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Raptors 80 - Clippers 77

At some point, you stop analyzing why the Clippers are losing and instead you just feel sorry for them.  After this game, I think I'm there.  And maybe you look for some nice effort here or there, in an 'everybody wins', 'Special Olympics' sort of way.  Because, I don't know if you noticed, but the Clippers third best player right now is a guy who wasn't in the NBA a week ago, and got his first NBA start tonight.

For tonight's game, the Clippers played without their franchise player, their highest draft pick of the last 10 years, their prize free agent signee from 3 summers ago, and their undisputed leader.  These four players would be their starting power forward, point guard and shooting guard and their backup point guard, under normal circumstances.  So yeah, I'm starting to feel sorry for them.

Here are the players I feel particularly sorry for right now:

Chris Kaman - He's been an absolute revelation this season, but he's not in fact cut out to be a first option on offense.  Not a lot of people are.  And it sure doesn't help matters that he very rarely has any shooters to pass to.  He'd be so good as a second or third option, allowed to work off the ball a little.  Right now he's in a sort of NBA hell - demanding instant and constant double teams (since he's clearly the Clippers best option, and hey, why not double, what's the alternative, stay home on Brevin Knight?) but not getting any respect from the officials.  It's a tough place to be.  Let's hope he doesn't get ground down by the situation.  Already these last couple of games (6 for 19 and 5 for 15) have felt like maybe Chris is hitting a wall on offense.

Josh Powell - OK, sure, this season should be his best chance to show what he can do.  But it's tough being a 12th guy.  You want so badly to get in the game, but then you get in and you look like you haven't played in an NBA game in 8 months, because, you know, you haven't.  And no, hoisting 20 footers is probably not the best way to respond to the situation, but he was not particularly worse offensively than anyone else on the team in the second half.  So far, he's not looking like the 'diamond in the rough' signing we were hoping for.

Corey Maggette - Yeah, he's getting his 20 points per game as the Clippers only scoring threat other than Kaman.  But the current situation where the team goes into a collective slump and simply can't score tends to bring out the worst in Corey.  He gets a case of what the Sports Guy calls Hero Complex and tries to do way too much.  I usually know whether Corey is going to get a good shot within a split second of when he touches the ball.  Either he gets the ball in a good place, with an advantage on the defender, or he doesn't.  If he doesn't, nothing good is going to happen.  He should just give it to someone else.  Instead, he tries to make something happen, invariably with the result of a missed shot that never had a chance, or a turnover, usually a charge.

Al Thornton - It's all just part of the NBA learning curve, but Al also has a touch of Hero Complex.  Of course, someone has to take these shots.  The NBA encourages (nay compels) teams to shoot the ball with 24 seconds - it's like a rule or something.  It seemed like the majority of the third quarter possessions in this game ended in forced shots late in the clock.  Throwing the ball to a rookie with 3 seconds on the clock and then yelling 'shoot, shoot!' is just cruel.

Tim Thomas - He never told anyone that he wanted to defend Chris Bosh.  Clearly he doesn't want to defend Chris Bosh.  Ever.  Why put him in that situation?  It's really not fair.

Toronto was completely uninspiring in this game.  Their defense in the first half was so lax that the Generic Clippers shot 51%.  Of course, as is often the case, all they had to do was dial their defensive intensity up to 'mildly interested' for the Clippers to wilt.  They held the Clippers to 11 points in the third quarter and 17 in the fourth.  And they STILL only won by three.  

But Richie Frahm had a nice game in his first NBA start.  Way to go Richie!  And Chris Kaman did a good job on the boards and had three blocked shots.  Great job, Chris!  Way to hustle even when the shots aren't falling!  And Josh Powell earned an extra possession by diving out of bounds.  Great hustle Josh!  I knew you could do it!   You're all winners!  Hey, the important thing is you tried your hardest!

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LOL AYSO Coach post
Maybe the Clips should go with the everyone plays 2 quarters rotation.

I'll bring the oranges if you bring the Capri Sun.

by John R on Dec 19, 2007 9:07 AM PST   0 recs

Hilarious
Would love to see a more in-depth analysis of how to handle the Clipper situation from the AYSO coach perspective.  Funny, refreshing, and a great way to approach an unfortunate set of circumstances.

by zhivclip on Dec 19, 2007 10:57 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

If its AYSO and your team is bad
Not much you can do.  Schedule more pizza parties?

Which isn't far off from what a capped-out NBA team can do, really.

by John R on Dec 19, 2007 1:34 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

LOL
good one...are we keeping score?  don't forget to run under the human tunnel, while we cheer..."yeay! Timmy! way to get 2 rebounds!"

by Lawler's Law on Dec 19, 2007 1:36 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Noone should take any of this
As making fun of AYSO soccer.  It IS a great organization and was a big part of my formative years as I played basically year round from your kids' ages until I was about 12.  Then I moved on to club soccer (CRSC Brigade) in CYSA South which is also well run, if expensive and Competitive.

I just found humor in the proximity of a football update with an oh-so-supportive take on the Raptors loss.

by John R on Dec 19, 2007 1:54 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Good Note
Good point--don't mean to make fun of AYSO.  Clippers, on the other hand, about all we can do at this point is find different ways to amuse ourselves.

by zhivclip on Dec 19, 2007 3:00 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

I have a child
in AYSO, so I am only making fun of the Clippers...They just won the "Biggest Loser of the Day" contest on AM570.

by Lawler's Law on Dec 19, 2007 3:09 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Worse than the Bulls?
They are healthy and got blown out at home.

The decimated Clippers almost knicked a healthy playoff team.  Lakers fans are dumb.

by John R on Dec 19, 2007 3:13 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Not enough talent
It is simple.  The NBA is a players league.  Unlike other leagues, the team/teams with the best players either win or contend for championships.  Without fail.

Whether it is Magic, Larry, Michael, Hakeem, Duncan, Wade or LeBron, the teamw with the best players do the best.

The Clippers, even when healthy, fall slightly short of this.  Without EB, forget it.  Maggette is not a playmaker.  His success is contingent on so many variables, including the mood of the guys in stripes.  That is not a good place to be.  

And as far as Kaman goes, even Tim Duncan would struggle offensively if he had NOBODY to kick it out to when he is doubled.  

2005-2006's success came down to EB being one of the best players that year, and Sam being a playmaker who could hit big shots.  The Clippers have not had that two man combo healthy since then.

As for me, I sure prefer when the Clips win, but all I really ask for and can expect is a good effort.  Because as any longtime Clipper fan knows, that may be all you get.

by mp on Dec 19, 2007 9:22 AM PST   0 recs

Some Observations
--Strange mix.  Pretty good first half (51% fg), and just about as ugly as it gets in the second half.

--Richie Frahm.  Great start, solid finish.  Not sure what happened to him at the start of the 3rd quarter, when it would have been helpful for him to get a few shots and hit them.  But it may be that Toronto realized that somebody should guard him.

Frahm's presence on the court and in the starting lineup raises a few questions.  With Calderon seeming pretty dangerous and MD not quite ready to make Dickau the starting PG, at least MD recognizes that he can't start Knight and Ross together.  This is a pretty big problem.  And it should be noted that starting Frahm worked out pretty well.  

It seems like a logic game, and the weird part is that it starts from a negative proposition:  it seems like MD would prefer to play Knight-Ross, but he knows it won't work.  So you end up with Knight-Frahm and Dickau-Ross.  It's only after 20 minutes with a total of 7 baskets in the second half that he goes to Dickau-Frahm.  Just an observation, and of course Calderon hit a big basket driving on Dickau.

With the Frahm necessity/experiment off to a quick start, MD played him until deep in the 2nd period (maybe he thought he was Mobley).  By not taking Frahm out earlier, he wasn't going to go back to him in the latter half of the second period.  I'm trying to keep in mind the fact that we're talking about Richie Frahm her, but he seemed to be a guy who could actually hit a shot.

That gets us to the other rotation.  Thomas/Maggette go out, and Davis/Thornton come in.  You know I want to see Davis get minutes instead of Thomas, although Davis has looked horrible 80% of the time he has been playing, so even I am losing faith.  But I don't think it's helping that he comes in with Thornton and Maggette goes to the bench.  I'm not exactly excited about Thornton's recent play either.  I know he needs to play and he's going to make mistakes, but in the past couple of games he doesn't even look like he has the potential to be any good.  He's obviously athletic and energetic, but his shot seems pretty funky and he's not producing.  Oh well.  At any rate, should both these guys, who are iffy propositions, be coming in at the same time?  Can't you take out Thomas and go with Kaman-Davis-Maggette for a couple minutes, then bring in Thornton, and then bring back Thomas and give Kaman his 2 minute rest?  Part of the problem is that Kaman-Davis-Thornton puts extra scoring pressure on Kaman, which he doesn't need at this point.

And then, in the 2nd half, all of these factors leads to classic Clipper comedy in the performance of Josh Powell.  It's actually refreshing, because when you see Powell on the court it shows just how bad and beat-up the Clippers are at this point, and it's like he's a throwback to the old days of the Clipper Follies.  Powell's energetic and thoroughly hapless minutes were old school Clipper funk.  As he kept tipping the ball or getting his hands on it but never quite grabbing it, Ralph commented that he did that a lot during the preseason, he would get his hands on a lot of balls but not really come up with them.  Like so many other things this year, it makes you appreciate Kaman and his ability to grab actual rebounds.

And so, for the second game in a row, somehow when the game was tight in the fourth quarter, MD decides that now is the time to throw deerlike Josh Powell out in front of the headlights.  I have to mention that I take back everything I ever said about the Clips not needing Aron Williams on the team, although it's pretty amazing that he's injured too.  What happened to him--how did he hurt his wrist?  Not having Williams available was a pretty significant problem last night.

MD also doesn't seem to realize that he can play Thomas at SF and Maggette at SG.  Rather than Davis/Thornton/Ross, it is at least theoretically possible to play Davis/Thomas/Thornton/Maggette.  What I'm trying to say is that there are definitely options, and it's not absolutely necessary for Josh Powell to play his first significant minutes of the season in the 4th quarter of games that the Clippers have a chance to win.

At any rate, Maggette and Kaman were both subpar and then some in the 2nd half last night.  As good as Kaman has been, Maggette keeps failing to take advantage of his opportunity to step up and play his best basketball.  As we now have new Kaman and old Kaman, there's good Corey and bad Corey, and new Kaman is wearing down and pressing while playing alongside bad Corey for too many stretches.  Last night Maggette looked very little like the corporal trying to hold the fort until EB gets back, and much more like the guy who can't wait to get away from Dunleavy.  With all of the injuries (crucial Aron Williams injury!) none of this is surprising.  

Welcome back, Follies.        

by zhivclip on Dec 19, 2007 3:50 PM PST   0 recs

Corey's best basketball is not as first option
Corey can't step up, particularly with this cast of characters and the subpar coaching.  He's not a no. 1 option, never has been, and never will be.  He needs some help to shine.    

by Jax on Dec 20, 2007 12:46 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Welcome to John Rsville
Circa The Maggette-festo.

"Its that volitility that indicates, to me at least, that he can't be the focal point of a winning team."

And later.

"I'd rather have him out of EB's way in the first place and give those touches back to the Horse with a sprinkle to Cassell, Mobley and Kaman."

This year its not that he needs to get out of an individual's way, but he needs to get with the offense.  The team needs him to operate within the team concept.  They have few advantages as five individuals, so they have to play together.  When I see Corey fake a pass and then make that pass anyway instead of just passing, or when I see Corey run down to post up and Dickau wave him off because that clearly wasn't the play that was called, it raises questions for me.

He also needs to hit an open jumper.  I believe we already agreed the team needs shooters.  Besides that, he needs to stop settling for them.  63% of his shots are jumpers, which he is hitting at an eFG% of only .378  The Clippers need the first number way down and the second way up.

Unfortunately, he is an incomplete basketball player, despite often being the strongest AND fastest player on the court.

My main beef with Corey remains that he isn't a #1 option, except in his head.  That hasn't changed this season, his production level or his mental game.

None of this is the coach's fault.

by John R on Dec 20, 2007 9:44 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

And so
So the question/issue seems to be how does Maggette coexist with new Kaman.

I'm disappointed that Maggette hasn't played better, but I'm not really surprised, and I guess those are my credentials for entering JohnRsville.

I thought he had not only a surprising and unlikely opportunity, but also abundant motivation, to raise his game to its highest level.

But it turns out that like many players, he plays better on a better team.  I'm assuming that Maggette would be playing better if Cassell and Mobley weren't hurt.  I can't think that having Tim Thomas as a 35 mpg player is a good thing for Corey.  There's a certain discipline that comes with being on the court with guys who can make plays.

But the big thing is that all of this is costing Maggette money.  He had the opportunity to take a lot of the money carved out for Livingston off the table, or to impress other teams that he would be worth them making some moves to get him and give him a fat deal.  Now it's very hard to tell what's out there for him, and where he would fit and improve his situation.

So it's a bizarre season even by Clipper standards.  The second half, after Brand comes back, is going to be very weird when compared to this first half struggle.

by zhivclip on Dec 20, 2007 10:23 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

A challenge
But it turns out that like many players, he plays better on a better team.

That is the sort of statement I'd like to see backed up.  If you can show that, you have hit on a crux of the problem.  If this is shown not to be true, that play isn't affected by team, then we have run out of reasons to shift the situation.

by John R on Dec 20, 2007 11:43 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Ill start
Courtesy the world-wide leader:
 YR      TM  G   GS MIN      FG        FG%   3P        3P%   FT      FT% STL BLK  TO PF OFF DEF TOT AST PTS
06-07 Lac 75 31 30.6 4.9-10.8 .454 0.2-0.9 .200 6.9-8.4 .820 0.9  0.2  2.7 3.3 1.2  4.7  5.9  2.8 16.9
07-08 Lac 20 19 34.9 6.2-13.9 .446 0.9-2.5 .347 7.6-9.3 .822 1.1  0.1  3.1 3.2 1.5  5.2  6.7  2.6 20.9

The story so far...

Min up (good), shots up (expected), FG% flat (good), 3P and 3P% up (great!), FT up (expected), STL/BLK/TO/PF flat given minutes and randomness, REB up slightly (good), AST flat-to-down (bad), PTS up as a result of the other things.

To me, this paints a picture of a guy who is playing basically the same as last year and is getting more minutes and touches.

One man does not make a study, but as a former buzzsaw coach might say, he is who I thought he was.

by John R on Dec 20, 2007 11:54 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

It's not the selection, it's the eFG%
John - 63% sounds like a lot, but it's actually pretty low for a small forward.  LeBron James takes 61% jump shots.  Ron Artest takes 70%.  And those are the only SF's in the league stronger than Corey - I didn't look up any others because they'll all be significantly higher.  It's also worth noting that only Aaron Williams, Josh Powell and Chris Kaman take fewer jump shots of players on the Clippers right now.  Tim Thomas takes 88% (not surprising, yet somehow still surprising).    Dwyane Wade, similarly best when he gets to the basket, is taking 65% jumpers, and hitting a lower eFG% on them than Corey.  Everyone settles for the jumper - it's what the defense gives you, and frequently you have to take it.

The .378 is what's disconcerting.  I really thought he was hitting a better percentage than that this season.  He was at .379 for the season last year.  Damn.

But all of this assumes there's an answer.  With so little offensive firepower on the floor for the Clippers (they had to start RICHIE FRAHM for the love of the FSM), defenses are absolutely loaded up to stop Kaman and Maggette...  and what exactly are they supposed to do?  Kick it to Brevin Knight?  Yes, Corey breaks off plays.  But although the plays might work fine in the first half (remember that layup to start the game against the Raptors), without players who are scoring threats, the plays just aren't that effective when the defense steps it up.  I'm not advocating free lancing - I'm back to AYSO coach, way to go, nice try.  The teams LA has been putting on the floor just have very little hope to win a game.  In AYSO, if your best player quits, you're going to lose every game.  It's not as much fun for the rest of the team in that situation, but at least they're still out there getting some exercise and trying.  

NBA sets are effective when they give the defense a difficult choice - do I go over the top of the pick and roll (potentially opening up the drive) or under it (leaving the jump shooter open for a second)?  Do I double the post (leaving a three point shooter open) or do I leave the defender one-on-one?  These choices are not difficult when playing the Clippers right now.  If Maggette is running pick and roll, EVERYTHING works defensively - show and draw a charge or go under and let him shoot - who cares?  As for the post, double all day long.  

After the game we're going to Straw Hat for a pizza party.  I think we have enough money in the goal can that everyone can play video games.

by ClipperSteve on Dec 20, 2007 11:45 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

We are on the same page
He's not out of line doing it.  I'm just questioning its effectiveness given his individual skill-set.

There is another option in that pick and roll scenario.  The defense does need to deal with a Kaman/Maggette two-man game.  As easy as the scouting for that is, it is still inherently disruptive.  So how often to we see the ball pop out of that and quickly rotate around for a weak-side jumper?  That, I do have beef with.

Thomas and Frahm and Mobley and yes even Ross are there.

What would San Antonio do?

by John R on Dec 20, 2007 12:10 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

MDJr. update
Not that anyone asked.

            G GS MIN   FGM-A  FG% 3PM-A 3P% FTM-A FT% OFF DEF TOT STL BLK TO  PF   AST PTS
Season 25 25 33.4 156-320 .488 39-92 .424 84-98 .857   1.0  4.8  5.7 .96  .24 1.80 2.36 3.2 17.4

by John R on Dec 19, 2007 4:48 PM PST   0 recs

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