Clippers vs. Houston - Game Preview
by Steve Perrin on Jan 4, 2012 12:36 AM PST
in News
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Print| 2011/2012 NBA Regular Season | ||
|---|---|---|
 |
vs. |  |
| 2-2 | 2-3 |
|
| Staples Center |
||
| January 4th, 2012, 7:30 PM | ||
| Fox Sports West, NBA-TV, KFWB 980 AM |
||
| Probable starters: | ||
| Chris Paul |
PG | Kyle Lowry |
| Chauncey Billups |
SG | Kevin Martin |
| Caron Butler |
SF | Chase Budinger |
| Blake Griffin |
PF | Luis Scola |
| DeAndre Jordan |
C | Jordan Hill |
The Back Story:
First meeting of the season. Houston won the season series last year 3 games to 1.
- December 22nd in Los Angeles - Houston 97, Clippers 92 Recap Box Score
- January 26th in Houston - Houston 96, Clippers 83 Recap Box Score
- March 2nd in Los Angeles - Clippers 106, Houston 103 Recap Box Score
- April 9th in Houston - Houston 99, Clippers 78 Recap Box Score
The Big Picture:
The Clippers are 2-2 on the young season, and the key has been the defense. In their two losses, the Clippers allowed Chicago and San Antonio to shoot better than 53% from the field. In wins over Golden State and Portland, the opposition made just over 40% of their shots. Overall, the Clippers defense is among the worst in the NBA right now in terms of points allowed per 100 possessions. The win over Portland was a step in the right direction, as the defense was much improved. Chauncey Billups should return to the Clippers starting lineup tonight after missing a couple of games with a sore groin muscle. It's also possible that Solomon Jones, signed on Tuesday, will see a few minutes of action.
The Antagonist:
The Rockets don't scare me nearly as much this season as they have in the past. They've always overachieved, particularly when Yao Ming and Tracey McGrady were hurt and no one expected anything from them. But those teams were coached by Rick Adelman, and he just had a knack for getting the most out of his personnel. I certainly don't feel the same way about Kevin McHale. This is much the same Rockets team that barely missed the playoffs last season, but the losses of Adelman and under-rated/sized center Chuck Hayes will have an impact.
The Subplots
- Rockets on a back-to-back. The Rockets are on the second game of a road back-to-back, but it is the easiest road back-to-back in the league. Houston lost to the Lakers last night, and will play the Clippers in the same building tonight. So it's not like they had to travel.
- Rockets off-season mission aborted. The Rockets tried to make some big, bold moves this summer (or rather fall/winter). They were a partner in the near-trade of Chris Paul to the Lakers, a deal that would have landed Pau Gasol in Houston. When the deal was scuttled by the league, it threw a wrench into Houston's plan to clear cap space to pursue a marquee center. When Nene and Marc Gasol both re-signed with their original teams, the Rockets were left with Samuel Dalembert as their big off-season move - hardly what Daryl Morey had in mind. At least Luis Scola and Kevin Martin didn't sulk their way out of town after the trade they were involved in fell through.Truthfully, I never much liked that trade from Houston's standpoint - maybe it makes sense if you can sign a big time free agent with the extra cap space, but losing Martin and Scola and picks just to acquire a 31 year old Pau seemed like a dubious decision.
- What compressed schedule? The lockout shortened season will force teams to play with much greater frequency than in a standard season, but you wouldn't know it from the Clippers schedule so far. They have played fewer games than any other team in the league - fully three fewer games than the Lakers or Thunder entering tonight's games. Of course, they're going to pay for the light schedule now later in the season.
- Topsy-Turvy West. It's hard to get a pulse for what's happening in the Western Conference so early in the season. For instance, Dallas was 1-4 before handing Oklahoma City their first win of the season. Likewise, Houston is hard to figure - they're 2-3, but their two wins have come against Atlanta and San Antonio, two teams that have looked impressive early in the season. It's way too early in the season to worry about such things, but with a win tonight the Rockets could find themselves in first place in the Southwest Division, while with a loss they could be in last.
- Kevin Martin. So far, KMart has been a pretty accurate bellwether for the Rockets. In their two wins, he's averaged 26 points per game; in their three losses, he's averaged less than half that. Last night against the Lakers he was a miserable 5 for 17 and 1 for 8 from three - particularly terrible numbers when you consider that Martin is usually one of the most efficient perimeter players in the league.
- Defending Martin. The Clippers knew that defending bigger guards would be an issue this year with their roster chock full of points and combo guards. In losses to San Antonio and Chicago, defending Manu Ginobili and Rip Hamilton while giving away four or five inches at the position proved to be difficult. Martin likewise is 6'7", but he's never been a post player. So while he may be able to shoot over Billups on the perimeter, there's little worry that he'll exploit his size advantage much around the basket.
- Kyle Lowry. Lowry (a college teammate of Clipper Randy Foye) had a very unusual game New Year's Eve. He handed out a career high 18 assists while scoring just two points, both on free throws. According to basketball-reference.com, it was the most assists ever for a player who did not make a single field goal.
- Front court matchups. Against Portland on Sunday, one of the keys to the game was placing DeAndre Jordan on LaMarcus Aldridge. Generally, the Clippers will likely be wise to put Jordan on the opponent's highest scoring big, but I'm not sure that's the best strategy tonight. Luis Scola has every trick shot in the book, and will look to get Jordan to bite on pump fakes and other sleight of hand. It might be better to leave Blake Griffin on Scola, since unlike Aldridge, Scola doesn't have the length to shoot over Blake.
- Courtney Lee. If you were watching the Rockets loss to the Lakers last night, you may have seen Lee pull up with an injury in the fourth quarter. The injury occurred on a non-contact play, and looked to me like a ruptured achilles (having suffered that injury myself). Fortunately for Lee, it turned out to be a strained calf. It's unclear what his status is for this game.
- Griffin and the Rockets. No Western Conference team defended Blake Griffin more successfully than the Rockets last season. Houston held Griffin to few than 18 points per game, and under 40% shooting, both season lows for any team Griffin faced more than twice. Of course, much of that was due to the stellar defense of Hayes, so it remains to be seen if it translates without their defensive savant. Somehow I get the feeling that Blake knows he struggled some against this team and would like to change that up a bit tonight. Jordan Hill is not Chuck Hayes.
- First meeting last season. When these teams met in December 2010 it was one of the crazier games of the season. The Clippers fell behind big almost immediately, and then went on one of the most entertaining runs of the season, with highlight dunk after highlight dunk. But they could never catch the Rockets. At the end, Blake Griffin had a chance to tie the game but his three pointer came up short with 3 seconds on the clock.
- Stockpiling 2009 draft busts. In a bizarre coincidence (or is it?) the Rockets are seemingly stockpiling any and all draft busts from the 2009 draft.
ThreeFour of the top 11 picks from that draft are now with the Rockets. Hasheem Thabeet (2nd pick), Jonny Flynn (6th), Jordan Hill (8th) and Terrence Williams (11th) have all joined the Rockets since the 2010 trade deadline. Ironically, the Rockets other starters are all low picks - Martin was a 26th pick, Scola 27th, Lowry 24th, and Budinger a second rounder. Budinger was in the same draft as his new teammates, Thabeet, Hill and Williams - and was taken over 30 picks later. -
From the Urban Dictionary:
rocket
n. An extremely attractive female
Holy s***, did you see her? Shes a f***ing rocket! - Get the Rockets perspective at The Dream Shake.
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Welcome back fearless leader
Hope you had an awesome vacation.
I feel good about this game.
Houston played last night. Lost to the lakers. I think they were a better team last year. Funny thing Mchale had Martin defensively on Kobe, not a good match up. Martin is weak defensively. This makes me question Mchale’s coaching decisions. We are playing at home and rested. DJ and Blake should do very well against their bigs. Lowry is a tough cover and Martin can light it up. Scola can get going too. Hopefully DJ doesn’t fall for the fakes.
Lee's Injury looked quite bad yesterday
He had to be carried away, and it did not look good – I doubt he will be playing today
over at TDS
the only problems with McHale are not standing up to the refs (who weren’t that kind to Houston against the Lakers) and suddenly tightening the rotation too much. I like the Rockets’ chances this year; Lowry is having a career year thus far (ok, it’s 5 games, but still :P), and there finally is a legitimate 7-footer in the paint. Losing Chuck was tough, but the team finally seems to have a direction.
It's always nice to discuss the game with fans from around the league
You may have read the Game Preview above. It was only last game our defense began to show promise, as it was much improved from the first three games in the season. We still have ways to go, but it’s nice to see the development. I remember how tough an opponent you guys were last season. Scola and Martin were tough to guard on defense and are still very tricky in their different ways, but the thing that stood out for me last year, was the defense on Blake provided by Hayes. We’ve both changed from last year, and I’m looking forward to a nice, competitve game – Lowry looks amazing in the early going!
yeah, I read it
I miss Chuck, but I let myself be persuaded that there are more positives than negatives in the new situation. I personally enjoyed following the Clippers last year; I’m looking forward to the most interesting NBA season yet.
And I hope Courtney will be alright
I’ve admired him ever since his run with Orlando in his rookie season. He’s just a guy you want on your team.
I think
running a last-second inbounds alley-oop play for a rookie in a finals game – taking the fact he was a normal SG and not a freak of nature like Griffin – is seriously badass. That makes the rookie all the more awsome.
Yeah he is awesome
I really admire his defense. Guys like Afflalo and Sefolosha reminds me of Courtney.
Kobe lit up after Lee left
It had a big impact on that game.
"Fact One: Races are won or lost in key moments. Fact Two: Success in the sport is, above all else, about enduring suffering." - Chris MacCormack
This will be a tough game
the Rockets were a good road team last year for a .500ish team (18-23) so the Clippers cannot take them lightly just because they are at home.
Also I don’t think Jordan Hill qualifies as a draft bust, he’s average 7 rebounds in 20mpg so far this season which is pretty consistent with his career averages. You left off Jonny Flynn of the 2009 busts.
As a side note the Rockets are loaded with rotation quality bigs who can play some 4 and 5. They have Patrick Patterson, Jordan Hill, Luis Scola, Dalembert and Marcus Morris (and Thabeet I guess). Goran Dragic is a free agent after the year so the Rockets look like a potential trade partners for Eric Bledsoe (though Bledsoe doesn’t seem like a Daryl Morey player).
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
our perspective
is that they’re not busts, but players who haven’t been given the time and attention they needed to blossom – we call them “assets” :P
What was with Dalembert not passing the ball out to a wide open Martin for a needed 3 late in the game.
"Who wants a free Sharpie?"
yeah, that was a wierd sequence
Also, Lowry being the second coming of Marbury and drilling three after three.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Again this obsession with post players
With Jones and Evans the need isn’t that big provided Blake and DJ are healthy. Outside of any extended injury of one of them, I just don’t see a need to use one of the Clips two tradeable assets (Bledsoe and Mo) for someone who will play 10 minutes a game. There are three playoff teams that run their offense with low post scoring a priority, the Lakers, Grizzly and the Magic. If I am dealing Bledsoe or Mo, I want a stretch 2 that plays good D and can make a decent percentage of his 3s. Just about every team we would play in the post season has at least one above average wing that will likely light us up. If we are making any deal with the Rockets I’d much rather have Courtney Lee than any of their back up post players.
A good backup 5 for us
would play 15-20 minutes a night (depending on DJ’s foul rate). That’s way more than I can see Eric Bledsoe playing with Billups, Mo and CP3 at the point.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
Busts
Busts is pre-mature of course, particularly in Hill’s case who is after starting in the NBA at this point. I’m just singling out an interesting trend, that 3 of the top 11 picks are no longer with their original team and are in Houston instead. In at least two of those cases, it’s mostly because the team that drafted them no longer had any interest in them. But we can wait and see on the bust label.
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
Flynn
Can’t believe I missed that one. Is this thing not weird? Four lottery picks from a draft a little over two years ago, and they didn’t pick a single one of them themselves?
In this world, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant. - Elwood P. Dowd
Speaking of draft choices.
I am watching Paul George playing against the Heat right now. Damn I wish we would have taken him instead of AFA. He went two places after AFA. George has really stepped his game up to the next level for the 4-1 Pacers. A legit 6’8" two guard who just hit is 8th three pointer in a row (multiple games).
"Who wants a free Sharpie?"
I think he couldn't win back in college because he's more defensive minded
It’s like Ariza trying to be the leading scorer on a team, ya know?
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Or because he went to Fresno State and had poor talent surrounding him, I was a student there when Paul was a F.S. Bulldog and we really had no talent to surround him with :/ our women’s team was good though while I was a student haha
by gdl on Jan 4, 2012 7:00 PM PST up reply actions
nice insider perspective :) thanks!
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Watching AFA as Ariza is hurt
He is playing like it is his first practice as a rookie. I see no improvement at all in his game.
"Who wants a free Sharpie?"
I won't miss him
as much as I would have missed Bledsoe. Maybe AFA can become good, but in hindsight, George would have been a better pick(could be our SG this year and put Bledsoe in CP3 trade)
Quite a few fans from TDS
believe they have the advantage on the pg position tonight. Lowry is very, very skilled and I really like his style of play – it’s gonna be a fun matchup. I believe in Chris though!
I don’t really get their prediciton on the sg position:
Billups missed the last game with a sore groin. Good thing he’s coming back for our game. Wouldn’t want him to miss that, would we?
I don’t really know if it is sarcastic, cause they do give themselves the advantage. Billups might not be as tall as Martin, but psysically he weighs 20 lb more than him – the problem is length. Again, this is gonna be an exciting matchup! Good thing is that Billups is as experienced as they come.
And then we have the frontcourt matchup, which is a lot different from last year. We all remember the outstanding defense from Chuck Hayes, but he’s a King now. I am quite afraid of Scola, but I bet they feel the same way about Blake.
I like Lowry alot, but I’ll take Paul.
I’ve got the Clippers winning tonight (just making it official)
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 9:53 AM PST up reply actions
Your'e 2-2 so far - I'm keeping track
With that said, I’ll take the Clips tongiht too
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
martin is a taller, quicker, 3 point shooter
this is going to be a nightmare for billups. He can’t contest his shots well enough straight up so is going to have to stay attached to his hip around every screen. With a sore groin and being older I don’t see this happening. I would much rather start foye like last game, where we seemed a lot better defensively and he did a good job on the athletic wes matthews. Foye isn’t great but at least he provides better defense in a starting lineup that already has enough offensive firepower. Billups and Mo can dominate any bench backcourt and probably give most teams fits with a constant offensive attack.
wine um, dine um, 69 um
by flightofthegriffin on Jan 4, 2012 1:40 PM PST up reply actions
Without Chuck Hayes
Blake is going to have a big night.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Key for Blake is to not give it back to Scola on the other end
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Indeed... I don't know how well he'll do that. Scola is crafty and floppy.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Some say Blake is floppy
perhaps their floppiness will negate one another.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Blake has been floppy
I’m really wary that Blake has resorted to flopping so early in his career. He should be working on moving his feet and learning how to play strong post defense.
I also hate how the refs are so dumb when it comes to flopping. How can the league not see that the way the refs regularly fall for flopping calls hurts the game?
I really do wish they'd start calling techs or fining guys for that stuff
When you see it after the game on replays… fine the dude $1,000. Especially for ones like this one.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Funny, I don't mind it at all
It works and smart players take advantage. Many times when they flop it is just to accentuate the fact that they beat the opponent to the spot. Query whether they would get some of the calls they get – which are correct calls – without flopping.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
But it's just... dishonorable, isn't it?
They are tricking the refs when they do it. Just think back to the JJ Barrea flop on Baron that one game. He fully admitted afterward that he “let himself fall” to get the call. He was laughing after the call was made too!
Think about if you ever play pick up ball. How do you think it would go down if a guy was flopping and it actually resulted in him getting the ball back when he did it? With minimal downside and a high upside, it’s the smart play, but so are a lot of dirty plays. Cheating in itself is a smart play (esp. with minimal penalties) because it increases your odds of winning. It’s like how Doc Rivers said he teaches his guys to always move on screens because they will only be called for moving screens once every 10 or so times. That’s a terrible lesson for any students of the game! And the fact that it may actually help the Celtics win games isn’t a knock on Doc Rivers, it’s a knock on the NBA for not locking down on this sort of thing.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
by Erik O on Jan 4, 2012 11:33 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
+arbitrarynumber
"Energizing the process, or turning it upside-down, fans now participate, writing blogs and posting comments and videos [...] the dialogue is to discourse what road rage is to driving." -Mark Heisler
This is professional basketball, not pickup basketball
This is a business for the players. It isn’t based on what opposing players might think about you if you tried to take advantage. Completely different set of rules.
Professional players try to trick the refs all the time. It is something that is a part of the game. Grabbing, locking elbows, slight touch on elbow throwing shots off. NBA players are extreme competitors. They will do whatever it takes to win. Whatever it takes. You’re kidding yourself if you think there is honor in not trying to do whatever you can to win.
For example, if the referee makes a call as to whose ball it is, and you know the call is wrong, do you tell the ref? That would be the honorable thing to do, no? But if you do that as a professional, your entire team would disown you. One reason is that it is assumed that this is the way the game is played by both teams.
Among professional basketball players, the honor is in winning.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
Yeah but...
It is not a good part of the game, just because it happens does not make it right. Also Erik O I never saw that video and it was epic.
I just think it shouldn't be part of the game, that's all
I wish professional basketball would be more like pickup basketball. I definitely understand everything’s different. It’s the same with all sports.
You must remember, I’m talking about a fantasy world here, where flops don’t happen, guys don’t care about contracts or money or what city they live in, and where referees always make the right calls. I don’t expect any of this from the NBA, I just wish it all.
Speaking of your example, have you seen that commercial where it’s the final possession of a championship game and it goes out of bounds, and the player knows it was off him but they called it the other way? The kid tells his coach, “It was off me,” and the coach nods. Then the kid tells the ref and they presumably lose (they were down 1). And it’s like, “HONESTY, pass it around,” or something cheesy like that. When I was like… 10 or so, I did something very similar in a game playing for my church team and my coach got sooooo pissed at me. He was yelling at me and stuff and I probably cried. The next practice, he apologized to me and said my mom came and talked to him. This uber-honesty world could never exist, and I agree completely it’s just about it being equal for both sides.
I think the difference between flopping and your example is that flopping is a honed skill. Guys are learning how to deceive refs. This isn’t accidentally getting the call to go your way (which is mostly random, and thus equal for all parties), it’s practicing a skill that helps you trick the game in your favor. All of that jersey grabbing and arm locking and elbow-touching isn’t that far from what we know to be “incidental contact,” so guys toe the line and hope for the best. But flopping is worlds away from anything actually basketball-related. Guys aren’t toeing any lines, they are just being sneaky. You saw how in that link I posted, Baron created a foul on Okur during a dead ball situation, right? That’s not part of basketball.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Wanted to add
Because flopping is a learned skill, players have to get better at it so they can keep up with the likes of Fisher and Ginobili. You shouldn’t have to learn how to do something that’s not related to basketball playing, in the professional sport of basketball. At this rate, it’s going to be taught at the basketball camps to 8-year-olds. That can never happen. Do you see how it’s different than the example you used?
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Yes I understand
Good point. Of course they still have to get into position to take a charge. Beat the offensive player to the spot. The flop just confirms it.
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
by Jax on Jan 4, 2012 9:55 PM PST up reply actions
Yea there's a little bit of grey area there
I don’t hate those kinds of “flops” since they are more just trying to get the ref’s attention. For example, if a guy plants himself, gets in position, keeps his feet square, gets hit in the chest, but DOESN’T fall and just stumbles back, oftentimes there will be a no-call. This is bad refereeing since this is just a “flop” away from a charging call. So in a way, the refs are perpetuating the flopping, and requiring the players to learn the skill. But I think with these, the refs are looking at their feet first and THEN seeing if the hit was hard enough to bowl them over. This seems much more fair. (Once in a game, I took a charge like that, without flopping, and the ref actually called the charge… I was so happy and even talked to him after the game about how impressed I was.)
The flopping I’m really hating on is the fake ass ones where a dude makes it look like he got punched in the face despite being 3 feet away from the other guy.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Those some are right
But I think Blake gets hammered so much with no fouls called, it evens itself out.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
(might be a little biased... heheheh)
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
eric you're right! blake gets hammered so much it's unbelievable! I believe that the refs have it in for him for what he did to them last year... and what it looks like he's beginning to do this year as well. blake needs to leave those refs alone!
brijo1
by ThaFoX on Jan 4, 2012 11:53 AM PST via Android app up reply actions
Yea he gives them that mean look every time...
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
I'd like to see them both flop on the same play with no contact ;-)
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
They should both line up for the jump ball and flop
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
The best part of that is Hubie Brown explaining what happened...
Instead of just saying, “Double Floppers! That’s right, reward the big man!”
The Chris Paul clip on that same page is even more hilarious
Maybe he should mock Blake to get him to stop.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Some observations from the Rockets-Lakers game
I really like Lowry as well. But last night he seemed to be the only one who really wanted the win. Everyone else was playing well but not with any urgency. That’s why they lost (that and they don’t have the star power to combat big nights from Kobe and Bynum).
My concern is that the Rockets seem to be a very good perimeter shooting team. Everyone, from Lowry to Martin to Budinger to Scola can drill it from outside. They are also efficient and execute well. And the way the Clips have been giving up wide open looks, it could get ugly.
On the flip side, the Rockets have very few players who can create for themselves. Lowry can but he’s not great at it and that’s about it. As mentioned above, Martin simply doesn’t have the tools to take advantage of shorter players beyond a catch and shoot over them. Several times last night the Rockets forced a switch that resulted in Fisher guarding Martin and Martin didn’t even consider taking advantage of it. If the defense can just rotate well (a HUGE if), then this is one game where our short combo guards won’t necessarily hurt us.
The Rockets seem to be a team that plays smart and executes well. So if their opponent plays dumb and gives them open looks, they’ll be effective. But if the opponent’s stars pour it on like the Lakers did last night, the Rockets don’t have the personnel to counter that.
Marc Stein reporting 76ers sending Speights to the Grizzlies
for (2) 2nd round draft choices. Hornets also just got Xavier Henry.
"Who wants a free Sharpie?"
Good pick up by Memphis
sending away surplus for a useful big man still on a rookie contract. Speights doesn’t play D but he can score.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Yes, absolutely
We need bigs on the cheap, he’s comparable (one trick ponies as far as measurable NBA skill) to Evans but better than Jones.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Do we even have a second round pick to give them, let alone two?
I’m not sure PHI would give him to LAC if the Clippers had to defer out the draft pick into the future when this deal was available now.
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 4:14 PM PST up reply actions
Clips have to have some
The picked up some from the CP3 trade
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
Even so, that doesn’t exactly beat the deal PHI got since I assume those picks are in more recent drafts.
Would you have traded Bledsoe for Speights (assume a third team got involved to provide the draft picks to PHI) ?
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 4:20 PM PST up reply actions
No
I’m not even very high on Bledsoe but Speights is just so so big in the last year of his rookie deal (he becomes a RFA this summer). I’d rather see if the Rockets would trade one of their many young bigs on rookie deals (Morris, Hill, Patterson). Heck I’d consider Thabeet if we could package Gomes in the deal.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
Hmm
tough to say, I was really just looking for ways to dump Gomes and his 4 million next year. A Foye for Thabeet swap could also work (have the Rockets add some cash or 2nd round pick to make up for the difference)
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
do rockets want/need a lil chucker SG
They have Martin and Lee, and Houston is always enamored of effecient players. Foye isn’t too efficient, as far as I know.
Understatement of the year
Foye isn’t too efficient, as far as I know.
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
Last night when he was dominating the scrubs
All I could think about was how when Foye scores 11 in a quarter, he doesn’t play any differently than when he scores 5 points on like 20 shots. The only difference is that the shots go in, but he’s always going to take these same shots. So even when he was making the shots, the shot selection was still infuriating! I don’t get how this doesn’t make VDN want to bench him. I have zero coaching experience (for players over 13 years old anyway) and this is clear as crystal to me.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Yup
Though he does play a little differently, in that it gives him confidence to jack up some stuff that’s even more ridiculous than usual. After he hit the 3 in a row last night, he took one that was beyond the pail even for a heat check, a shot so ludicrous that any self-respecting coach should’ve benched him for immediately just on principle.
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
Yeah I very distinctly remember that shot...
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Sure, I love when we’re able to trade players we don’t want for players we do want. Never works out that way though.
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 4:38 PM PST up reply actions
well
the steal of the trade is 2nd round picks for speights. If you recall, the Clippers traded 2nd round picks for players like Alex Acker once upon a time. If a team desired a backup SF, I see no reason why they wouldn’t be willing to part with a future 2nd rounder(top 50 protected, maybe) for Gomes, who is still seen as serviceble by some people around the league(I think, don’t talk to nba gms that often), Foye on the other hand is still an asset IMO, esp as an expiring contract. I would need too look at teams rosters, but I don’t doubt that we could find places for them around the league if we wanted to. Detroit for gomes comes to mind, and maybe Cleveland for Foye?
then why didn't we offer this weeks ago?
as soon as Kaman left, this become a problem that anyone looking could see
How many picks in the second round do you think we have? Or are we giving up the Henry equivalent (Bledsoe I guess) and getting a third team involved?
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 4:15 PM PST up reply actions
Looking at it
I didn’t realize that we were THAT second round deficient in the coming years. According to realgm, we don’t have one until 2017, so now that makes sense.
correction
looking deeper, we have memphis’ 2nd in 2015, and new orleans’ 2nd in that same year. I would have been willing to part with those for Speights.
BTW
usefful website to keep in the back pocket: http://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/detailed
How recent are the ones that Philly ended up getting?
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
I don't know
but looking at the website i put above, they only have a 2016 from toronto and their own 2014. (2012 to Miami or Phili, 2013 to Lakers, 2015 to Clips, 2016 to mavs)
VDN, please start randy foye!
and bring Chauncey Billups and Mo off the bench to give our second unit some firepower.
by cantthinkofagoodname on Jan 4, 2012 10:37 AM PST reply actions
Not gonna happen
"[Fans are] not technically a lot of times savvy. They don't understand and they don't weigh issues the way that [I] weigh them."
Mike Dunleavy, Sr.
but why would you have 2 better players coming off the bench for that 1 position! firepower needs to start to begin with. but I think I understand what you're trying to say! just not randy foyer.
brijo1
by ThaFoX on Jan 4, 2012 11:57 AM PST via Android app up reply actions
comment was too can't think! and I meant foye
brijo1
by ThaFoX on Jan 4, 2012 11:59 AM PST via Android app up reply actions
If you look at the matchups, Kevin Martin is gonna get a ton of points. Not only is he taller, he’s also quicker. He can blow by billips in 2 dribbles and leave our defense scrambling to recover.
it’s like starting Quinton Ross over Corey Maggette…. And yes I know foye isn’t nearly the defender that QRoss was (not even in the same class), I think he would probably do a better job of keeping martin in front of him, and Foye’s outside shot is a bonus to keep the defense honest (something QRoss never had).
Also, Billips coming off the bench would have the advantage of feasting on tiredness of the opposing teams starters or their 2nd unit inferior guards.
by cantthinkofagoodname on Jan 4, 2012 12:11 PM PST up reply actions
Nah, we need to get our starting five some minutes together. That is the most important thing. This is one of those weird cases where each of our players at the starting five are better than their starting five, because our best players match up at positions with their (less) best players.
CP3 > Lowry (I like Lowry and all and he is their best player, but he is no CP3. We have the best point guard in the league and I think it’s ok to admit it).
Billups > Martin (who would you want, finals MVP and future hall of famer or black hole)?
Butler > Budinger (Caron gets no love, but in think he casual fans would choose him over Chase).
Blake > Scola (I really like Scola’s game, but not Chuck Hayes means Blake is about to go completely apeshit on Houston. They just don’t have the man power to stop him now).
DeAndre > Hill (Why are they starting Hill instead of Dalembert? Hopefully we get the new improved DeAndre that doesn’t jump on pump fakes and always boxes out).
We look good on paper. As long as we don’t have a letdown we should be fine. Hopefully we don’t look past this game and it ends up being a trap game.
Martin
Martin wins that match up for sure. Chauncey is not quick enough or tall enough to guard him effectively. We give up a ton in that particular match up.
I'm comfortable with madglove's scouting report above
Several times last night the Rockets forced a switch that resulted in Fisher guarding Martin and Martin didn’t even consider taking advantage of it. If the defense can just rotate well (a HUGE if), then this is one game where our short combo guards won’t necessarily hurt us.
by Michael White on Jan 4, 2012 2:15 PM PST up reply actions
-1 for the uninformed comment
Neither guy is a chucker, and both are in roles where they are supposed to take a good number of shots.
I really don’t get all the knee-jerk Chauncey hate. Yes, he had a bad game against the Spurs. But the entire team looked bad, the offense was pretty stagnant, and a lot of times Chauncey had no choice but to force up a bad shot. In the GS game — which I was at, in the 4th row, and didn’t miss a second of game action — he was pretty much just taking open looks in the flow of the offense, which is his job. He’s been a good shooter throughout his career, and if he shoots the way he has historically we’ll all be very, very happy by season’s end.
Proudly enduring the pain since the days of Bill Walton's foot.
Now living the good life in Lob City, CA.
by boltsfan21 on Jan 4, 2012 2:39 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
+1 Both Martin and Billups are similarly efficient
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Martin has a good first step
and can get to the basket. He won’t post up Billups but he can drive by him.
Help us Altered Beast you're our only hope.
agree 100%
starting foye has advantages defensively. We have enough offensive weapons in the starting lineup and this would be a tough matchup for an injured billups.
wine um, dine um, 69 um
by flightofthegriffin on Jan 4, 2012 1:45 PM PST up reply actions
It seems like Foye plays with more confidence when he starts for some reason.
He had his best games last yr when Gordon was hurt.
Wow, just saw Z-Bo with MCL tear
out up to 8 weeks.
Remembers when you could buy a nosebleed ticket at the Sports Arena and end up courtside.
Whatttt
This accelerated season is dangerous man.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden
Compressed schedule
SP’s note on the anomaly of the Clippers weird spin on the compressed schedule got me thinking. Now that we’ve seen 4 games we know that the Clips have a lot of nice pieces and good things going for them, but they have a TON of work to do to be the team many expected or hoped that they would be. Teams with continuity and consistency like the Bulls and especially the Spurs made them look bad.
The schedule as it stands couldn’t be better for the Clippers. Not only do they get a lot of off days (which equal practice days), they are also at home. Basically, they get to practice an inordinate amount at home in this first part of the season. This is exactly what this team needs right now.
We all know that the schedule giveth and it taketh away. The Clips will pay later, with lots of road games and “compression” that we can’t even imagine right now. With Paul and Griffin and Billups as team leaders, the Clips will be making the most of this early practice time, I’m sure. In every interview Paul seems to mention that it’s going to take time for the team to get to know itself, its tendencies and strengths and how to play and how to compensate for its weaknesses. If the Clips practice and play hard through these generous first few weeks, they might be sufficiently advanced to weather the onslaught of “compression” and the road.
The way things are now seems to be a nice break in their favor.
The Lee Injury
looked similar to the one that Jonas Valanciunas suffered to his calf three or four months ago. He was sidelined for about a month but I think there were other circumstances involved that lengthened his stay on the sidelines.
I expect Lee will be back within two to three weeks at the most.
We shall see
Speights
if Speights was to be had for only 2 second rounders, shouldn’t we have jumped on that? I mean, I know he’s no great defender, but quite frankly if Solomon Jones could play defense he wouldn’t have been available to us.
byron Mullens
went for just one second rounder, albeit from a rebuilding bobcats team (ie. more than likely a high 2nd round pick)
He’s actually been playing pretty well, although it might be due to getting minutes on a bad team (starting center is Boris Diaw). But he’s a legit 7 footer, and has 16/5 against the knicks, in what’s looking like it might be a win on the road.
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