Spurs 115- Clippers 90- That Did Not Go So Well
by johnnyoc21 on Dec 28, 2011 11:59 PM PST
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Well, following a disappointing loss to the San Antonio Spurs, I set out to write my first official game recap for Clips Nation. About an hour and a half later, I had completed a lengthy, in depth, and dare I say damn good game recap. All that was left to do was to spell check and add a photo. Thanks to the handy manual and auto save features on the SB Nation editor, I decided there was no need to save a copy of the recap to notepad or Word. This would ultimately be my demise. Scrolling back up the page after selecting my photo, I found there were no words left in the editor. And, even better, the editor auto-saved over the blank page. I have recently come down from a level of anger usually reserved for foreign dictators funding terrorism. As such, the following recap will likely be shorter and less thorough (not to mention a little later) than I had originally set out. For this I apologize.
After a quick 3 point play by Caron Butler and a dunk by Blake Griffin, what looked like a good start for the Clippers turned ugly. Manu Ginobli (already in mid season form) got hot. The Clippers defense was scattered and lost, unable to get stops and thus unable to get anything going in transition. The half court offense was not much better. The Spurs shot lights out in the first half (7 of 14 from three, as well as earning three free throws on 2 occasions), and took a 14 point lead. In fact, they missed a couple of good looks from deep that could have extended the lead. At a point where the game could have gotten away from them, the Clippers countered with a run of their own, digging in and getting a few stops, and hitting a number of big threes, most notably two big ones back to back by Chauncey Billups. Going into the half, the Spurs lead was down to four, and the new look Clippers looked poised to compete. They had figured out that they need to play defense at a high level to open up their offense. They would head into the second half with a chance to win in an arena where they have been denied so many times in the past.
But things didn't turn out that way. The defensive intensity that helped get the Clippers back into the game was nowhere to be found. Dejuan Blair, Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobli, everyone seemed to have their way on the court. Rotations were slow on defense. There were poor closeouts on shooters, if any at all. To adequately describe how bad the Clippers defense was, I would have to violate several of the SB Nation terms of use which I just agreed to. Offensively, outside of a monster effort from Blake Griffin, the Clippers had nothing going, and the frustration was apparent (39% shooting as a team). The Clippers failed to mount any more comebacks in the second half. When red hot shooting meets porous defense, the result is, well, a 115-90 loss.
Some observations from the game:
Chris Paul/Blake Griffin pick and roll/pop:
Early in the game, the Clippers were looking to run this and got Blake Griffin open at the free throw line/ free throw line extended (with mixed results). This is going to have to become a major part of the Clippers offense going forward, and I am confident that it can and will be effective. These guys will develop chemistry sooner than later. Meanwhile, Chris Paul has to get in shape. The guy is so talented and crafty that he is already extremely effective, but he doesn't have his full quickness yet. He has shown flashes, but its apparent that he will improve. This will make the pick and roll/pop game that much more difficult to guard. And Blake needs to improve as well. Right now, teams are trying to take away the roll to the basket (San Antonio did a great job of this tonight). Blake has the ability to be a knockdown shooter from mid range. It seems that most of his problem is that he has an extremely annoying habit of fading backwards on his shot (even when uncontested). I don't have any stats to back it up, but from my own observations he shoots a much higher percentage when he goes straight up
Ryan Gomes:
Outside of a three minute stretch in the second quarter where he made a couple of shots and had a nice interior pass to Deandre Jordan, Ryan Gomes was awful in this game. Completely lost on defense, incapable of guarding threes or fours, and unable to hit the corner three. His release looks awful. Ryan Gomes needs to play better..
Chauncey Billups:
A tough game for Billups. Manu Ginobli is a tough cover for anyone, and with a significant size advantage on Chauncey, he was pretty much able to do as he pleased. The Clippers overall lack of offensive flow meant Chauncey didn't get a lot of great looks from deep or anywhere else for that matter. Like most of the Clippers, he seemed slow tonight.
Brian Cook:
I love Cookies. Brian cook being referred to as "cookie" is unacceptable. A stretch four who can knock down the three sounds like something you want, but once he is in you realize you don't want him in there. He is the basketball equivalent of an an oatmeal raisin cookie. Henceforth, I shall refer to him as "Oatmeal Raisin.
This game was a buzz-kill, to quote fellow citizen Michael White. But it's not the end of the world. The Clippers are going to have growing pains as they learn to play together and develop chemistry. Against weaker opponents, they may be able to simply "out-talent" them and earn some wins. The Spurs, however, are a well oiled machine, and you have to have a game plan and execute it to beat them. The Clippers will get better. A win is always better than a loss, but sometimes a loss is exactly what a team needs to realize what needs to be done and to get back on track. Hopefully, this loss will do exactly that for the Clippers.
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Came in first
Too bad im speechless
by arman martikian on Dec 29, 2011 12:10 AM PST via mobile reply actions
The team looks out of shape. Guys were not running or hustling back on defense. The Spurs were getting easy transition points. We are a young team and we can’t get back on defense. Blake should be down near the basket anticipating every rebound, not outside ready to run on offense. What was up with that bounce pass Mo threw in the first half? That looked intentional, and I would not stand for someone sabotaging the team. We will get better, but we have so much to work on. We have to get better fast or we aren’t going anywhere in the playoffs. Very disappointing game.
I didn’t watch the whole game, I was working so I missed out on many things.
That bounce pass was really confusing as well
I thought originally that he was looking for a lob, decided it was impractical based on the defender, and then tried a bounce pass to Blake. I honestly have no clue though.
Hit kid from riverside ca. foot
I was confused as well and I slowed it down and saw it hit the rookie from Riverside ca. Kawhi Leonard (lived there for 40+ yrs.) on his foot… it looked weird but that’s what happened, could have been a way better pass from Mo!
brijo1
RIVERSIDE!!
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 6:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
games like this are to be expected
but damn…. I really wish this were the preseason instead of game 2 of 66 of the regular season.
You can lose @ San Antonio but...
at the end of last season, all the nation agreed on the needs of the team: fill the hole at SF and possibly upgrading PG. And now? we’ve CP3 and a bunch of PGs (too many!!!) we’ve got Caron (and every night watching Gomes we could realize how much we’re better) but now THE HOLE TO FILL IS AT THE SG!!!! It’s just a dream thinking this roster could compete! All the big guards will kill us, and what about the depth? Cookie roll up from 15th man on the roster to 8th!!! Are you kidding me??? And please stop talking about Mo as the sixth man of the year, we need to trade him asap for a real (and possibly difensive) SG. Billups could easily replace Mo off the bench
Truth be known
We also need to make sure Foye is shipped out along with Maurice. I did hear that something’s in the works involving Williams…we’ll see, the clock is ticking.
"The need to be right - the sign of a vulgar mind."
by ghost_ride on Dec 29, 2011 1:22 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Seriously
And what’s with the 3 guard lineup each game this season which includes Foye and Mo? Foye doesn’t need to be in the game at all, but that 3 guard lineup (even if only for 2 minutes) makes no sense. I realize VDN had moderate success doing that last year when one of the 3 guards is EJ, but that’s not the case any more. And Foye really doesn’t need to play at all.
Randy Foye managed to go 1-6 in 13 minutes last night. Of all the guys on the team, Foye doesn’t have the talent to try and shoot himself into a rhythm.
by Michael White on Dec 29, 2011 7:44 AM PST up reply actions
I think it has to do with the lack of bodies up front
VDN is forced to use Cook as a center and it appears Gomes is getting all his minutes as the back-up PF. So he has to throw Foye in there as a SF for stretches at a time. I guess VDN has more confidence in having Gomes and Foye getting minutes then Thompkins. Which might not be the right call but its hard to blame a coach for being weary of playing a second round pick significant minutes.
I’m willing to just throw this game out as a bad loss and move on but the Spurs definitely exposed some of the Clippers major flaws. Poor defense, lack of size throughout the roster, and no depth (playing bad players lots of minutes)
What’s Ike Diogu up to these days? Are the Clippers really putting all their eggs in the Pryzbilla basket? I mean, the Clippers need size now because you assume Evans will be back soon and these issues will be minimized. Go sign a tall guy to an unguaranteed deal if you’re not willing to play the rookies (which I also get.)
by Michael White on Dec 29, 2011 8:00 AM PST up reply actions
That's a good point...
I’m also assuming the FO is waiting out Pryzbilla, but, clearly the team is suffering at the delay. And it’s not just at the center spot. The lack of size at the two and three was rather alarming last night. Why not add someone on a ten-day deal?
I think Diogu is the next choice
If Przybilla chooses the Heat or Mavs the Clips will go to Diogu. I guess they’re just willing to suck it up for a few games to wait and see on Przy. In a shortened season the only goal has to be to make the playoffs and have your team and rotations set when the playoffs begin.
Agreed - why not get Ike in here
I guess you can’t get a 10 day yet
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Is Pryzbilla's DECISION
gonna be aired live on ESPN?
when you hear the Clippers, it’s not going to be a joke anymore. I can guarantee you that -BG32
Don't forget no offensive scheme
It looks like Vinny is trying to establish the pick and roll which is a great building block. But the rest of the offense revolves around iso and the three guard line up. Worse are the attempts to post up Cook. It isn’t even part of his game.
It's not as though any other combos were working
Can’t fault VDN to try the smaller lineup to help closeout on their shooters. It backfired but so did everything else.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
by ganima on Dec 29, 2011 7:56 AM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
That’s certainly fair. It’s a 115-90 beatdown so I’m definitely not suggesting that it was a leading factor to the loss.
by Michael White on Dec 29, 2011 7:58 AM PST up reply actions
I thought the defensive rotations sucked
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Indeed they did
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
What about Bogans? He’s out there. He plays defense and will score a basket or two. But he’s a SG with SG size that defends. If not let Leslie get some burn. He can be our defensive guard. He’s young and athletic.
Bogans and Przybilla
Hopefully Przy chooses the Clippers. His agent indicated he might make a decision right after New Years. I agree on signing Bogans. He’d be a nice defensive option to throw out there. Billups would still have to start but you can substitute him early in games where he is struggling on D (like last night). Arguably I still believe the Clips have to trade Mo. If they can get Przy and Bogans then you’re only looking to get a replacement back-up PG and maybe another wing player with size for Mo. Just a quick glance around the league at rosters, I came up with 2. Mo and Foye to the Hornets for Jarrett Jack and Ariza. Or Mo and Foye to Milwaukee for Udrih and Carlos Delfino. Not that either of those teams does that.
Why would we need a back up PG
When we have Friggin Chauncey Billups on the team. If they go that route with Bogans and Przybilla, then move Mo to fill out the rest of the roster. More wing depth.
No way Chauncey would come off the bench
You think Mo is unhappy, just imagine Billups’ reaction if VDN told him Bogans was going to start and he was going to be the back-up. Lazy defense and contested 23 footers all around… That said your probably right in that a back PG is not required. You just sub Billups early in the game for Bogans and then bring him back when Paul comes out. And when Bledsoe comes back you use him to fill the holes at PG or when someone has foul trouble. The Clippers goal for the roster over the next couple of months is to find players so that Cook,Foye, and Gomes don’t ever play.
couldnt agree more...
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
Actually you just rest Billups early
and have him or Paul out there at all times to run the offense.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 29, 2011 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
That would be the goal but it won't always work
There are going to be plenty of times when both Paul and Billups will be resting on the bench. You would like to have someone out there to at least somewhat handle the PG duties when thats the case.
And besides Billups is one of you best shooters. You want him on the floor with Paul when he’s hitting shots because Paul is going to get him the most open looks. Splitting up Paul and Billups too much probably weakens both lineups.
Wow, sorry I kind of stole your idea
I just so your Bogans and Przybilla and you had the same idea as me!
I was forgetting
VDN is a legite candidate for
WORST COACH OF THE YEAR
and finally
why Ike is not on this team? it looks really unbelievable
No need to panic
The Spurs clearly have a system that has been successful for years. The Clips are still figuring things out, lets not forget the Heat started 9-8 last season as DJ Foster reminded me in his recap. I really hope Reggie Evans is back soon because the Clips could desperately use some extra rebounding off the bench.
Whats up with CP3? He’s so successful looking for his own shot at the end of quarters. He really needs to be more aggressive in games like this. It kind of felt like he was deferring to Blake most of the time. Furthermore, it seemed like Blake was the only one who really wanted to win this game. It will be interesting to see how the Clippers approach their next game against Chicago on friday.
Blake is very disapointing
he’s one of the laziest defenders ever. It’s really annoying to see him getting torched by all the david lee, dejuan blair, kris humphries and tyler hansbrough of the league night after night. Every single PF puts one of its best performance when he faces Blake and he doesn’t seem like he has improved at all in this area so far, really disapointing considering his reputation of being a hardworker…
by paris clips man on Dec 29, 2011 6:09 AM PST reply actions
its tough feeling knowing we contained Duncan
But allowed Blair to drop 20 that cant happen Blake
by KillaClip on Dec 29, 2011 7:38 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Saving energy for offense?
Honestly don’t know but agree; he definitely doesn’t look like the same player on defense as he does on offense. And it’s not like Blair is this amazing player either. He’s a nice player, but not someone who should have 10 points after only 6 minutes in the game.
by dulciusXasperis on Dec 29, 2011 8:08 AM PST up reply actions
That's BS if it is the case. What happened to our motor guy?
I want this guy working hard all game long, at both ends of the court.
Even moreso because I’m a defense guy, so I’m probably biased.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
It would help if DJ didn't go for every block
and leave Blake having to rotate leaving his man open.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
by ganima on Dec 29, 2011 8:19 AM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
it's not only that
He doesn’t even try. He’s ALWAYS the last to go back on D, and stop with that old “he’s not a good shotblocker because he has a small wingspan”, he simply never jumps.
Thanks god we had DJ last night, we would have taken 45pts without him. Without DJ, our paint looked as large as hoolywood boulevard, Blake never protects the basket and rarely helps from the weakside. I can live with him being a poor defender, but i got a hard time to swallow that he just doesn’t care about D.
makes me remember an old interview, back when Skiles was coaching the Bulls.
The journalist: what could Eddy Curry do to improve his rebounding?
Skiles: Jump…
The same goes with Blake, to improve his D, he just has to try.
by paris clips man on Dec 29, 2011 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, Blake looks lazy out there
He doesn’t run back on defense and often trots along on offense. Maybe he wants to prevent tiring out late in the game like he did last season, but it’s pointless if they are getting blown out late.
And what’s with standing out near the 3 pt line?
by Polish Rifle on Dec 29, 2011 8:30 AM PST up reply actions
His rebounds are significantly down too.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
I'm not too worried about that
it’s going to come back
by paris clips man on Dec 29, 2011 9:46 AM PST up reply actions
with effort.
He needs to show some effort out there.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
You guys are all crazy!
Griffin and Mo were the only ones that had the energy level at the top and everyone
else was sleep walking. CP3 reminded me of Baron Davis bringing the ball up.
The way to beat San Antonio is run, run, run and not let them set up their defense.
We did this in the second quarter and i thought we were going to keep this
rhythm going and then we start the third quarter again the same way we started
the game. Griffin goes for 28 and you guys are saying he’s lazy, unbelievable.
CP3 is not a speedster
It was one of the things brought up during the trade talk, but he plays at a slower methodical pace. He uses his speed more to burst past players not to run fast up and down the court. IIRC, they said that the Hornets pace was in the low 20s for teams the last 4 yrs.
First of all Blake scored 47 against tyler hansbrough last year.
I agree BG needs to play better defense for sure! all the talent is there,
I just think this is an issue the coaching staff can help solve.
VDN didn’t last yr. with Blake, so who knows why they haven’t this yr. other than no training camp, and I think the whole team is going to suffer from that dam lock out!! especially BG
But he Blake makes up for most of this stuff with the other things that he does but the clips need some help in SG area the center or back up center position and Cp3 needs to get in shape or pose his will on games more..at least so far, that’s my opinion. also I’m not sure CButler is the answer at SF …..
brijo1
Also throw back up SF
We do not have anyone to back up the 3. Probably a more pressing need that SG help.
The Spurs
are a well oiled machine. No hype, no Hollywood, not many highlights. They all know their roles and they know how to key in on other teams deficiencies. It’s the product of a hard working coaching staff that is prepared for the game. we can all learn a lot from them and I think the Clippers did last night.
wow did not see that coming (backlash from "fans")
its the second game of the season, we have a team thats been together for 2 weeks going up against a team with 0 change and shot the lights out of the building (uncharacteristically might I add). We have the talent we have the right coach, give them time to mesh and create bonds with each other. dang remember we are the clippers and we are their fans ONE loss shouldnt really rock our world.
i think most fans...
Are not so much having the issue with the loss but are having the issue with hoe and how bad we lost. As a pro team with the talent alone that is present, we should not have looked show apathetic. To lose by so much I blame the coach for at least not minimizing the “bleeding”.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 7:33 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
That's how I feel at least
Clearly this team is going to lose, we all get that. But to be blown out? To look this lost on defense?
by dulciusXasperis on Dec 29, 2011 8:09 AM PST up reply actions
I'm going to respectfully disagree
with your point about us having the right coach.
by hadouken! on Dec 29, 2011 7:55 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
I feel like VDN is useless
no schemes, no creativity, odd rotation…
I would feel more comfortable with Chauncey as our coach lol
by paris clips man on Dec 29, 2011 9:48 AM PST up reply actions
according to 710 am the Clippers are the Philadelphia Eagles..meaning we won’t make the playoffs. For you people that grew up in L.A. and are Clipper fans how do you put up with this rubbish from the media. I would think they would embrace either team doing well, instead they are bashing one constantly and have delusional hopes for the other. It’s sad.
Bynum apparently did something stupid off the court again.
2 tix
speeding and tinted taillights…
"Blessed is the person who is too busy to worry in the daytime
and too sleepy to worry at night."
Author Unknown
by Lawler's Law on Dec 29, 2011 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
710 am are all Laker trolls so don't bother with that station.
Hopefully we start winning and we can have a station who talks about
the clippers in a more positive way.
They do have a multi-million $$$ contract with the Lakers
Makes sense that there is some homerism is the Lakers are footing the bill. That said, even Mason and Ireland have made positive remarks about the Clippers over the past couple of weeks.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Pretty bold statement after 2 games
But if Paul keeps playing like he did last night, then we are in serious trouble. However, I don’t expect that to happen.
i agree
but i would also blame the players for horrible shot selection and lack of defense on the 3. people seem to for get that 3 years ago we were a 19 win team, 2 years ago we were a 29 win team and last year we were a 32 win team. we got new players that has had little time with each other and a coaching staff that has to put all the pieces together in a short time. at he core we are a 32 win team, with these new additions we are adding to that. it takes time especially in the arms race that is the west. do i see us as one of the deepest teams, yes. would i like us to play better, yes! after the lockout we had to squeeze an off season for trades and practices in 2-3weeks chris paul just got there pretty much.
this game showed that we are not a deep team
unless you are strictly counting PG. We really have no back up SF, lack post depth, lack length in the backcourt (specifically SG).
by mustang6944 on Dec 29, 2011 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
depth only with the guards?
Could it be we have become Minnesota on steroids? Lol
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 4:36 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
4 PGs 2 combo guards
and 4 Pfs. Didn’t realize Olshey translated into Kahn.
Kaaaaaaaaaaahhhnnn!!
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 5:56 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
We need
a defensive stopper at the 2 guard. It was painful to see the clippers continue to go with a 3 guard rotation which basically left manu and rich jefferson to do as they pleased. I’m really hoping the clippers FO can make a trade to bring in a hustling 2 or 3 that can get really gritty on defense. Mo’s gotta go. I felt almost as if Vinny put Mo in there the entire game just to show him that they he shouldn’t throw a hissy fit for not getting enough minutes, because frankly, he isn’t as good as he thinks.
Credit to the Spurs, they were spotless
Clippers 1-1
This loss fell squarely on Vinny Del Negro. Awful rotation. Awful play calling. At one point all the Clippers did was hack 3 pointers. Credit to the Spurs, however. I swear at one point they made like 10 shots in a row. Tony Parker made like 5 straight buckets and Jefferson made like 3 straight 3’s, those two put the game away right there, then Manu finished them off. All the Clippers did was hack hack hack 3’s and the occasional inside move by Griffin. Where was Paul last night? In my opinion Paul is out of shape and may need about 2-3 weeks to really get in game shape. Look like all he did in his downtime was eat pies and fried food. He’ll get there, I’m not worried.
The Spurs were lights out, simple and plain.
Oh! And the Hornets are 2-0. Funny.
Donald heckled ME!!!
by DonaldSterlingSucks on Dec 29, 2011 7:51 AM PST reply actions
They Did Indeed Move The Ball Well
Maybe no longer having George Hill has helped them in this regard.
We know exactly where Chris Paul was in the lockout...
He was the one superstar at the bargaining table. All day every day. He’d definitely out of shape, but, for the most part, kept Tony Parker in front of him.
You Maybe Read It First Here
but I think over time you will read and hear more about it.
Tiago Splitter is an above average defender.
I ain’t no fanboy of Splitter and I think his offense is still basically garbage collection, but he is good defender. I am pretty sure Pop his not giving him all those minutes because of Splitter’s offensive prowess. LOL
Holy hell do we need another big
Having Cook first off the bench is ridiculous. Reggie can’t get healthy soon enough. Need that sick groping SOB out there ASAP.
by dulciusXasperis on Dec 29, 2011 8:15 AM PST reply actions
New nickname for Blake Griffin
The “Slamming Sieve”. Griffin’s defense is atrocious….
The unforeseen downside of having 2 PG starting
is the ball tends to stop at each one. Too many times the ball gets swung around and either Chauncey or Chris will dribble around. Seems to kill the offense rather than having one the designated ball handler, play caller per possession and the other understanding that to play off the ball means to make the extra pass as much as it does to make plays.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
by ganima on Dec 29, 2011 8:24 AM PST via iPhone app reply actions
Spurs slowed the game down
They made the game half court. The Clips traded way their best half court player, Chris Kaman. The Clips were left on the permieter shooting contested jump shots instead. Diogu would have helped here to, he has some post moves.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
Actually, they ran us off the court
90 in three quarters isn’t slowing the game down. They looked like the younger team last night the way they were shredding our team and getting out on the break.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
by ganima on Dec 29, 2011 10:37 AM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
"Lazy Starting Guards"?????
The only thing lazy is that comment. What are you, like 12 years old? If there’s one thing Chris Paul and Chauncey Billups have never been accused of, it’s being lazy.
Way to overreact to one bad game, just like you overreact to everything. Yes, we looked bad last night all the way around. But it happens to every team, every season, more than once. And it damn sure has nothing to do with those two professional, ALL-STAR players being “lazy.”
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
It's only the 2nd game...
As much I really wanted this win because we have the Bulls tomorrow, we should relax and see how we do the 1st 5 games. The Spurs played better ball than the Clippers. Heck, they couldn’t miss! It happens. I say, if we go 1-4 in our first 5 games, then we worry.
+1
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
vinny needs to step up the intensity
Seems like he expected to lose in his post interview. Even with the team being together for a short period of time he needs to become more vocal and keep the motivation high until this team gels. Home opener against the Bulls he has to prove that he can get his team flowing for 48min.
A talk with Paul wouldn’t hurt either we need him to get in game shape and pounce on teams early.
by KillaClip on Dec 29, 2011 8:44 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Don’t they do drills and things for the guys to get into shape coming into the season. Have the guys do suicides and drills during the off days.
Vinny played Paul even when we were down +20 in the 4th quarter.
Sounds like he was trying to get him into game shape cause the game was blown out by then. I would’ve liked to see Caron in at that time too cause he needs to lose a few extra pounds. They will though, not every team has a guy like Duncan or Perkins who has lost a lot of weight and come into camp in better shape than ever.
well Mo did slim down
While DJ looks leaner with little more muscle.
by KillaClip on Dec 29, 2011 12:23 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
It's pretty clever
Our team is heavy on the “Name recognition” regarding players in our Starting lineup.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
I'll take that if it means we have that much talent
They’re right – we need to get a good defensive system down and get some more big bodies
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Way too early to say that
football is a far more volatile game, the Clippers should have too much talent to lose to bad to average teams. Against other talented teams, teamwork, coaching and chemistry will come into play as it did last night.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 29, 2011 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
aaaa im an eagles fan too
We have more time to recover than the Eagles had with only sixteen games.
by KillaClip on Dec 29, 2011 12:26 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
The Spurs have had the same coach and the same core for a decade
The Clippers have been together for two weeks. Let’s not panic here. This season will be a work in progress.
VDN may want to consider starting Mo at SG and bringing Billups off the bench to rest Paul.
Do not worry. (Matthew 6:27)
I'm seeing very little chemistry between CP3 and BG. I see it more for CP3 and DJ.
It’s slightly worrisome. I hope they get it together.
Also, why does everyone think BG has “the ability” to be a knock down midrange shooter? I don’t see it. His form is awkward, he has like 3 hitches and he holds the ball mid flight for far too long. It is hard to have a consistent stroke when you do these things.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
i think BG thinks he's a knock down midrange shooter.
It’s the only explanation why he rolls out to take a jump shot when trying the PnR instead of rolling to the basket. Our PnR is really stagnant too, such an iso play that none of the other Clippers do anything but sit and watch like it is a practice drill they aren’t participating in. In time it will work, just needs time.
He's got to be able to hit that shot
especially since most teams are gonna give it to him. The Spurs did a good job denying the roll to the basket. But I will admit he is trying extra hard to make that jumper work whether he can beat his man or not.
He needs to get a shooting coach then.
His shot is ugly.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
by Newton Pham on Dec 29, 2011 11:11 PM PST up reply actions
temporarily ;-)
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
We should have went with Casey. What was the FO thinking in hiring VDN?
Goodness.
Proud member of Club FTR. falconPUNCH! for president!
The jury is still out
VDN obviously imroved the Clips record from the previous yr to last yr. In fact, the team improved dramatically and included a 9 game home win streak last yr. Obviously if things head south this year, he’s gone, but if the Clips land 8th seed or higher, he’ll meet expectations and will get extended by Management.
We’ll see how Casey does in Toronto. The jury is still out on him too. Keep in mind that the both the Bulls as well as the Clips passed up on Casey and chose VDN. So VDN can sell himself.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
That just means the Bulls and Clips made a mistake
The Raptors were one of the worst defensive teams last year, this year (including preseason) they have become a respectable defensive unit already.
VDN needs to do better than the 8th seed to keep his job. Clips need to win 40 games or more otherwise they failed to meet expectations.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 29, 2011 11:19 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
We'll see
I think 8th or better gets by. You’re either in the Playoffs or you’re not. Using alegbra, 40 games or more this season means 50 games or more in a regular season. That’s a lot….I’m not 100% sure the Clips are up to that challenge. The front court is really troubling…while the guards are too deep. Time will tell.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
Projections were 42 wins for this team
and this roster would be expected to win 50 games in a full season.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 29, 2011 12:09 PM PST up reply actions
paul getting into shape conundrum....
Paul needs to get his conditioning back, stat. And as said above, he will get it back. With it being a condensed season he loses the advantage of high level conditioning between games, as he’ll need to use that time for rest and recovery. So the dude has to instead incorporate a seriously lean diet to give his body less calories to burn, helping him shed weight faster, making him lighter to move, thus making his body work a little less.
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 9:52 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Charles Barkley has to hook up with CP3 and get that Weight Watchers thing rolling, FAST.
CP3 looked Lazy, Slow and lethargic.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
He doesn't look "lazy"
He’s lost a quarter step from when he started in the league, probably due to his knee issues.
I think the Spurs effectively got back on defense, making the game half court. The only time the Clippers excelled was in the 2nd quarter, when the game was more full court.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
I don't have a TV
I watch in bars. I don’t judge players by their “looks”. ZBo has a round face and always looked “fat” but he’s a very productive player.
This is Basketball…not a body building contest.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
Your right Man, CP3 looked SO Good and Super Fast pushing the ball up court.
What Game was I watching? I got to go to Bars more often.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
I'm glad we agree
It’s good when fans come to an agreement.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
Sarcasim................we do not agree at all.
CP3 looked like a Turd or BD 3.0
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
Now I get why you were offended by "short bus"
You have the IQ of a mollusk.
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
I thought the same thing-- very flabby
"Success only comes before work inside of a dictionary!"
by Clipperoo on Dec 29, 2011 11:37 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
I love to read other teams blogs after they loss
Celtics:old need to blow up the team right now
Bulls" Rose played different after big contract
Knicks: Melo played lazy and Chandler is a bust, and my favortite Knick fan quote regarding watching them play the Lakers tonight: “It will be like watching two old people f*#K!”
"Who wants a free Sharpie?"
Game showed us what we already knew
We learned/confirmed that the Clippers….
need to trade Mo Williams for a good wing player or solid backup big
need to learn how to play team defense
need to take Foye out of the rotation entirely
need sign a big to relegate Brian Cook to 3rd string duty or specific half-court sets
2010 free agent signings were all terrible
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
This is true
"Fresh out the airport/ Fresh out the chair with the clippers/ Like Sean Livin' thinking, hmm/ I'm trying to get it like Sean get it" - Wale "Beautiful Bliss"
Here are my thoughts
1. Trade Williams+Bledsoe+Foye for NO Jack+Ariza.
2. Sign Bogans
3. Hope Przybilla signs with us.
4. Dominate with the stacked team of
CP3/Jack
Billups/Bogans/Leslie
Butler/Ariza/Gomes
Griffin/Evans/Thompkins
Jordan/Przybilla/Cook
Our 2nd unit is great on defense. We can mix them with our offensively powerful first team
Sorry, don't know you per say, but all these people wanting Ariza must be former Laker fans.
The guy makes 7 million a year for the next 3 years, he’s not worth it to be a back-up 2nd string player. That’d be paying $15 million for the SF spot. How do you plan to give CP3 & Blake max deals and go after a SG when we lose Chauncey after this year possibly?
I don't hate the Lakers
But I am loyal to the Clippers 100%. Ariza seemed to just lose it when he went to NO. He was great when he was with the Rockets. Also, you can always amnesty him if he doesn’t pan out.
you can only amnesty a player that was already on your own roster before the start of this new CBA
Clips can’t amnesty a traded player like Ariza, or any player they trade for.
Why would NOLA do that?
They are Rolling already with instant chemistry and moving the ball with precision. To Give up Jack would be a Bad move after they pulled off the Deal of the year offing a 6 foot Guard for 3 players and a first round pick.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
They have shown interest in Williams
To think that they would take Williams and put him as a backup PG again? They aren’t that stupid. So the fact that they like Williams means they would most likely start him. Not to mention they were really fighting for Bledsoe in the CP3 trade. Overall, they would get 2 players they have wanted and we can give them Foye who is on the last year of his contract. They also don’t want Ariza’s contract either, so we would help them.
So NOLA wants to lose?
Why? This is a losing trade and itf they were interested then they would of done it when they jacked us on the CP3 trade. Why now? Especially when JJack is kicking ass so far with out CP3 in the way to stop him.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
Wait ... so now you've switched opinions AGAIN?!?!?!?!
First it was the stupidest trade ever. Then you were kissing CP3’s ass all over the place to the point it was making me physically ill. And now — after 1 loss on the road to the team that had the best record in the league last year — he’s “lazy” and they “jacked us” on the trade? Seriously, are you a 12-year-old girl?
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
Mo to ATL for Hinrich & Collins
Collins defends big centers well like D12. Hinrich, though recovering from injury, is a solid combo guard.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
No EJ and Kaman
shows the lack of defensive rotation we were getting last year…DJ going for blocks leaves BG’s already shoddy D, even more exposed…
Sky is not falling for me yet…
"Blessed is the person who is too busy to worry in the daytime
and too sleepy to worry at night."
Author Unknown
Why the Cook hate?
I agree that Cook isn’t a great option as a backup big man. The reality is that once Evans is back, we are talking about someone who will play about 10 minutes a game and be your 4th big. While it would be nice to have a true center on the bench, outside of the Lakers, Magic and Griz there aren’t a lot of teams with 7 footers that have a post up game. The glaring hole is at the the 2/3. The Clips need an athletic wing to play defense and stay out of the way on offense and hit the occasional three (Courtney Lee would be ideal). And before any one cries about it, Prince and Battier at this stage in their careers would not have been any better than Butler. Unfortunately there aren’t a whole lot of teams lining up to add a 9 million dollar a year nonplay making point guard with 2 years left on his contract (Mo). Off the top of my head, the only teams that I can think of that might be interested are the Lakers, Blazers and the Heat. Until the season gets further along and contending teams start losing point guards to injuries we are probably stuck in a holding pattern.
All that said I still am not in panic mode.
Because he cant play defense and he cant rebound, and that is what this team needs
I want to see this team pick up Ike, have him and Evans take most of Gomes and Cook’s minutes, have Mo take most of Foye’s, and then see what happens.
Our team has been bad, but Foye, Gomes, and Cook have looked particularly awful, especially on defense.
Our team has been bad?
They’re 1-1 and haven’t played a home game yet. Won by 19 on the road on national TV and lost (admittedly by a lot) to the defending 1 seed in the West, the great San Antonio Spurs.
by Michael White on Dec 29, 2011 11:48 AM PST up reply actions
Plus the team we beat by 19 just beat the Bulls and the Knicks.
I understand some fans worries that things will be like the past, but just because of one loss they want to blow up the team and coach is pretty ridiculous.
The Spurs where unstoppable, he had to try anything and everything.
I’m willing to give Vinny some time with this team.
How so?
Why not give them a chance to gel before making that kind of an argument – unless of course you have specific examples of why his coaching is bad
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Your So Right man VDN is the Best Coach ever.
So proven, so much experieence, so much passion. Hold on.
Proven: Has not done anything to prove himself (he can talk good)
Experience: None (only 4th season)
Passion: While Popobitch was up by 30 he still was off this Ass coaching like a MF’er while Vinny Del Dumbo sat on his Fat ASS.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
Different styles
Phil Jackson also is not a fire and brimstone coach. MDSr was a very hands-on guy. When he got fired, the team had to find someone that was different.
"After the first six minutes I was heavily winded"-Andrew Bynum
Did I say that?
Making a claim that someone is a good or bad coach doesn’t mean much without an explanation
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
coaching is pretty hard to gauge
but one could look at the Bulls post-VDN defense and easily tell who’s the better coach between Thidobeau and VDN.
Guess who had a higher winning percentage, MDSr in 2009-2010 or VDN in 2010-2011?
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
by ClipperChuck on Dec 29, 2011 4:59 PM PST up reply actions
Starting to sound like a bunch of Lakers fans
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Bottom line
People are getting worked up about the 4th big on a team when Evans returns, who is not likely to get more than 10 minutes a game maybe fewer if another big body is brought in for cheap. There is a much bigger need for a 20 to 25 minute a night defensive 2/3 otherwise we will see a lot more nights like last night where the other team’s starting wings go off for 50+. That’s like getting shot in the chest and worrying if the dry cleaners will be able to get the blood off your shirt.
Speaking for myself
I’m not getting worked up at all. I would sign somebody like Ike Diogu because it seems like a relatively easy fix for a short-term problem (thin frontcourt with Evans out.)
I think you’re overstating the problem with the 2/3 as well. Billups is your starting 2 and he’ll get the majority of the minutes. That may bother some people (it doesn’t bother me) but he’s not going anywhere. Butler is your starting 3 and Gomes (flawed as he is) will be the backup SF. Gomes is not my ideal backup SF, but we are where we are on that one. The club already brought in Chris Paul, Billups, Butler and Evans this off-season so suggesting that they need to do some major wheeling and dealing before the team has had a chance to gel seems misplaced.
“My team’s on the floor”
by Michael White on Dec 29, 2011 11:59 AM PST up reply actions
I wasn't suggesting a panic attack...
My intent was to try to give the Cook haters some perspective, that there are other issues that are certainly more pressing than the 4th big on the team. Most notably defense on the wing and that there aren’t necessarily any great options out there right now besides sticking with what we have for the time being.
Well that came out weird. Blake was -37 which is another reason why plus-minus is dumb.
by FlyByKnight on Dec 29, 2011 12:10 PM PST up reply actions
No you're saying Blake is dumb ;-)
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Who says that?
Blake is the Best player on the LAC and the one of the only guy’s that cares.
"Your Hate Will Motivate"
He's not saying that seriously..just joking with the OP
Not sure if it’s a reference though to the first post with the crossed out words or the 2nd part with a logical fallacy…
Lots of good notes
And a good report by johnnyoc: too bad we missed out on the one that got away.
A few thoughts:
The lineup is a little skewed with the guard roster and rotation. It should work better if CP3 and the potent starting lineup get off to a good start and the Clips are playing from ahead, but that wasn’t going to happen at San Antonio. Eric Bledsoe is going to have to be the athletic defensive stopper playing alongside CP3, unless the Clips make some sort of change. They’re going to have big problems against the elite SGs, one of whom, Ginobili, set the tone for the game last night, and it could be as bad or worse with Kobe and DWade and, yes, Eric Gordon.
A good rule of thumb for last year applies to this year: if Cook or Randy Foye is getting significant minutes, something is wrong, somebody is hurt, and the Clips are at a disadvantage. Nothing against Cook or Foye, but they are in double digit spots on the roster hierarchy. So the lineup and roster is not only brand new, it’s also incomplete, and the Clippers obviously traded away a lot of depth in order to bring in Chris Paul. And the “trade Eric Gordon because he won’t sign a modest and helpful extension but keep Bledsoe, pick up Chauncey B. for a song, pick up CP3 and start 2 PGs” experiment is obviously in its earliest stages, not an ideal time to go up against Ginobili and Tony Parker.
My own theory is that the empty roster spot right now is being taken up by 2nd round pick Travis Leslie, who I know very little about. If he’s bigger and athletic and can play credible defense against the Manu’s, Kobe’s and DWades, then get him some minutes and let Milph start hyping him up the way that they did Kawhi Leonard last night. Otherwise, he’s a waste of space, and the Clips need to have some semblance of a wing defender on their roster. It would be better if Bledsoe was around to take his crack at it, but he’s not, and the team has to forge an identity relatively quickly. They have two years with Chris Paul, and really can’t dilly dally around. And they obviously need to have some sort of defensive presence and roster strategy. Foye is a good placeholder at the bottom of the roster, Mo is good offense off the bench, and Bledsoe will make a welcome return. But when the Clips traded Gordon (and AFA too, who could be helping with wing defense, Richard Jefferson going nuts for no reason last night), they really need to take a look at Leslie’s spot and see if he makes any sense. Where’s Q Ross!? Somehow I think he might be available.
Apply the same logic to the backup bigs, where there’s still an open slot. Trey Thompkins can sit as filler and play behind Cook, but the Clips need Evans sooner rather than later, and another long body besides. Pryzbilla would be good I suppose. It’s a drag that the Clips didn’t have much of a plan in place, and the drop off of missing Kaman is actually massive, especially with the way that DJ and Griffin are meshing on defense and the boards. They have a long way to go.
Not a big deal, losing to the veteran, intact Spurs in their building at this point, and it’s actually a good thing to take a look at where the low point can be. A lot of teams are having early troubles, and the Clips are going to have more than their share of growing pains. But CP3 is going to bring a different energy to his home debut, and Griffin responds to adversity well and with lots of energy. I’m a little scared of the Bulls, since they need to get their own act together right away, and the Clippers have always been a confidence booster.
The issue of Griffin’s defense and the way that he and DJ are playing together is an important one. It’ll be better against a different type of opponent. DJ is showing all sorts of great things, blocks in both games and good hustle and length against Tim Duncan, but he was flying around against GSW, and Griffin struggled last night about deciding if he was going to help on Duncan, and he didn’t give Blair enough attention. In general, everybody up above is right that BG’s defense is a gaping hole in his game at this point. He did a better job of establishing his presence on offense, and it takes some doing to get that high performance machine running. The rest should follow along.
It would be great if the Clippers can get out to a good start next time and play with some early confidence and energy. We’ll see.
by citizen zhiv on Dec 29, 2011 2:39 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Game Notes:
-Blake: He’s in great shape. He was unsure on defense (he left Duncan uncontested too many time, while be lost in the rotations.)
- Mo: Great shape. Aggressive. Too aggressive (got trigger happy a few times). Needs to remember to facilitate and not forget his hard defense in Oakland.
-Vinnie: did not coach well at all. Coaches don’t matter, right?
-Chris: A great player as advertised. No concerns. Will settle in more with his team. Is very cerebral….needs to get conditioned quickly.
-DJ: seemed to learn unbelievably quickly. He must have read the clipsnation fanpost about him compared to Bill Russell and it’s reference to staying on his feet more. Good job! He stUrdy in front of his man batter and was clutch for his free throws.
-Caron: is on good pace for his role. No complaints worth noting at this point.
Cook: ! …sorry for that gag reflex
Foye:
Gomes: Not bad this game. Serviceable. He hit a three right? He didn’t take up someone else’s shots,…ah-‘MO’!-em
Energy * Focus * No Excuses
"For [Griffin] getting in the way of Andre Miller’s 40 yard dash?" -S. Perrin
by Takebb909 on Dec 29, 2011 5:50 PM PST via mobile reply actions
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