the gamble.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Don't know about you
But I always like three-ways… :-)
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:55 AM PST up reply actions
I cannot confirm or deny that I've ever participated in a three-way . . .
trade
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
It behooves one to have pick protection in any three-way
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
True - you have to be careful as you might not know exactly what you're getting into
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
And watch those future considerations
baby mamas and what not…
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Actually I think the reports are correct
I know it seems completely illogical, but I think Bledsoe was the sticking point. I think the Clips were ready to give up 3 out of the 4 players and Stern wanted both Erics.
It doesnt make a lot of sense to me except the for teh $ situation. Bledsoe will be on a rookie contract for several more years and Gordon is due for an extension next year. The Hornets MAY not value EJ the same way we do as fans.
From the Clips perspective, money is going to be really tight with a maxed out BG and CP3. Then you have DJ at 10+ and Butler at 8+, do we really have the money to max (or near max) EJ? Honestly with that line up we will attract all sorts of discount vets looking to play on an exciting championship team in LA.
In terms of wining now, EJ is clearly the more valuable piece. In terms of the long term health of our franchise (and likely the Hornets as well), the pick is probably more valuable. I wont go quite so far to say the same thing about Bledsoe, but its closer than you would think.
Not much love?
RicBucher: Why outrage over Ws signing Kwame for 1yr/$7m? Far smarter move than $40m+ for Tyson or DeAndre and he’s instantly their best big defender.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:49 AM PST reply actions
jsut saw this
kinda odd to compare chandler to DJ….on is old and one is, well, not even close to old.
But one is good and one is, well, not that good yet
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
GSW and defence = Kwame?
interesting…
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 10:54 AM PST up reply actions
on crack.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
by Newton Pham on Dec 13, 2011 10:56 AM PST up reply actions
Call me crazy but I think I'd rather have DJ
At least he can palm a basketball
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
they did try to sign DJ and Chandler for 40M+ ...
thanks to that they haven’t got any other options then to sign Kwame for this kind of money…
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
He's instantly their best big defender
They could’ve sign my grandma and she’d be their best big defender!
In all fairness my grandma is dead, so she’d come in second after Biedrins.
these espn articles are maddening
they seem to be some sort random collection of words to which they keep adding bits and pieces. The result is some sort of frankenstein article.
Anyway perhaps Oshley is using the Stern tactic: well Gordon is on the table, if you don’t except within 5 seconds I’ll replace him with Bledsoe.
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 10:51 AM PST reply actions
I get the feeling that they are in bed with the league
And that the league feeds info to try to improve bargaining position (at least re the CP3 trade)
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
I'd believe that they're the mouthpiece of a psycho league
But how would it really help their position?
no they are just incompetent
Journalists should at least try to make their articles readable…
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 11:13 AM PST up reply actions
Funny
MerlinSportsMan Merlin Saunders
Sources tell me Stern will trade Chris Paul for another superstar, 8 bench players, 5 draft picks and cash considerations.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:54 AM PST reply actions
Another funny tweet
@thejabarimayes
jabari mayes
@NOPD I want to report a hostage situation#Chris Paul#just sayin
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 10:59 AM PST reply actions
Finally
It is about time. Plus, the FO knows the league and Hornets really do not have much leverage right now.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 11:05 AM PST up reply actions
Of course I'm sure the way it works is
CLIPPERS: “Really…either you drop the demand for E.Gordon and just take the Minnesota pick, or you can shove it and buzz off.”
NBA: “Pleeaaasseeee…..”
- Silence -
NBA: “Oh alright…you can keep E.Gordon, but we want you to take another contract in the deal.”
CLIPPERS: “Well….I’ll think about it…”
NBA: “Oh you’re back! I thought about it….take another contract back AND give us both the pick and Eric Gordon.”
CLIPPERS: “WTF, you should just increased your demands from even the previous trade…”
by UC.Clipper on Dec 13, 2011 11:12 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
i would hope that as soon as the Hornets say you can keep Ej
We scream out deal. Gordon has to be the key piece we have to focus in on keeping.
by KillaClip on Dec 13, 2011 11:31 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Presuming they're angling to making that franchise a barren wasteland
With only future picks and developing cheap talent, one would presume that they’ll drop the E.Gordon demand only if the Clippers were able to take some contracts off their hands. This means the Clippers can’t just yell “deal”; the team would just restart negotiations with a new “direction” in mind.
If that’s the case, one then can figure a hard-line league will demand somehow the Clippers take both T.Ariza and E.Okafor off their hands…and the Clippers will not only be hesitant for financial reasons, will be flabbergast at how the hell they’re suppose to meet this demand..
Makes some sense
I’m sure an new owner would prefer a blank slate with cheap young talent and a bunch of draft picks to a middling to average team full of vets. Or at least that’s what I think Stern is thinking.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
really wish Willie Warren had serious value
We could then flip him to another team in package with Okafor.
by KillaClip on Dec 13, 2011 12:05 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Steve you are beginning to sound like a broken record...
We should not trade Gordon under no circumstances. It makes no logical sense to trade him in this trade. CP3 is not the same player he was just 2 years ago and he is definitely not worth giving up gordon for.
And(I like to start sentences with conj.) really tired of people saying that those who are against giving up gordon are blind or homers or whatever. The FO sees this as we do also. You might want to look at cp3 backcourt mate over the years to see who was doing the dirty work when it comes to defense on the perimeter.
In essense, Gordon has never been on the table and never will be. Gordon and Jordan were made aware of this at the outset. The Clips made good on their word with Jordan and I expect them to do the same with EJ.
Giving up Gordon for even a 2 year rental of CP3? Really? A guy who said sign Chandler…I want to play in NY…I want to play with Kobe…well since that won’t happen, I want to play with Griffin and Jordan, but….no extension…not even a promise.
Please stop it. We are not desperate nor should we operate as such.
No Gordon. I mean we could actually trade him to INDY if it came down to it and actually be on the right side of the leverage table, but this…walk away.
totally agree with this, no gordon no matter what
they have NOTHING on us to force our hand into gordon
neil is publicly playing it off like this, i hope he sticks to it.
Agreed
If NOH want a Gordon they can have Ben or Flash.
Eric is our and we’re not sharing him !!
That would be great...
2 players that want to play with each other getting traded for each other…classic
Is it just me or
Is it just me or are all the reports fom ESPN implying the clippers offered the ridiculous package that included both the pick and EJ? Our GM states in the interviews on clippers.com that the NBA execs proposed the trade. The only reason I can see why they reported and insist that EJ is being offered by the clips is that they are working for the nba. They are tryin to get EJ pissed at the clips to force a trade giving the NBA hornets leverage in getting a deal done.
by ClipperEpochalypes on Dec 13, 2011 11:32 AM PST reply actions
To me that makes sense
Broussard’s source is the NBA side of the deal.
They also screwed over the Lakers – the only reason Odom is gone is because Stern nixed that trade. Not that I’m crying over it.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Odom
Plus, Odom was too immature and unprofessional. Look at how Pau handled it all.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 11:36 AM PST up reply actions
True, but he is who he is
That was the 6th man of the year traded for picks b/c Stern didn’t let a trade go through contrary to his own promises. Wonder if the Lakers can file some sort of grievance.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Yes
It’s annoying that they keep fashioning their sentences in a way that implies:
1. The Clippers offered E.Gordon before, and will still: Broussard went from saying that flat out to phrasing it as that the NBA wanted both Gordon and the pick along with the other stuff the Clippers are generally willing to part with (Kaman, Bledsoe, Aminu); but he won’t flat out say anymore they were both offered for sure
2. Every time potential players in the trade are being mentioned to weigh in their analysis if the deal is worth it, they say E.Gordon’s name and stats
By the way, is it just me or is Sportsline CBS just basically echoing any report that ESPN shoots out? I feel like they’re just as mouthpieces as ESPN is.
if EJ asks neil why he's in trade rumors
neil should just say “lol broussard”
Chauncey Billups
ESPNSteinLine Marc Stein
RT @BA_Turner: Clippers say Chauncey Billups will be at practice Wednesday
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 11:32 AM PST reply actions
What? Hmm.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
I’m legitimately pumped up for Chauncey
by Michael White on Dec 13, 2011 1:11 PM PST up reply actions
An article was published recently
which said that Olshey guaranteed Gordon that he would not be offered in ANY package to try and get Paul. If I find the article again, I will post it here—maybe someone else knows exactly where it is already.
by 2-ScoopIceCream on Dec 13, 2011 11:32 AM PST reply actions
Anybody listen to Max and Marsalis this AM?
Laker homer #1 Mychal Thompson was guest host, and they talked Clips for like a whole hour (maybe still talking about them? Crazy) They defended Clips not wanting to part with EJ in CP deal, even talked up Kaman as an underrated player in all this. Mychal went as far as to say the Clips, as presently constructed, are the deepest team in the NBA and could be a top 4 team in the West this season. . .my how the times have changed
Ringing endorsement of Olshey (and DTS?)
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Maybe my experiences with MT are different.
I’ve always liked listening to Thompson and thought he liked the Clippers more than the rest of 710AM. Only show I listen to on there is Max and Marsalis.
They no need no stinking Odom
F/C Josh McRoberts is reportedly on the verge of signing with the Lakers.
Way to go!
Lakers GM was right. Huge signing (rolling eyes).
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 11:52 AM PST up reply actions
Funny thing about McRoberts
He is from Indy suburbs close to where EJ, Oden and Conelly all played. He almost went straight from high school to the pros where he was considered the number one power forward prospect in the nation and a top 10 NBA pick. He went to Duke and reality set in and was picked #37 two years later.
"I gotta have more cowbell!"
On another note
Just saw on Hoop Hypes Kahn is after another guard Jamal Crawford.
Is there a 6ft 2in and under league I am unaware of the Wolves are playing in?
"I gotta have more cowbell!"
Pick is becoming more valuable
As long as he keeps signing guards the better the pick becomes….although it may not be a #1 pick as Stern will somehow rig it as a punishment to us not caving in to his demands
It's Hip to be a Clip!
by ClipperOptik on Dec 13, 2011 11:54 AM PST up reply actions
Maybe he thought this was college
Where starting lineups with 4 guards would work…
...what the hell is wrong with him?
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
he is Khaaaaannn
he doesn’t need a reason to do silly things.
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 12:04 PM PST up reply actions
He wants Love to avg 30 rebounds a game
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
So Kevin you'll be the first player to average 5/30
just rebound and nothing else except breathing
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
Brad Turned saying the deal is dead and that both sides are no longer talking (NBA and Clips)
Newbie
good
Id love to have paul, but at this point our amount of depth means that, when half the team gets injured, we will be ok.
We are great team eve without him, but
I still say this aint over. I dont see any other deals o the table for Stern to accept. Its our way, or the highway (well, CP on the highway to NY or LA this summer, with Stern and the Hornets left choking dust on the side of the road)
And as time goes by, they get even more desperate and our offer gets worse.
by cassellmania on Dec 13, 2011 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
i agree with your line of thinking, apparently adrian woj and marc spears agree as well, per the article linked below this
Newbie
Stern isn't trading Paul
the only reason he discusses the deal with the Clippers recently is so he could show people what he was looking for when he turned down the Lakers deal. Thus by asking for too much, he knew the Clippers would turn it down. This is all about saving face from a lawsuit from Chris Paul. Glad we are hopefully moving on.
Fire Jasen Powell!
Clips wait for NBA to lower Paul demands
Per Adrian Woj and Marc Spears
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;ylt=AqrDgjHlMEJbCfobzGgVbW8vLYF?slug=aw-hornets_clippers_paul_trade_121211
So confusing, both of these articles coming in the last 30 min
Newbie
Neil Olshey proving more savvy than NBA execs
"They’re scrambling now," one official said of the NBA. "But it’s still hard to tell if they really want to trade him, or they’re just determined to keep the asking price in a place where they can hold onto him for the next owner. …These guys in New York had no idea how hard this process would be."
Newbie
Oshley has Stern on the backfoot
got to love it.
Neil is on fire this last few days….
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 12:32 PM PST up reply actions
I'd love to see the current offers for NOH
I’ve got some land in the bayou + a crawdaddy farm that’d I’d mortgage to take them off your hands, Davey.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
great seeing how neil has dealt with the cp3 travesty
vs kupchak
granted i think kupchak has something up his sleeve, but neil doesn’t have that luxury, took action immediately and has set the clippers up for a great season and a vast improved roster without paul. the lakers traded odom for nothing, arguably their team’s 3rd best player, and are hoping they can strike gold. they might be able to do that, but “might” is a very fragile word.
David Stern and the League
They probably thought that it was the Clippers and they would just bow and accept whatever the League wanted to give.
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
Ive been waffling on this deal
but although CP is VERY tantilizing, our group of youngsters not to mention Minny is just too valuable to break up. If successful this year, they could play together a long time, gawd, maybe dynasty? Olshey is one bright guy in my book….
ESPNSteinLine Marc Stein
RT @BA_Turner: Clippers say Chauncey Billups will be at practice Wednesday
48 minutes ago
Brings a smile to my face.
Chauncey is a trooper
Clips also did treat the situation with a lot of respect, not making a fuss about Billups turning up straight away and allowing the guy to collect himself.
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 12:24 PM PST up reply actions
good times.
Billups, Mo, Bledsoe, Foye, Gordon, Warren
Gordon, Mo, Billups, Foye, Butler, Leslie
Butler, AFA, Gomes
Griffin, Trey, Gomes, Cookie, Kaman
DJ, Kaman, Cookie
missing anyone?
What?
Not enough Gomes? Just asking… :-)
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
hes a major trade chip
and considering this team shouldn’t be in a hurry to move bigs (suddenly the position with the least alternatives?) keeping him and not hastily selling might be a good idea.
Gomes is like Magic
he can play all 5 positions.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Gomes is like magic
He disappears!
"I gotta have more cowbell!"
by PV Mike on Dec 13, 2011 1:14 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
The Big Disappointment!
Clippers // Chargers // Rays // Boise State
"The Lakers do win games. But things can change." - Blake Griffin
by 82-0 on Dec 13, 2011 1:24 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
waiting for happy quotes from chauncey
will be very reassuring..
Wow. Two major Lakers signings... LOL
by lovinglosangeles on Dec 13, 2011 12:25 PM PST reply actions
same universe as Gomes and Cook
actually, retract that. Insulting to both our gys.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
I'd rather have Green than Gomes
You can cut Green, Gomes you still have to pay $8 million to for 2 years.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 14, 2011 1:26 AM PST up reply actions
if the talks a dead
…I just see a trade deadline deal. That means the Hornets will have a pissed Chris for a few months.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin]getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -Steve Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 13, 2011 12:29 PM PST via mobile reply actions
and traditionally speaking
…Kaman will have increased his value by then, as Chris tends to have a great season after down season, coupled by the fact this is Chris’ contract year.
…We are probably going to be a top 3 scoring team in the league and top 10 defensive team. There is a lot of scoring potential here. We have added defense, toughness savy and leadership to this team.
A toast; here’s to a playoff birth and wrecking havoc therein.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin]getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -Steve Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 13, 2011 12:35 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
in a way he does
I think Stern hoped that the Clips would sell the farm to get Paul which would leave NO in a good position to rebuild and very attractive to a future owner. Not to mention would appease Paul a bit.
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 12:37 PM PST up reply actions
neil is backing up his talk big time this season
never have i been so comfortable with a clipper gm, even dunleavy scared me because of the korolev failure
as long as neil quietly gets to the finish line this fa period or pulls off paul without gordon, im finally happy with the direction management is taking this team and i can see their vision slowly becoming reality.
It is kind of funny (iinteresting) how
those citizens who were so vicious to Olshey last year haven’t participated this year at all. i guess Olshey shut them up, but i would think that they would have enough cojones to praise when it’s due.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Yup, that's me
I wasn’t too happy when sterling didn’t interview anyone when dunleavy got canned and just appointed Olshey, but will admit I’ve been wrong. He has done a fantastic job, very happy.
by KeithClossrules on Dec 13, 2011 2:11 PM PST up reply actions
Praise for what?
Let’s see the moves.
Caron – 3/24 million – That’s not a great signing
DJ – 4/43 million – Another expensive signing. If anything why didn’t the Clippers offer him 5 years 50 million (thus saving a little) and avoid having that trade kicker?
Billups – Possibly the first good move if Billups shows up and isn’t uphappy to be here.
Cook – ROFL
Foye – Heating Up
Gomes – He’s on fire!
Using a Unprotected First Round draft pick to dump Baron and then find out we could have use an amnesty for the same effect – Priceless
Can probably add the EBled trade (you know the one that made the Clippers pick unprotectableish) or drafting Aminu over George/Hayward.
So far one good (Billups) some mehs (Butler, DJ) and a bunch of oopsies.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 14, 2011 1:33 AM PST up reply actions
I'll give him advanced props
if he can get CP3 (and Okafor) for Minnesota Pick, Aminu, Bledsoe, Mo and Kaman. Huge ups if its Gomes and Foye instead of Mo.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 14, 2011 1:36 AM PST up reply actions
Love this from Simmons
After they [NBA/NOH] backed out of two separate trades, they’ve become one of those eBay buyers with awful feedback ratings; nobody wants to deal with them
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
didn't they just back out of 1 trade, the Lakers trade?
We backed out of the other
Fire Jasen Powell!
Is that what your sources told you?
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
The clippers though they had a deal done with Demps
but then the league stepped in and essentially said that the deal was void and started negotiating a new deal which the clippers walked away from. So they have now killed two deals.
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right"unknown
by bestclipfan on Dec 13, 2011 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
wish bill would give neil some credit
he just keeps using “it’s the clippers” mantra rather than giving the franchise legitimate credit. whatever he is, he’s the team’s most public sth.
Yeah, he does tend to unapologetically rip us
and completely glossed over the Chauncey signing.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Simmons does give us credit with this nice line
In the last paragraph of his Grantland column tday-
“But guess what? The Billups acquisition changed everything for the Clippers; suddenly they believe they can contend without Paul, and in the shocker of shockers, they might be right. "
by cassellmania on Dec 13, 2011 1:44 PM PST up reply actions
ah, missed that.
Good, overall I like Simmons
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
He's not a Clippers fan...
dude is a Celtics homer, period.
Clippers // Chargers // Rays // Boise State
"The Lakers do win games. But things can change." - Blake Griffin
and Clippers season ticket holder
but in his paraphrasing his words only to watch the other team.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
i think blake might have change that
He REALLY likes Blake, i really like that video on which Blake tells him how to root for the team and Blakes says something like ‘Fans like that make me proud of being a clipper’
If the deal is .....
Kaveman/AFA/Bledsoe/Minny pick for Chris Paul I can understand why the Hornets do not do this deal. It is a laughable deal for the league’s best PG and top 10 player.
In other words would you approve of a deal of players like Kaveman/AFA/Bledsoe and Minny pick for Blake Griffin Eric Gordon? Chris Paul is better than Gordon. A lot better.
How is that a laughable deal?
The NBA asked for, like, half the roster for ONE player. That is the definition of “laughable”. That demand just made Stern into a bigger punchline.
Clippers // Chargers // Rays // Boise State
"The Lakers do win games. But things can change." - Blake Griffin
So you'd trade BG for CP3 straight up in these circumstances, right?
CP3 is the better player.
You really have to say yes, don’t you.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
No
I certainly do like the original team/under team control/contract dollars that Blake is.
Contact status current and future has a lot whether you want/need a player.
I see, so you wouldn't trade a worse player for CP3
And contract status matters to you. Except where the Clipper contracts and player relationships are concerned.
That makes no sense.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
If I had no other offer and EJ is guaranteed to walk next year
leaving my team with the equivalent of Mo, Foye, Gomes, Cook and Kaman. Hmmm, let me think about that one…
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
EJ is a RFA next year, no way he is guaranteed to walk, not possible.
Fire Jasen Powell!
His hypothetical called for us to essentially be in NOH shoes
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
That's in a vacuum
They’re in no position of bargaining.
Dude’s leaving at the end.
They have no one else willing to deal.
They need to sell soon.
Isnt’t a part of the new CBA about their current team having an upper leg of keeping their stars and not having them dictate when/where they go?
In theory yes
But it doesn’t eliminate the fact that if a person won’t willing sign an extension, that does actually reduce options; you can’t prevent a person’s sovereign decisions
Depends on the circumstances
Here you are merely getting a rental
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
And NO would otherwise get nothing
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Not so sure
This is a guess however I am guessing CP3 would want a max contract so he may want a sign and trade deal
That would be the case if CP3 had a full contract left
however there is no guarantee that the clippers would be able to keep him more than the two years that he has stated he would stay, which depletes his value immensely. We aren’t dealing with player worth in terms of skill, it is nearly impossible to argue that EJ is a better player than CP3, however we know that EJ will be an RFA and is more likely to stay than CP3 which from the clippers perspective gives him a much greater deal of value than if you were only evaluating based on player skill. Also the league isn’t going to get equal value for CP3, because everyone knows that if they don’t trade him then he just walks at the end of the year which means that only the league (if they don’t want to screw NO for years to come) is truly motivated to get a deal done. The other teams know this and as a result there is no way that the league will get equal value for CP3.
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right"unknown
by bestclipfan on Dec 13, 2011 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
Not a laughable deal
Everyone knows that Bledsoe and Aminu can play and have potential. Everyone also knows that the Minny pick can turn out to be a future star. So that’s already three potential starters who are on their rookie contracts and may develop into good players.
To answer your question, if the Clips are in the same situation as NOH, yes. Those three assets gives NOH a jumpstart in their rebuilding process. Look at what Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis fetched when Seattle / OKC traded them away?
AFA cannot even start for the Clips who then went shopping for a 3 who is over 30 yrs old coming off surgery. Kaveman is 2011 version not 2007 version. Me likey Bledsoe, The Minny pick is piece de riesistance.
You keep saying "Kaman is 2011 version, not 2007"
If you’re trying to imply that age is some kind of a factor for Kaman at this point, the 2010 Kaman (16.5 PER) was almost as good as the 2007 Kaman (17.5 PER).
But if you’re trying to imply that Kaman’s skill is declining, the 2011 Kaman was injured and played limited minutes, just like the 2009 Kaman. How could Kaman be declining if his production has gone up, then down, then up, then down again? There’s no evidence to suggest Kaman is really any less capable than he has been before, except that he said he’s a little out of shape. But you haven’t mentioned that yet.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Clipper fans remember the good Kaveman while the NO organization is remembering the inconsistent Kaveman.
Ah from a valuation-perspective standpoint
I get what you’re saying now.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
who cares...
Wilriv….you’re missing the most critical point. The one that makes this whole negotiation process even a discussion; Chris Paul does not want to be there and has one year left to prove it. That lowers the price he should demand, because the team that acquires him only gets him for the remainder of the season. Anything else is just a promise. A star player under those terms are really only valuable to a team in championship contention (also the reason he is less valuable for one year to New Orleans) and Boston recently showed that.
Chris Paul is not going to demand his maximum worth in the situation he is in. Everybody in the league knows that (even NOH GM Demps)…except aparently Stu and Stern.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin]getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -Steve Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 13, 2011 1:05 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
consider Carmelo seen
Now I say to you…
See Carmelo wanting to go to New York, New York wanting Carmelo. That scenario keeps Denver in the driver’s seat. LA does not “want” CP3. LA can move on without him.
Denver also was a fringe play-off team and could really benefit from having him for the full year, further increasing his value putting him on for show as a performer.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin]getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -Steve Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 13, 2011 1:30 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
The deal is not laughable
Quoting the great Charlie Harper ‘When doing a bussiness transaction Jake, there is one question you have to ask yourselve, what leverage do I have in this transaction’ Replacing Jake with David the answer remains the same 0.
This opens the door for him
to leave when CP3 leaves, it’s a risk but it ensures that he can get out of Dodge next year.
"It's better to be an optimist who is sometimes wrong than a pessimist who is always right"unknown
by bestclipfan on Dec 13, 2011 12:55 PM PST up reply actions
looks like they will have nobody next year
except okafor and ariza
Fire Jasen Powell!
THE RENT IS TOO DAMN HIGH
Let stern see how much he screwed up the hornets after cp3 walks after this season for nothing.
Yeah, I think that article was posted upthread...
but a new article came out shortly afterwards saying that the Clippers are just waiting until the NBA lowers their asking price.
Clippers // Chargers // Rays // Boise State
"The Lakers do win games. But things can change." - Blake Griffin
Here it is:
Clippers // Chargers // Rays // Boise State
"The Lakers do win games. But things can change." - Blake Griffin
good
lets just move on, unless we want to gut this team. Make a play for Paul or Williams when they hits FA
by dulciusXasperis on Dec 13, 2011 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
we will get neither in FA imo
but eh, not worth gutting this team with EJ and the minny pick right now either way
This has no bearing on anything
funny KG quote of the day
“Timing is everything. Chemistry is something that you don’t just throw in the frying pan and mix it up with another something, then throw it on top of something, then fry it up and put it in a tortilla and put in a microwave, heat it up and give it to you and expect it to taste good. You know? For those of you who can cook, y’all know what I’m talking about. If y’all can’t cook, this doesn’t concern you.”
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
lol what the hell?
He starts off talking about basketball, and just rambles his way into cooking haha
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
last season he also went on this weird metaphor trip
but I forgot what it was.
by BelgianClipper on Dec 13, 2011 2:38 PM PST up reply actions
I still crack up at the image of him
walking into the CBA negotations like a raging bull, pumping his chest with that crazy wide-eyed look. Dude is definitely unique.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
still a fan of garnett's
throwback minny kg jersey is one of my favs
Just posted on Yahoo
LOS ANGELES (AP)—With Chris Paul’s future in limbo, Blake Griffin weighed in enthusiastically on the possibility of the Los Angeles Clippers landing the All-Star guard.
Griffin says the team would love to have Paul but is ready to roll with the players it has.
The Clippers on Monday called off a proposed deal with the New Orleans Hornets to land Paul, with general manager Neil Olshey saying they would have had to give up too much.
Asked Tuesday if the team is still interested, Olshey said he’d have to listen if someone called but that the team is not actively trying to acquire new players.
It's Hip to be a Clip!
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